Ep. 17: As He Sees It with Rabbi Aharon Blesofsky

00:00 Speaker 1 This week, the world lost a Hasid and a true friend to many, Reb Ari. Reb Aron ben Reb Schneur Zalman HaKohen alav hashalom Dosovsky. Over the years, I myself have spent countless hours fabrengen, listening and talking to Reb Ari Dosovsky. A number of months ago, when the, the Her podcast Among Hasidim was launched, the first interview that I conducted was with Reb Ari, and for technical-- due to technical reasons, it was not released. And on Thursday of last week, it was decided that we were going to release recording with Reb Ari this Sunday, and unfortunately, on Shabbos, he passed away. This is the first interview that I conducted, and therefore, the style of my interviews have changed since then as I've learnt different, uh, things on, on how to conduct interviews. And I hope that it should be «l'ilun uleshmasai» and to the enjoyment and benefit of many. Due to Ari's state of health at the time, his talking may sound a little unclear, but if you listen in, you'll get the style, and it is definitely worth it since there's, there's so much content, and it is always a pleasure to hear Reb Ari's candid, real way of talk, and it should be a «kitvei v'ranam l'sheilnei afar», «uhu b'seicham», «imhei d'viyaminu amash.» I'm Yossi Kamen. Welcome to Among Hasidim by Der Her, an ongoing fabrengen about life as a Hasid, our vibrant connection with the Rebbe, and inspired living shaped by the way he teaches us each and every day. Okay, so I

02:09 Speaker 1 met you by the oil yesterday. It's your, uh, it's your birthday, right?

02:12 Speaker 2 I met you by your bris, but go ahead.

02:14 Speaker 1 Yeah. Uh, but, uh, not everyone your age sits by the oil the whole day, uh, on their birthday.

02:21 Speaker 2 Most people walk around, yeah.

02:22 Speaker 1 They walk around the oil?

02:23 Speaker 2 They can't walk. Although they keep walking around, schmoozing.

02:28 Speaker 1 But that, that you've always done. You've always sat by fabrengen-

02:31 Speaker 2 I was always-- Yeah, yeah.

02:33 Speaker 1 The, uh, the «sicha» from the Foter Fest that he said, "Ein zach," he never left the fabrengen before it's over. So I think they could say the same thing about you, no?

02:44 Speaker 2 Almost.

02:46 Speaker 1 Almost.

02:47 Speaker 2 I, I have a very weak bladder.

02:52 Speaker 1 Yeah, that-- But that, that's not good for staying by fabrengen.

02:56 Speaker 2 The Rebbe made a shvil, of course, that. You know that, yeah. You know the story of the shvil?

03:01 Speaker 1 By the fabrengen.

03:03 Speaker 2 That it wasn't wide enough, and the Rebbe apparently gave a hidur to either Rabbi Karp, Leibel, or directly to Zalman. That it "Kh'zot shpilt zhe zhe zein. Mizel takene geyn."

03:16 Speaker 1 So the Rebbe wanted that shvil in front of him.

03:18 Speaker 2 Should be, should be in front of him. Ha- Should be at the best spot. But it-- they didn't wanna make it there. They didn't wanna make it walk out of kaved to the Rebbe. The Rebbe, the Rebbe was worried more about these old guys getting their pants wet than his kaved. You have to, you have to understand the chidush of the story. I mem- I remember every step of it.

03:41 Speaker 1 So the chidush is that the Rebbe-

03:44 Speaker 2 The Rebbe saw people going, middle of a sicha, going over benches. I'm sure it annoyed him. Also, these are older guys. We're talking about guys over seventy, getting over benches. I can appreciate it now. It was hard.

03:56 Speaker 1 Right.

03:57 Speaker 2 So the Rebbe says, "Make a shvil." Shvil made it a little easy. In other words, once a guy got to the shvil, he had his way out, providing Benji let him out. But Benji did, of course, the Rebbe would, would, would be watching each one of them. So like-

04:09 Speaker 1 Benji Sack.

04:10 Speaker 2 Yeah.

04:10 Speaker 1 Yeah.

04:11 Speaker 2 He was, he was either him and, uh, him-- Benji, Soloveitchik, Leibele. Leibele, uh, the Chaniner, the one that got killed in a car accident. These, they were the two guys who stood there, yeah.

04:23 Speaker 1 Bachur.

04:24 Speaker 2 He was a kid, wasn't he? Sixteen.

04:26 Speaker 1 Yeah, he was a kid, yeah.

04:28 Speaker 2 Yeah. And everyone said achrei mitah kedoshim mamois.

04:31 Speaker 1 They what, what?

04:32 Speaker 2 Everyone said it was achrei mitah kedoshim mamois.

04:34 Speaker 1 Yeah.

04:34 Speaker 2 He was achrei mitah kedoshim before-- He was achrei mi-- He was kedoshim before achrei mitos.

04:40 Speaker 1 So I actually heard from Dovid Shlomo Pepe once. I was once by a fabrengen, and Dovid Shlomo Pepe was saying about what you're saying, that the Rebbe wanted the shvil, and he was trying to explain it. He said in the later years, it stopped. Bachurim started standing there. And some of those people, some of those bachurim didn't make it after gevaldigos because it was, it was, it was negative the Rebbe's ratzon.

05:03 Speaker 2 That part I'll put into a big, fat question mark, but the first part is a hundred percent true. The Rebbe would kill people. After gevaldigos, he physically didn't kill people.

05:18 Speaker 1 And the Rebbe said-

05:19 Speaker 2 I know the Rebbe answered a guy, Kleiner. Not, uh, not Klein. Forgot his last name. He was, um, on gezunterheit by the non-Lubavitch in Crown Heights. The non-Lubavitcher. I wish I knew his last name. He was losing one kid after the other.

05:36 Speaker 1 You said Klein.

05:38 Speaker 2 It wasn't Klein. It was a common name. It was not Klein.

05:41 Speaker 1 Oh, okay.

05:41 Speaker 2 He says, "Klein," of course, is the first name. Of course, probably he was losing one kid after the other. He had a machlah, car accident. My hey. He said But, um, slick guy, you know. He's speaking swell, and he's apt to go to a, to a nightclub. Not a, a club, you know- She wrote to the Rebbe. W-what, what did he do? He was only then, uh, he lived on Montgomery where Gunsberg lives, either Gunsberg or the next house. One of those big houses there, just two, three big houses. He moved out. When he moved out, a lot of his friends moved along with him. And it was... This is after Chavtes Lamed. S- He moved away, and Lamed, Lammed Aleph, whatever it was. See, may the Cherub, maybe it's because the Rebbe's kapayda. There's a long answer from the Rebbe. Ki Yuda ein zer dalek yikbekach klal uklal. V'nim steibes sarusei. Debekim idud. It was a long answer. It went public then.

06:49 Speaker 3 You're saying the Rebbe's, uh, the Rebbe's hagutan, and the Rebbe's not going to-

06:53 Speaker 2 The-- Ze lo-- The, the head of the washing, ze lo yioni klal uklal. Klal... That's not mine. That's when I hear stories about the Rebbe. Uh, after Yom Terumah, they started lining up because the Rebbe's... Because the Rebbe's section was gone. Vakeret yatmechayeu. They give me my echo.

07:15 Speaker 3 Well, you see by the previous Rebbeim, there are stories like that, that, uh-

07:18 Speaker 2 Oh

07:18 Speaker 3 ... there's kapaydas.

07:19 Speaker 2 If you get Rebbe, phew.

07:21 Speaker 3 But you're right that there's a lot of Hasidim that would write to the Rebbe, like, "Oh, there's a kapayda." And the Rebbe would say, "There's no kapayda." I don't know. "I don't have a kapayda."

07:26 Speaker 2 But this guy was a known Lubavitcher, so it... But the Rebbe knew who he's writing to also. The Rebbe, besides being a Rebbe, he was a smart Jew, very perceptive. And he happened to know the guy. He came from the case from Rocha. Not every time, but he was smart enough to know it's a good place to go. What was his name? He was friends with my shvger, Harold First. You could say to you. You know Harold First?

07:50 Speaker 3 Yeah, I know him from you.

07:51 Speaker 2 Okay. You mean you know him-

07:53 Speaker 3 I heard about him from you.

07:53 Speaker 2 Oh, okay. He's the one that said, "HaShem had another beard for both of us."

07:57 Speaker 3 The what?

07:57 Speaker 2 When they asked him why he doesn't have a beard, "You have a shvger, Mehalech."

08:01 Speaker 3 Yeah.

08:02 Speaker 2 He said, "HaShem, HaShem had another beard for both, for both of us."

08:05 Speaker 3 Ah. That was his-

08:08 Speaker 2 That's his, the depths of his, um, whatever.

08:13 Speaker 3 And your shvger, uh, Mehalech Zwiebel did, uh... He also learned Chasidus for the Hamishpacha.

08:18 Speaker 2 He learned for... Not only for Harold. He dedicated it for... Aven Beyre needed Mehalech. Aven Beyre was a Chabad man. The one that passed away a year ago.

08:25 Speaker 3 You got Aven Beyre, yeah.

08:26 Speaker 2 He also didn't know Chekmiel of him. You know him now?

08:29 Speaker 3 No, I know his k- his children, yeah.

08:30 Speaker 2 You know Yossi? Yeah, both. You know Shalom.

08:32 Speaker 3 Yossi, Yossi, Yossi.

08:33 Speaker 2 You know Shalom.

08:34 Speaker 3 No.

08:34 Speaker 2 Shalom happens to be here now. He have a, a daughter in Florida, having a Rabshin or something. I guess it's in the winter there now, in the summer that I have off, yeah.

08:45 Speaker 3 What?

08:45 Speaker 2 That's... Australia's off now.

08:47 Speaker 3 Oh, yeah. I guess it's natural.

08:48 Speaker 2 But he's a Rebbe. He can't just walk out.

08:50 Speaker 3 Right. So your brother, Aven Beyre, he's saying he has, uh, garotinah.

08:54 Speaker 2 It was from the Kahanim, uh, the Bach. He'd have him two hours a day, every day of the week.

08:59 Speaker 3 He what?

09:00 Speaker 2 He'd have him two hours a day.

09:01 Speaker 3 Every day? Every single day, he'd have him two hours a day?

09:05 Speaker 2 Shabbos and on Fabringen, three hours.

09:08 Speaker 3 In Australia?

09:09 Speaker 2 No.

09:10 Speaker 3 Oh, I mean the Bach.

09:10 Speaker 2 In the Bach. It continued in Australia too. He went on Mivtzet Zion till about three months before he passed away.

09:19 Speaker 3 Oh.

09:20 Speaker 2 Maybe Friday. Nope. And he had to schlep Bach to help him. Nobody pushed him. He was the... When he had his Bar Mitzvah, my father was actually a fresh, brand-new Lubavitcher. He was born in Tufshin Beis. My father became Lubavitch in Tufshin Beis.

09:36 Speaker 3 In Tufshin Beis, your father became Lubavitch?

09:38 Speaker 2 Tufshin Yud Beis.

09:39 Speaker 3 Yud Beis.

09:39 Speaker 2 Ten years later. But in the beginning, you know, you don't become Lubavitch, and you jump into everything. But by Yud-- By, um, Yud Dalet, he was already into everything, coming to Fabringen.

09:51 Speaker 3 He lived in Crown Heights?

09:52 Speaker 2 No, he lived in Williamsburg.

09:53 Speaker 3 So you're born... You were born in Williamsburg also?

09:55 Speaker 2 I was born in Williamsburg, and he used to schlep me every time to Fabringen.

09:57 Speaker 3 You would walk from Williamsburg?

09:59 Speaker 2 Can you imagine? Five years old. I mean, not right away. Not when I was three. When I was seven. So I had my brother Aven Beyre on one side, Shmulou on the other side. He also lived in Williamsburg. And all my shoes always could have been in front. I didn't walk. They just-

10:14 Speaker 3 You schlepped to Fabringen.

10:16 Speaker 2 Yeah, good. I enjoyed it. It was, for me, it was fun. You know, the vibration of the toes, you know.

10:21 Speaker 3 So when, when did your father, when did your parents move to Crown Heights?

10:23 Speaker 2 Taf Shin Chaf. The week of my sister's wedding. He was a melach. Who moves in the middle of a Treppach? Even as a kid was, "What the heck? Couldn't wait another week to move?"

10:36 Speaker 3 So when your older brother, Aven Beyre, grow, grew up, he like grew up as a melach?

10:40 Speaker 2 Uh, his, his formative years is Lubavitch already. Don't forget my father had a shvger, uh, Velvel Greenglass. So my father became Lubavitch more and more, and he realized my father-

10:53 Speaker 3 How did I know your shvger is Velvel Greenglass?

10:54 Speaker 2 Velvel Greenglass is the wife of my mother's sisters.

10:57 Speaker 3 Oh, wow.

10:57 Speaker 2 But now, it's all the meshich.

10:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

10:59 Speaker 2 It happened a long time ago.

10:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

11:00 Speaker 2 Velvel was a Ben Yocheid. He took piano lessons. He didn't go to, um, to gym. Did you gym? What was it called?

11:08 Speaker 3 Gymnasium.

11:09 Speaker 2 He didn't go to gymnasium. What did she tell me? But his parents were... Father, full beard, of a Statestne. You have to understand those days. For a Yid wouldn't touch his beard of a Meshalach guy. So he sent him to piano lessons, violin lessons, and, um, had a good head, a very fine mind. Uh, good imagination too. That's why he's such a good storyteller. You ever watch his tapes?

11:37 Speaker 3 I've seen the videos, yeah.

11:39 Speaker 2 You've seen, um, video, um, tape. Uh, videos, yeah. I was pretty close with him.

11:45 Speaker 3 But you didn't learn in Montreal?

11:48 Speaker 2 I never learned, but I, I never didn't learn in Montreal.

11:53 Speaker 3 But the Rebbe called him, uh, my Mekubal. Uh-

11:55 Speaker 2 One time-

11:57 Speaker 3 By Fabringen

11:57 Speaker 2 ... the Rebbe said 100 times, "Bel Zeison Lenin." Nobody, no one remembers that. He called my Mekubal was, "Woo, my Mekubal." I remember it. That was the only time I-

12:04 Speaker 3 Do you remember what happened?

12:05 Speaker 2 What?

12:06 Speaker 3 Do you remember what happened by the Fabringen?

12:07 Speaker 2 What the Rebbe's sicha was? No.

12:09 Speaker 3 No, I, no.

12:09 Speaker 2 It was after the... No, it was the after the sicha, the Rebbe went, "Woo, my Mekubal."

12:13 Speaker 3 Yeah.

12:13 Speaker 2 The Rebbe was telling certain people And Belville always stood a lit- a little bit lower than him. He never wanted to have a direct eye, eye contact. And what's happened with him like that, that I, "Who my mekubal? Who my mekubal?" So somebody already knew the name, so he figured. See, reluctantly he gets up, and, "No, l'chaim."

12:36 Speaker 3 But I heard about the, about, uh, Wolf Greenglass. I heard from, uh, Laser Zeidel, alav ha-shalom.

12:42 Speaker 2 And Laser knew him well.

12:43 Speaker 3 Yes, I heard, I heard from him that the Rebbe said, "Who's my mekubal?" And Greenglass, he didn't wa- he didn't wanna show himself, you know, in front of the Rebbe. Like he was, like, hiding. The Rebbe said, "

12:58 Speaker 2 The details, it's possible. Mm.

13:02 Speaker 3 Could be it's the same time, could be it's a different time.

13:04 Speaker 2 No, I think it only happened once.

13:06 Speaker 3 All right.

13:08 Speaker 2 Could be it happened more. I'm not saying it didn't happen more than once, but as far as I know, it happened once. After Isaac Grinsh died, he was, uh, been by Isaac Grinsh. Isaac Grinsh treated him... So when he came, he came probably walking-

13:23 Speaker 3 Oh, uh, you're talking about Isaac. Okay.

13:24 Speaker 2 On Union Street.

13:25 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm.

13:26 Speaker 2 Before he dropped dead. He, he literally dropped dead. He went to a birthday party and keeled over, and he was... When I saw him, his body was already... Not cold, but that's an exaggeration. He died on the spot. A coat man, and that was Lina Nano. He, um, he needed a place to stay. He couldn't stay by Ike anymore. Only Ike's wife would help him. Yichud, you know. So he asked me if he could stay with me. I said to him, "My biggest problem, no problem." And he had no problem with Yichud either, of course, for I had kids in the house, boys. Those people coming and going. So he asked my wife if she would bring up him. And, uh, he said, "Where do you get your meat?" So my wife said, "I'm not afraid of him stealing." So when I came home, she said, "Oh, this is the Chaim Teshkete that I talked to." And he ate it.

14:22 Speaker 3 So the Chaim Teshkete had learned-

14:24 Speaker 2 Chaim Teshkete, she said that was the Chaim Teshkete that I talked to. The tenacity to answer that way. Chaim Teshkete had no inhibitations. Whatever came to him, he just... Everyone thinks that Chaim Teshkete was, um, a beruch Shezikah Haba'achah. Haba'achah wasn't a bum, but he wasn't, uh... I don't know what his turning point was. I think when he lost his wife, it broke him. He lost his first wife.

14:49 Speaker 3 Yeah.

14:51 Speaker 2 You know who she was?

14:52 Speaker 3 His not your shviger. It's not that... So it's not your shviger then.

14:56 Speaker 2 No. His... From that wife, he had one, one, one daughter, passed away less than a year ago. Her name was Luba. Her father was Sean Bell Budnuov. He spoke a deep Russian Yiddish. He was cousins with all the Raskins. His mother was a Raskin. And he... When the, when the Edens, the Labash started arriving in, in, uh, Melbourne, he moved to the other neighborhood. Where would... Hadas, was it called, the other neighborhood? Hadas?

15:25 Speaker 3 Yeah.

15:25 Speaker 2 Are you Australian or anything? There's two communities, this Labash area. They call it Vasat Labash. It's like-

15:33 Speaker 3 That's like where the Polish live and everything.

15:35 Speaker 2 Yeah, they had their own cheder and everything. I mean, their cheder was better than ours, but I'm not gonna into that. I'm talking about the kids, and his Yiddish looked better. Um, he, he moved there. Now, of course, he was from Mishkan Labash. If he's from here, he was clean-shaven.

15:52 Speaker 3 He's from Russia.

15:53 Speaker 2 So when Mishkan came, he made sure he was clean-shaven. Just like us. No, he was from Mishkan Labash, but from Russia, Budanov.

16:05 Speaker 3 So you were saying before about Avram Ber's bar mitzvah in Tofshing Yivbeis.

16:08 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Ber bar mitzvah, let's get back to that. Well, Ber bar mitzvah not Yivbeis. Yivbeis, he, uh, he turned, um-

16:15 Speaker 3 He was born in Tofshing Yivbeis

16:16 Speaker 2 ... he turned 10.

16:17 Speaker 3 Yeah.

16:17 Speaker 2 So Tofshing Yivbeis, he was born Tofshing Yivbeis. So Tofshing, Tofshing, I guess, would be his bar mitzvah, right? So but that's for bringing. That was talking about shlichus a lot. Those years, that was talking a lot about shlichus. Heint is sugukoven, and it was... If they felt in the way, in the, um... Lost that, I never saw that nachru. But I heard from my father, from my brother, the Rebbe said, "Heint is sugukoven, and it was to help in, in being from shlichus."

16:47 Speaker 3 Your brother? Bar mitzvah bachur.

16:49 Speaker 2 Yeah, and he... And then he told him right after that, he told him pshat l'chaim. Part of him-

16:54 Speaker 3 So the Rebbe was saying that he's going to be shlichus.

16:56 Speaker 2 Heint... I never said he would. It's a shayeach.

17:01 Speaker 3 Interesting.

17:01 Speaker 2 In other words, heint, he was, he was a shlichus the last day of his li- I mean, his last, last day he was, um-

17:07 Speaker 3 He was learning in, uh, in, in Labash at Be'frandin, your brother.

17:11 Speaker 2 At that point. But he... No, I'm j- I'm gonna get to that. When he turned bar mitzvah, so Belville realized my father, you can take a Bel- Ma- You can take Zalmansky out of Molochni, but you can't take the Molochni out of Zalmansky. Even the Rebbe couldn't.

17:27 Speaker 3 Out of your father.

17:28 Speaker 2 He said a sigah Tofshing Chaya. Estate that near the sigah.

17:32 Speaker 3 Yeah.

17:32 Speaker 2 I would have stood 100 times.

17:33 Speaker 3 You'll say what?

17:34 Speaker 2 And I know my father well. I can see exactly what the Rebbe said.

17:37 Speaker 3 What'd the Rebbe say?

17:39 Speaker 2 Uh, "Zol, when Zal... Hagabim comes to his hope, he'll look at him. Zol look for no fear. Ich can allach a bat for him."

17:46 Speaker 3 "Ich can allach a bat" for him?

17:48 Speaker 2 "Ich can allach a bat for him. And I wouldn't be shying down for him. I can remember him bachur."

17:51 Speaker 3 And what, what was the, what was the Rebbe trying to... What was-

17:53 Speaker 2 I asked him. He never answered me.

17:55 Speaker 3 So the Rebbe wanted your father to do something?

17:57 Speaker 2 To, to... He wrote to his... Apparently, he wrote to the Rebbe, and the Rebbe answered him, and he wrote back, uh, uh, his dayan. The Rebbe answered him again. So the Rebbe always, when he wanted to get something done, the Rebbe for bringing. He did the same thing with Chabad Chabad. When he wanted the girl to get a raise, how did he do it? He said, "It's ..." Foreign language] "She could fight off." He said, "I tried privately. She knows she could fight, and if she would not help him."

18:24 Speaker 3 The Rebbe-

18:25 Speaker 2 That week they got increased, another 1,200 a week

18:27 Speaker 3 I mean, the Rebbe said something similar about the Sfarim, the whole story with the Sfarim. The Rebbe to- had a few, there's a few Yechidim with Haguch. And the Rebbe said, "If nothing happens, then I will speak about it," but

18:40 Speaker 2 She said, "Pebble."

18:41 Speaker 3 Yeah. So that-

18:44 Speaker 2 I, I, I didn't even know about that, but I just saw it. Every time the Rebbe wanted something to go through after a lot of attempts, he did it with fabregen.

18:51 Speaker 3 Um, how was... Like did he ever spoke about to your fa- to your father about the fact that he became a l- a Hasid? Like how-

18:58 Speaker 2 We'll, we'll get to that in a second. So let me finish my brother. So he realized my... You can take my father as Molach from Kent and Molach had my father till... And he was in a shpin. He was, he was, he told me-

19:08 Speaker 3 Was that the Rebbe said that about your father?

19:09 Speaker 2 No, no. No, this is-

19:12 Speaker 3 Oh, you're saying.

19:12 Speaker 2 I'm saying, I know he with, with Velvel, with our uncle.

19:16 Speaker 3 Velvel Greenglass.

19:17 Speaker 2 He told my father, he says, "Schmuli," he said, "You should come see me, and I'll take care of him." I'm a Chayot, you know. He's not going in, in a strange place. He's going to Montreal, Canada with... He'll have a, a ment. The mantras rested, the, the gosh. But he stayed in the dorm, but every Shabbos he stayed with his uncle.

19:32 Speaker 3 So he went to Montreal.

19:33 Speaker 2 He stayed with him for three years.

19:35 Speaker 3 I see. He became a Rebbe in Montreal.

19:37 Speaker 2 He became a Rebbe in Montreal. I guess that would make... Then he went to Newark for two years. But he went to 770. But he never went in Bedford. He came to Bedford in Dean a week before or a month before Pesach when the kitchen was closed. So it didn't take a day to change it. Moshe did it. The one that might have put the tap lach, have you heard that story?

19:58 Speaker 3 No.

20:00 Speaker 2 I don't wanna keep veering off, but she was the, the one that prepared the kitchen for Pesach.

20:05 Speaker 3 Wh- who was it?

20:05 Speaker 2 Moshe.

20:06 Speaker 3 Moshe.

20:07 Speaker 2 Some... The, the Chaykal Chaim's sister, you know. She probably had to be dying, the hagso of those days. She had maybe a goy helping her, two goyim.

20:17 Speaker 3 She did everything.

20:19 Speaker 2 The whole mentality then was weird. And like, the koylon, you can't come up, eat in the kitchen. You don't have any eat. Those days you can't come have a goy in the kitchen.

20:28 Speaker 3 Right.

20:30 Speaker 2 Nothing. So they lost and they lost. There wasn't to pay, gone. So the kitchen was closed. He came to Bedford to eat lunch, and I saw my brother-

20:38 Speaker 3 I understand. Where was he learning?

20:40 Speaker 2 770.

20:41 Speaker 3 He was learning 770, but he wanted to eat lunch.

20:43 Speaker 2 But he kitched... He closed the kitchen.

20:44 Speaker 3 They closed the kitchen at 770.

20:45 Speaker 2 He could've gone home, but he wouldn't.

20:47 Speaker 3 So he went to Bedford. Okay.

20:48 Speaker 2 Went to the... With all the bochum, a bus took him to Bedford.

20:51 Speaker 3 Okay.

20:51 Speaker 2 A school bus.

20:52 Speaker 3 So you were then in Bedford.

20:53 Speaker 2 I was still, I have a kid, and I give you all-

20:55 Speaker 3 So you, so you saw your brother coming to eat lunch.

20:57 Speaker 2 Yeah, he came to eat lunch. I, when I waved to him, he can't come wave back.

21:00 Speaker 3 Since you could pass the wave.

21:01 Speaker 2 No, I wasn't... He was... That was the thing then. He had a bochur, a kid to be there. So you, you can't even grasp it. It's, uh... Lipsky's also, Ben Lipsky walks Nevadavo, Schmull wave to them, wouldn't answer.

21:18 Speaker 3 This is... That's a, it's a Chassidish thing not to answer, or it's a-

21:22 Speaker 2 No, it was a cultural thing.

21:23 Speaker 3 It's a cultural thing? Which culture? Russian, Lubavitch, American?

21:26 Speaker 2 Actually, I don't know why I'm even doing cultures, or discultured .

21:29 Speaker 3 It's discultured . But where, where does the culture come from?

21:34 Speaker 2 It is... Bochur were developing then. You have to understand the bochur from Russia, but that culture was dying out. And then the American culture came in, that was too much already. So this was like a, a, a freaky adjustment period to late years in your Lubavitch. That was the culture then. So my brother went to Mansfield-

21:54 Speaker 3 I wanna tag on one, so-

21:55 Speaker 2 He never went to Beth with me because I told you why. After the permission, he went to... But he learned in, he learned in the yeshiva called the Yeshivah Salom.

22:02 Speaker 3 Wait, he learned-

22:03 Speaker 2 I gave an interview about the Yeshivah Salom on, on, um, my story too.

22:08 Speaker 3 He learned... Oh, he learned by Malachem in Yeshivah Salom.

22:12 Speaker 2 Yeah.

22:13 Speaker 3 So what's the story, what's the story with the Yeshivah Salom? Oh, that's the story where the Rebbe sent the Malachem.

22:17 Speaker 2 They, she wrote and closed the water, and they, they changed on the pamps.

22:20 Speaker 3 That's the story when the Rebbe sent Malachem there?

22:22 Speaker 2 Well, then Malachem, he didn't send anybody in particular.

22:25 Speaker 3 The Rebbe-

22:25 Speaker 2 When he came into the zal, he never heard the story.

22:29 Speaker 3 Yeah, I think we printed-

22:29 Speaker 2 They printed... They, what they printed was inaccurate.

22:31 Speaker 3 But we also printed it in the "Her" once, the story.

22:34 Speaker 2 Based on them.

22:35 Speaker 3 No, I think based on, uh, conversation with you.

22:37 Speaker 2 Okay. So, so hope you still there.

22:39 Speaker 3 So set, so set the record straight, and we'll say the story.

22:43 Speaker 2 The story is the Rebbe came to the zal about 10:20, 10:15, 10:20, on his way home on the way to Chidus that night, which was a Chidus. 'Cause Thursday night it usually was, right? Tuesday and Thursday. What, what day is it?

22:57 Speaker 3 It was, in the beginning it was, it was three nights a week, and then later it was two nights a week.

23:00 Speaker 2 Okay. But Thursday was always, right?

23:03 Speaker 3 I don't know.

23:03 Speaker 2 It used to be Sunday, Tuesday, and Thursday. And later it became what? Sunday and Tuesday, maybe. I re- I don't remember. The Rebbe came with his coat and everything. He walked into the zal, about five feet into the zal. He spoke to the zal. He had two guys there, two guys there. Nobody expected the Rebbe to walk into the zal. The Rebbe us- used to peek in and go right there. And the Rebbe walked into the zal, people got up, and he said... He just made a statement. He said, "Do I, should I, should I sh- shul? Should I sh- a shul or do I a plot?" Uh, some bit of a shul, but says Yeshivah Salom, they never heard of it. Well, wait . Not only they didn't hear of it, but z- mitn yinger lait, this is Loshen. He covered it to me 100 times. He drilled into my head. Moshe Gurkov from Boston, and he came, he says this mitn yinger lait was kedai yeshivah.

23:59 Speaker 3 Kedai-

23:59 Speaker 2 Karov lain to tes haChidus. Not tes haChidus of Chabad. It's kedai karov lain. What other Chidus is there?

24:06 Speaker 3 Kedai-

24:06 Speaker 2 But they were like, uh, kedai karov lain to tes haChidus.

24:11 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm.

24:12 Speaker 2 He walked out. So there was a debate. Sh- this is in Crown Heights, like even then in Crown Heights, 10:00, the whole city was dead. Besides 770 covered Bach. So Moshe Devinsky, Moshe Devinsky. You know, you heard of Moshe Devinsky.

24:27 Speaker 3 Yeah.

24:27 Speaker 2 I don't have to give you his background.

24:29 Speaker 3 You gave background.

24:30 Speaker 2 Moshe Devinsky, I mean, his, his personality. He was a wild man. He was wild in a very Chidusheville case. And oh, he had that voice. Oh, he spoke with Zondle-

24:40 Speaker 3 He sang, he sang on the Cheich, no?

24:43 Speaker 2 What?

24:43 Speaker 3 No?

24:43 Speaker 2 His son, Mottel.

24:44 Speaker 3 Oh, his son, his son. Okay.

24:45 Speaker 2 Oh, I have a question.

24:46 Speaker 3 Okay.

24:47 Speaker 2 It's Mottel.

24:48 Speaker 3 Okay, so he was a wild-

24:49 Speaker 2 Moshe was po- Mottel was polished. Moshe was... Everything about polished .

24:53 Speaker 3 Okay.

24:56 Speaker 2 And they, um, went to Williamsburg with the bus 44, stopped on Marcy and Keith Street, whatever, Hooper. They didn't know where to stop. They went out-

25:07 Speaker 3 I'm saying, so Moshe Gurkov-

25:08 Speaker 2 M-Moshe Dubinsky said to Rebbe-

25:11 Speaker 3 Moshe Dubi- Uh.

25:12 Speaker 2 The Rebbe, the Rebbe said, "We have to go now." He said, "We're going now, but it's gonna take us at least 20 minutes to get there. Bus is right on the corner. You can take a bus." And, uh, he said, "Reb, we got to stop again." Okay, he made a point. They went out, took a bus coming to, to Williamsburg. Had four, uh, four guy... I always forget the fourth guy is, but the three guys I do know is Moishe Gerkov, Chaim Leitches, and Moishe Dubinsky, and a fourth guy. But he, he ca- he just, he tagged along. He was just tag along. It's not... And I'm not saying anything bad. I'm not saying who it is.

25:48 Speaker 3 Okay.

25:48 Speaker 2 Four guys went.

25:49 Speaker 3 The last guy you don't remember, okay.

25:53 Speaker 2 They came to Williamsburg, got off the bus. They asked people in 770. Nobody heard of it. 770? This side, there's the, the blue building, the this. No one heard of a shul called the 770. They put in 20 minutes into looking for it. It was already after 11:00. The later it gets, the less chance it is. They're ready to go onto the bus, the most maybe about going back to Crown Heights. They saw you coming. He said, "Where's the shul in 770?" He said, "I'm 770. I'm 770. I'm, an I know him." The Malachim Shul.

26:25 Speaker 3 Malachim.

26:25 Speaker 2 He happened to know that it's called... The legal name was-

26:28 Speaker 3 770

26:30 Speaker 2 ... 770. He said, "If it's open, I don't know the address. It's on U Street between..." They were coming from Lee. Um, if you go on, on U Street from Lee and Marcy, on the left side, in the middle of the block, and the windows are big, and there's gonna be fluorescent lighting. You'll see it's just... There's no sign, nothing, nothing. There's no sign that says... It's a building, but you'll see it's a shul because it's gonna be very bright inside. They went, the shul was open. There was about four, seven guys sitting there, four or five guys. They went in, and they all looked up like, you know, the Lubavitch guys with their hats down, and they, they stood out. Like, "Garnish," my father was sitting there learning. He's... It's really interesting how it gave itself overalls to the Malachim. It's done with Yiddishknach, it's been learned. It's a Chabad's good thing, you know that. Little shishi.

27:22 Speaker 3 It's a Chabad's good thing?

27:22 Speaker 2 It's Chabad's good thing.

27:23 Speaker 3 Oh, in the, the veld, the yeshiva shaveld, they also learn if there's any.

27:26 Speaker 2 If, if, if it was reignited by Lubavitch. It's all little shishi thing.

27:30 Speaker 3 Yeah.

27:30 Speaker 2 He said, "I'm swarming." He said, he said, "You forgot the meaning." He says, "But no shishi, it's good."

27:35 Speaker 3 You're saying this is a, um, a history of how Malachim were doing a Chabad type of thing.

27:40 Speaker 2 These are a lot of Chabad things.

27:42 Speaker 3 'Cause they, they, they ha- they hold themselves Chabad, right? Malachim.

27:45 Speaker 2 He was a, he was a Lubavitcher, so to speak.

27:46 Speaker 3 Talking about the, the founder.

27:48 Speaker 2 Abenberg.

27:49 Speaker 3 Abenberg.

27:49 Speaker 2 He, he was a-

27:50 Speaker 3 Oh, so your brother Abenberg is named after the Malach?

27:52 Speaker 2 Full name, Chaim Avrum David Ben Schneer Son. He was Chaim Avrum David Ben Schneer Son. Actually, he had one, my father for rent, a closet of him. My Zayd was Avrum. So he could've called my brother Chaim. He could've called him Berl.

28:11 Speaker 3 He called him Avrum.

28:13 Speaker 2 He called him Avrum. No, he called him Abenberg, of course. The Malach was called Abenberg. His title was Abenberg the Malach.

28:18 Speaker 3 So your father, like, their Mearch, the Malach, like, like this, that was their leader?

28:23 Speaker 2 He, he, he was in bush.

28:25 Speaker 3 But your father never met him.

28:27 Speaker 2 Of course he did.

28:27 Speaker 3 Oh, he, he was-

28:28 Speaker 2 He was a kid, though.

28:28 Speaker 3 So your father was brought to the Malach and by-

28:31 Speaker 2 Not by him, by his, by his... He was dragged in by the knufia. You know what the word means, right?

28:36 Speaker 3 Yeah.

28:36 Speaker 2 By the gang.

28:37 Speaker 3 By the gang.

28:37 Speaker 2 By the gang.

28:38 Speaker 3 Fidiga writes in the, in the Sichas, "Who's the knufia?"

28:42 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. Fidiga usually, the Fidiga usually a lot. And, um, so he knew him. He went from other, from Tevere Das.

28:48 Speaker 3 So your father was in Tevere Das, and the Malachim-

28:50 Speaker 2 And there were two guys there that Menlovitz, the founder of Tevere Das.

28:56 Speaker 3 Shaga.

28:56 Speaker 2 Shaga Menlovitz.

28:57 Speaker 3 Shaga.

28:58 Speaker 2 Shaga Menlovitz, yeah. He was a... He wouldn't have prevented Shaga, but he was zich in... He was, he was a Lutvak in the Beis Midrash. But he knew the yeshiva survived.

29:06 Speaker 3 He was open to Chassidus, though. He let-

29:08 Speaker 2 Yes

29:08 Speaker 3 ... Yisroel Jacobson come.

29:09 Speaker 2 He was open. Yeah, the story will change him. He'll change your mind a little bit.

29:15 Speaker 3 Okay.

29:15 Speaker 2 He brought two guys to the yeshiva. He brought Jacobson, because he was here a long time already. He had... He spoke English with Yiddish. Maybe you would ever hear Jacobson talking English.

29:25 Speaker 3 Actually, Saul Jacobson once told my father how he learned English. He said that every day he would read The New York Times until he understood it.

29:33 Speaker 2 Yes.

29:34 Speaker 3 Isn't it interesting?

29:34 Speaker 2 That's how he took a hard paper. Yeah. He turned to the higher level.

29:38 Speaker 3 High vocabulary, yeah.

29:40 Speaker 2 Yeah. Called upon him. See, he was the two guys. He comes-

29:46 Speaker 3 So, so the Ma- the Malach and Jacobson would come to Tevere Das?

29:48 Speaker 2 They would, they would be, they would hang out. They would be... I don't even think they got a check. The guy couldn't even pay his rent.

29:53 Speaker 3 They were giving shiurim.

29:54 Speaker 2 Yeah, but shiurim. In time, he didn't like that, but he wanted their fresh yeshiva because all the other Maggid shiurim were muggalah, all.

30:03 Speaker 3 So he wanted like a-

30:04 Speaker 2 He wanted a-

30:04 Speaker 3 ... Amalekid

30:05 Speaker 2 ... he, he himself had a beard.

30:06 Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah.

30:08 Speaker 2 You see all the pictures, but so he attracted a certain element of Rebbe Menachem. Everyone with their problem, their issues, whatever, and this knufia dragged my father. Why my father? At the end of the day, my father's father, Av- Avrum, whether he was a boy, never touched his beard. He was, he wasn't, he wasn't an American-like Lubavitcher yet.

30:28 Speaker 3 He wasn't Lubavitch.

30:30 Speaker 2 Who then? He wasn't a Stone either.

30:32 Speaker 3 He wasn't? So what was he?

30:35 Speaker 2 He was a Tevere Das boy.

30:37 Speaker 3 Your father's father?

30:39 Speaker 2 Father's father was a Karliner.

30:40 Speaker 3 Karliner, yeah, yeah.

30:41 Speaker 2 Seventh generation Karliner. J- J- Jewish boy.

30:43 Speaker 3 So but he had a big beard?

30:44 Speaker 2 He had a big beard.

30:45 Speaker 3 A beard.

30:45 Speaker 2 Not a long beard. He had a beard, and he wore a, a brim. Shabbos he wore a, a velour hat.

30:50 Speaker 3 So you're saying your father was already attracted to this because h- his father's batsim like that also?

30:56 Speaker 2 He was... That's why he was tr- That's why he was a candidate for these boys

31:02 Speaker 3 For, for the, for-- So, right

31:03 Speaker 2 For these, uh,

31:04 Speaker 3 Right

31:05 Speaker 2 They weren't taking an American boy with p- clean-shaven face-

31:08 Speaker 3 Yisroel Jacobson did

31:09 Speaker 2 ... but their mother without a sheitel and the father, the mother... My bubbe wore a sheitel, my zayde wore a full beard. You don't need to tell, we saw the, the whole nine yards.

31:16 Speaker 3 Yisroel Jacobson was Mekarev, like a real American boy, isn't he?

31:19 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

31:19 Speaker 3 You're saying, but Levin, the, the Malach wanted-

31:21 Speaker 2 Malach, uh, he, he didn't look at them long

31:24 Speaker 3 He wanted the Hasidim

31:26 Speaker 2 He didn't cont- It was even the Reb Rashab was already more Mekarev for it than he was

31:32 Speaker 3 Than the Malach

31:32 Speaker 2 Like, not as much as the Rebbe, but, uh, the Rebbe, you know what went on in his house, right?

31:36 Speaker 3 It was, uh, Chabad Hasids.

31:38 Speaker 2 Yeah, but, he had people that played piano sometimes in the middle. They went into the next room and played piano. They were told not to, but we stopped.

31:47 Speaker 3 Yeah

31:48 Speaker 2 It was always, we could let, uh-

31:49 Speaker 3 Nikolaev was a-

31:51 Speaker 2 Oh

31:51 Speaker 3 ... was a-

31:52 Speaker 2 Was a melting pot

31:53 Speaker 3 Melting pot, yeah.

31:54 Speaker 2 Sure.

31:54 Speaker 3 There were Hasidim there also, I think. There were, I mean, there were-

31:56 Speaker 2 A lot of writers, yeah.

31:57 Speaker 3 Yeah

31:57 Speaker 2 A lot of artists. There was a lot of... They, as the years go by, we're finding their articles. Hey, we get a, a little lady. They all came to that wedding, the night of the Rebbe's wedding.

32:08 Speaker 3 And, uh-

32:08 Speaker 2 Thousands of crowds, these people

32:11 Speaker 3 So what, what's with, um... So your father is in, um... So, so what ha- so what happened with your father being Mekarev?

32:18 Speaker 2 He, he passed through Topreves Hasidims.

32:21 Speaker 3 The Malach?

32:22 Speaker 2 And they didn't want the fall apart. Without leadership, things fall apart.

32:26 Speaker 3 You co- Right.

32:27 Speaker 2 So they bought a building. This building.

32:29 Speaker 3 One second. He, it wasn't him? It wasn't his Hasidim?

32:33 Speaker 2 He didn't give a word Hasidim. They were M-M-Mekubalim. He had, he had a job as a Rebbe up, up in the Bronx, in some rundown building shul. He was getting $60 a week.

32:44 Speaker 3 So you're saying when your father is sitting there in Williamsburg, when these bachurim showed up, it's not like the, the Malach Hasidim-

32:48 Speaker 2 No, no, it could have been that. He was in, in, in high school. Yeshivas. By the time he got to yeshivas, they already, they already opened their own yeshiva. And not a formal yeshiva in the Pelsher yeshiva, which is now, I forgot what street, right off Division. The Pelsher yeshiva was a place that was open from 6:00 in the morning till 12:00 at night, like the Shomer Shabbos Shul on 13th Avenue.

33:10 Speaker 3 Yeah.

33:11 Speaker 2 Open the whole day. And they had their corner where they sat and learned. It was 12 guys, 14 guys. Father was one of them. Then they bought the building. They made their own millions. They were happy. And I think my father was the only Kohen from the whole group. So when he became a rabbi, sure, I'm jumping steps, but, uh, he was a Kohen. He was a Levi. And the initial group and people on the block didn't care who, who, you know. It's convenient. He lived there like an American boy, Jews. A lot of people lived on this block. They weren't Agudas, Agudist-

33:43 Speaker 3 The Shul

33:44 Speaker 2 ... on the Shul, yes, on the block. So my father lived there, got married very young, got married at 20. He was born in . He got married in Teshu'anach. And, um, what am I up to? So he stayed in Malach, and then Teshu'anach had this interesting story between my father and the Rebbe. I don't know if you want to count that. I never asked him.

34:09 Speaker 3 Well, your, your father had a shalom with the Rebbe before this whole story? Or are you saying Teshu'anach?

34:13 Speaker 2 Teshu'anach, he had a bad second stroke.

34:16 Speaker 3 Right

34:17 Speaker 2 My father was an open mind. He was inquisitive. So again, I don't know. I never asked him. He went Teshu'anach to hear this farbrengen that night. But even the farbrengen, just kids leave you. Shvat, no, Hirbet Shvat. Uh, the, the time that he went was in, during the week, and the Rebbe was the doorman.

34:37 Speaker 3 Yeah.

34:37 Speaker 2 He was very sick then. So they wanted to make sure not more than 15 guys go at a time, and then he wouldn't let in more until those 15 were out. So he came to the door. My father was, uh, you know, how old is he? 23, 24. Came to the door, and the Rebbe was already closing the door. He had to like, he had to . The crowd was pulling it open. And the Rebbe, he saw my father, he grabbed him by his wrist and pulled him in.

35:06 Speaker 3 Hmm.

35:07 Speaker 2 So that was, in my opinion, that was the beginning.

35:10 Speaker 3 Right.

35:10 Speaker 2 Started to move into the farbrengen. Into the, um, into the hall we're going to, to... Salon, they call it. Salon. He was there 15 minutes, you know-

35:19 Speaker 3 Oh yeah, the Frierdiker Rebbe's room? Oh, the, the dining room.

35:21 Speaker 2 The sa- salon

35:22 Speaker 3 The dining room.

35:23 Speaker 2 Salon. Frierdiker was the Frierdiker's room. Salon's in the middle. You were never there?

35:27 Speaker 3 I was there, yeah. The dining room.

35:28 Speaker 2 It's open now. It's a library.

35:30 Speaker 3 Yeah, not today, but yeah, I've been there, yeah.

35:32 Speaker 2 Nothing, but it's a, it's a, it's an ac- an accessible room.

35:36 Speaker 3 I, I don't think now, but it was-

35:37 Speaker 2 Oh, they stopped it.

35:38 Speaker 3 Yeah, but I mean, it was in my lifetime.

35:39 Speaker 2 So they started missing or something. What happened to them, I don't know.

35:41 Speaker 3 I don't know.

35:44 Speaker 2 He, um, so he farbrenged there in Teshu'anach. The end was low. He's still a Malach, and he was still a Tzionni. He was a Tzionni. In Teshu'anach, he, he had debates with him about Tzionni. So one of the things he spoke about, he-- One of the debates they had, my father had with these four guys-

36:06 Speaker 3 Oh, with these guys that came that night

36:08 Speaker 2 ... came.

36:08 Speaker 3 So they, they, they walked in-

36:09 Speaker 2 The only topic was Tzionnis, yeah

36:10 Speaker 3 ... and they started talking to, and your father-

36:11 Speaker 2 They spoke till 3:00 or 3:30 in the morning.

36:14 Speaker 3 Uh-huh.

36:15 Speaker 2 And, um, in the morning, told Moishe, "Go cover the bachurim." Not a young bachur, but he was... And they punkt end Rebbe spoke with Sholom Zichronim, he comes through Friday morning, the hall was empty.

36:27 Speaker 3 It was all empty, yeah.

36:27 Speaker 2 And he does something, you make midlel Shishi. Yeah, that was, uh, if he s- says, "What did him say about farbrengen?" He said to the another yeshiva. So he came, he said it, "Farbrengen and bachurim should, uh-"

36:39 Speaker 3 Be there Friday morning

36:40 Speaker 2 ... by Friday morning. And it bothered him. He got up late. But he's begash mir. He slept two, three hours. So he came in, uh, like 20 to 9:00, which is Friday seudah start at 8:00. But it's already 40 minutes late. He comes right under the clock, this guy sitting there with a hat and a jacket, and he looks familiar, of course. In the Malach yeshiva, he was sitting with another hat, another jacket. So if you don't know somebody-

37:04 Speaker 3 Right

37:05 Speaker 2 She looks at him. "You went Pakampf?" She said, "I'm selecting traps. He's Pakampf." "Ah," she said, "dear." He didn't know, know his name.

37:13 Speaker 3 Your father said that to, to Moshe Yaakov?

37:15 Speaker 2 He s- he, he said to Moshe Yaakov, Moshe Yaakov said to my father-

37:18 Speaker 3 Ah, that was Pakampf.

37:19 Speaker 2 He is, uh, Pakampf Bonin. My father said, "She's Pakampf? I'm not doing that for sure." He says, "Oh," he said, "doesn't deal okay." He says, "Why are you here?" He says, "We spoke yesterday. I wanna continue the conversation." And the rest is history.

37:35 Speaker 3 Wow. So that moment your father became a, a chossid.

37:39 Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, which, which moment are you talking about? That night?

37:42 Speaker 3 That night.

37:43 Speaker 2 Also, Moshe Debinsky did this classic on my father. Father gave him some lesson. He was, you know, had a white beard already. He had a white beard very young. I don't know if you know it, Moshe Debinsky was born Yud Aleph Nissan, Taf Sh- Taf Beis Tammuz. Are you aware of it?

37:59 Speaker 3 No.

37:59 Speaker 2 Okay.

38:01 Speaker 3 When did he pass away?

38:03 Speaker 2 He was quite old.

38:04 Speaker 3 Old?

38:04 Speaker 2 So he died... He passed away in oil, I think, after Gemara Shabbos.

38:09 Speaker 3 Moshe Debinsky?

38:10 Speaker 2 Yeah. Well, a few years before. Give or take a few years from Gemara Shabbas.

38:14 Speaker 3 Okay.

38:15 Speaker 2 He wasn't a youngster. And, um, that's his history that I know. This is when my father started coming to the Fabingen. They found out about it. They once followed him that every Shabbaton V'chakh he's rushing after having my father-

38:33 Speaker 3 Where is he going?

38:33 Speaker 2 Came late. And Mitchel, when he's rushing Shabbaton V'chakh, they smell the rotten fish. They followed him, and they realized he went to Lubavitch. So they pulled, he went to... This story I heard from Simcha Zurkin. They opened up the-

38:47 Speaker 3 Simcha Zurkins, the Zurchins are also from the Malachim.

38:49 Speaker 2 Right. He remembered-

38:50 Speaker 3 Not Simcha, not Simcha.

38:52 Speaker 2 I'm talking about Simcha was telling me the story.

38:53 Speaker 3 Okay.

38:54 Speaker 2 So the young bachor then, they opened up the Arkets, Shema Kol. The guy hid this, uh, he's gotta go into the kat. They called it the kat.

39:04 Speaker 3 Kat. Oh, it's like, it's like the beginning of chidush, called the kat.

39:07 Speaker 2 It's gotta go to... No, but the other freedom.

39:09 Speaker 3 Right.

39:09 Speaker 2 Obviously, the kat was there.

39:12 Speaker 3 Okay.

39:12 Speaker 2 So we put a mechirah on him, and it, it was interesting the way they told my brother had a mitzvah. Okay, that's when my father became whatever, and he, we can't give him kohein anymore. He's a, he's a-

39:27 Speaker 3 Menudeh

39:28 Speaker 2 ... menudeh. This is the Shabbaton, but and while he is no time for the omit, not that he was a chabad or anything, and so they started, he started giving the name to my brother. "I got my brother..." Had all the lingo. He's also becoming a Lubavitcher, but as a tinok shenishba. It's, it's like it's, it's so comical you can't tell. If I wouldn't know it for a fact, I would I wouldn't believe it. So they gave him the aliyah, and also he had a holy name of Ben Ber.

39:57 Speaker 3 Right. Ah, it's a-

39:58 Speaker 2 He has a hechsher. They gave him the aliyah. My father didn't daven there every Shabbos. He davened there... Shabbaton V'chakh, he never davened there. He went to shul that finished earlier. He went to shul that started 9:00. We needed that hour to walk through to Williamsburg.

40:14 Speaker 3 To Crown Heights.

40:15 Speaker 2 And Mitchel from Williamsburg to Crown Heights, yeah. You gotta understand, I remember being dragged. Uh, when I came to Fabingen, I don't think I even walked inside. Right away, I found my friends and we-

40:25 Speaker 3 How old are you?

40:28 Speaker 2 Started, I was being dragged to S- to Crown Heights after six, seven years old.

40:33 Speaker 3 You were learning in Lubavitch?

40:34 Speaker 2 Best indeed. I'm the only one from all my brothers that, uh, taught here. I was born, and they, they were all born before Taf Shin Yud. I was the only one that was born after-

40:45 Speaker 3 But you didn't go into the Fabingen's at that age?

40:47 Speaker 2 I went in for the l'chaim between the second and third shiur. I ran in for entertainment for the l'chaim, and when I ran out, and it wasn't shaq to tell you because I was a what? A 10-year-old kid.

40:59 Speaker 3 How many kids bachur were by Fabingen's then?

41:02 Speaker 2 Two or two or three that the parents match up, but it wasn't, it wasn't a thing for kids, you know? It wasn't in the culture. Later it became... There hadn't been until a year when-

41:11 Speaker 3 Later, later there were kids sitting menudeh

41:13 Speaker 2 ... my dad used to do it in the middle of the men.

41:14 Speaker 3 He says Hashem. Yeah, this is Hashem.

41:18 Speaker 2 I know that, but you know how many times they tied it at the shoelaces?

41:21 Speaker 3 Kids.

41:24 Speaker 2 If all of them, I mean, they lose to Rebbe, right? We're not gonna get into that.

41:29 Speaker 3 They're growing up by the Rebbe-

41:31 Speaker 2 I mean, it's like eight-

41:31 Speaker 3 ... by the Rebbe's feet.

41:32 Speaker 2 He grew up in... He's doing sessions. He, he, he works by the feet for Rebbe.

41:37 Speaker 3 So it, it's, it actually happened.

41:40 Speaker 2 Literally, yes. It wasn't, it wasn't, um, it wasn't, uh, a mashal. Because, uh, we moved to the Crown Heights. Me moving to Crown Heights was like Galidin. From Williamsburg to an apartment building, Begachme as far as to two-family house. Within the building, you smelled fish. You smelled urine in the stairwell. I mean, it was horrible.

42:06 Speaker 3 Which building?

42:07 Speaker 2 Where I lived in Williamsburg, 124 South 9th Street.

42:10 Speaker 3 Oh, yeah.

42:10 Speaker 2 This is where we lived in a two-family house with a garden, with a basement, with an attic. I mean, to me it was a... I was more in Sim Chatimim since I'm 10 years old that I was home. My best friend, Shmuel Lipschutz. That, that part I forgot to tell you.

42:25 Speaker 3 Shmuel Lipschutz, yeah.

42:26 Speaker 2 Shmuel Lipschutz, me and him were like brothers. We were soul brothers. We're very different, but we're in the same grade since ki- kitah alef till we got married. Every yeshiva we went to together.

42:41 Speaker 3 Yeah.

42:41 Speaker 2 And the yeshiva went together. I can move closer. Went together to every yeshiva, so he, he... Lipschutz, I don't know if you know, they were very much into that, being into Rebbe Zalman's-

42:51 Speaker 3 The Lipschutz.

42:52 Speaker 2 Avraham was even more than Berel. Avraham was, you know, middes. So, so essence of life was being there.

43:01 Speaker 3 The Rebbe.

43:02 Speaker 2 Yeah, in Sim Chatamim, the Rebbe Darum So Shmuel turned me into a Lipskker in that respect.

43:09 Speaker 3 So you're, so you're-

43:09 Speaker 2 I was more... When I came home, I ate supper and I went from seventy, and I would come home 9:00, 9:30, and father had his shvetz. It was two students in the Yeshiva Kiriashah. I came home 4:00, 4:30, 5:00, I left the house, I came back at 9:00. "What did you do those four hours?" And I said, "Well," I said, "There wasn't enough time. I was talking to this "" My father looked at me like, "What?" To me it was heaven.

43:34 Speaker 3 So-

43:34 Speaker 2 Hanging out with-

43:35 Speaker 3 So the, the Lipskkers are the ones that got you into the whole culture.

43:38 Speaker 2 Yeah, Shmuel Lipskker.

43:39 Speaker 3 Shmuel Lipskker.

43:39 Speaker 2 Of course.

43:40 Speaker 3 Being in the Chabad seventy, being there.

43:41 Speaker 2 That seventy being my place, yeah.

43:43 Speaker 3 So you gravitated towards that?

43:45 Speaker 2 I loved it. It was, it was heaven, you know. Even when the Rebbe wasn't there, the whole atmosphere, the Rebbe's here, the Rebbe's coming, the Rebbe's going, the Rebbe... Did you hear this tonight? Do you know he's going in? You know, it was just... Everything was about the Rebbe.

43:59 Speaker 3 So you would stay with the

44:01 Speaker 2 They, they were annoyed as all hell of me and Shmuel. They couldn't send, "Away, away" before they were-

44:07 Speaker 3 See, the, the, the cul- the culture kicked in.

44:09 Speaker 2 Yeah. "Away, away from the "Home. Yeah, yes, yes, Sabbath." We, we enjoyed, you know, the, the content.

44:18 Speaker 3 So you... Well, what years are you talking about? Is there a-

44:22 Speaker 2 Chaf Alef, Chaf Bet, Chaf Gimel.

44:24 Speaker 3 So you were hanging around every night when the Chassidism, whatever, whatever was going on?

44:27 Speaker 2 No, even my Yechidim, yeah.

44:29 Speaker 3 So you were with the Rebbe by night every night?

44:31 Speaker 2 Yeah, it was either I was out playing with the Rebbe. It was all... For me it was all the same. I didn't... Was too young to appreciate, to be the... You're seeing now, you're seeing in hindsight. The Rebbe was, the Rebbe, there's a God, there's a shul, there's a Rebbe. There's no other thing.

44:49 Speaker 3 So you don't always think about it, but it-it's there.

44:51 Speaker 2 Mm, exactly. The Rebbe was-

44:54 Speaker 3 You can't, you can't have a world without any of those things, but-

44:56 Speaker 2 Yeah

44:56 Speaker 3 ... the Rebbe-

44:59 Speaker 2 Well, it was when I got older already, and Rebbe Farbrengen, as much as I didn't listen, you were dragged into that atmosphere. Yeah, every Farbrengen without fail, you know, 16, 17, 18, came out of Farbrengen Shabbos, there's cars driving. What was... What's going on here? There's a world out there. When you were... But a Farbrengen, I'm sure you heard this line from other people.

45:23 Speaker 3 Not necessarily.

45:26 Speaker 2 You came out to the street, th-there's a world out there. You, you, you were just, you were just in the Beis Midrash. The moment you come out, now it's Tel Aviv.

45:36 Speaker 3 So you're saying, so the Rebbe, like

45:38 Speaker 2 Seven Farbrengens. And then Chaf He, what the Rebbe did in the Chaf He is unbelievable.

45:43 Speaker 3 Farbrengen every Shabbos?

45:45 Speaker 2 Rashi Sichas.

45:46 Speaker 3 Oh, no, it's-

45:48 Speaker 2 Every Shabbos he wanted to continue it, but then he got that shuttle from the ladies.

45:52 Speaker 3 Just saying the Rashi Sichas was a whole new-

45:55 Speaker 2 Even the Lubavitch came. They came about 3:00, 3:30.

45:58 Speaker 3 The Crown Hei- the Crown Heights and all Lubavitchers came for that.

46:01 Speaker 2 They heard it. They feel... Get the toys for Rashi. They were all Rashi. Even the shul, even... Everyone learned the... Well, they had to have a Chumash called Chok Liatoral. That's one of the things we did with Rashi, the Hamaban, you know.

46:15 Speaker 3 So they're Jews. I, I had a teacher once, he was teaching us sixth grade Chumash Rashi. Says, "Now if we're learning Chumash Rashi, of... The definition of Am Ha'aretz is anyone who cannot learn Chumash Rashi."

46:27 Speaker 2 Okay.

46:28 Speaker 3 That, that's how he explained it to us.

46:29 Speaker 2 Yeah, that, that-

46:30 Speaker 3 Or maybe that's how he was feeling that-

46:31 Speaker 2 No, no, no. When I was a kid, that was the expression. As a, as a shays, Chumash Rashi.

46:36 Speaker 3 Right.

46:36 Speaker 2 That was a put down. That was the ultimate put down.

46:39 Speaker 3 Right.

46:40 Speaker 2 So he came. Yossel Waldman, he became to Farbrengen. Hagami went to Beth Medrash Govoha and to Seven Seventy. He heard the Rebbe saying Rashi Sichas-

46:49 Speaker 3 So, so the whole shaychas with Yossel Waldman-

46:51 Speaker 2 Not the whole shaychas. He, I just... I was mugged him. He went to Beth Medrash Govoha, he went to Seven Seventy, got married to a Lubavitcher girl. He was clean-shaven. Hagami had a brother in Israel with a full beard, Vatikolo. Himself was a businessman. He didn't come from a Lubavitch background. The only reason he went to Seven Seventy, of course, was convenient, very close friends. I really never asked him why. Once the Rashi Sichas got involved, once the Rebbe Farbrengen-

47:19 Speaker 3 But he... Now he became like the, the Rashi Sicha-

47:22 Speaker 2 That was later. Yeah

47:23 Speaker 3 ... the Rashi Sicha man.

47:24 Speaker 2 Rashi Sicha man. Even when the Rebbe stopped giving out the Chazotes.

47:28 Speaker 3 He would tell him.

47:29 Speaker 2 He went to, he went to the Rebbe. "Well, Rebbe, should..." The Rebbe said, "No, you have the..." And the Rebbe knew when he tells him, the whole Lubavitch knows about it.

47:37 Speaker 3 So the Rebbe would tell him every Shabbos.

47:38 Speaker 2 Every Shabbos he was told by the same Shoni Yisroel who told Umduchv and told him.

47:45 Speaker 3 That there's gonna be a Farbrengen?

47:46 Speaker 2 That's what he-

47:47 Speaker 3 Or what the Rashi-

47:47 Speaker 2 Not to use those words, that the Rashi is in this-

47:50 Speaker 3 Which Rashi it is, yeah.

47:51 Speaker 2 Yeah. So in 30 seconds the whole shul knew. But we wouldn't know about Farbrengen. This is after davening. So we didn't have the, the luxury of knowing the-

48:01 Speaker 3 The, the plan.

48:02 Speaker 2 The plan.

48:02 Speaker 3 What, what you have to plan, whatever.

48:03 Speaker 2 We knew we have at least... We have now times. Should we run home to make kiddush with family or it's too late?

48:09 Speaker 3 I, um, I once heard from someone in Crown Heights, he said that, um, you know, when the, when we found out that there's gonna be a Farbrengen on Shabbos afternoon, there's gonna be a Simchat Shabbat. Because if you think about it, how... what percentage of the crowd probably even understood the Farbrengen? Low. A lo- a low percent-

48:32 Speaker 2 Yes

48:32 Speaker 3 ... a low percentage.

48:32 Speaker 2 But he came to the Farbrengen.

48:34 Speaker 3 But like, but yet there was like, no, it was a Simchat Shabbat. It was a Farbrengen, and, you know-

48:38 Speaker 2 For Lubavitch.

48:39 Speaker 3 For Lubavitch, yeah. He's saying, yeah.

48:43 Speaker 2 I'll tell you, in the other camp, I was sitting with Rav Rogalitzky and with somebody else, I forget who the third guy was, and it started then, this is in the mem already. The Rebbe f- started Farbrengening, not just that more often, quite, quite more often.

49:00 Speaker 3 The, the, in the mem, the Rebbe's Farbrengening more often than not.

49:03 Speaker 2 Right. When it starts, so certain guys went, "Oh, there's another Farbrengen today," and they get excited. Certain guys... I was sitting with Rogalitzky there, and the guy came down with Farbrengen today. He came like 10 minutes after davening. We found out from Waldman, whatever, whatever it took to find out. And the table started being re-arranged, and one guy said, "Ach, again?" So, uh, Rogalitzky said... When the guy walked away-

49:28 Speaker 3 Who was Rogalitzky then?

49:29 Speaker 2 Avraham.

49:30 Speaker 3 Avraham Rogalitzky, yeah.

49:31 Speaker 2 I spoke, there was a Farbrengen, and I thought, "Oi." So I said to Avraham, "It is worse." He said, "How could it be worse?" I said, "The guy doesn't even say oi." He said, "Well, how, how's that worse?" "He's not coming anyway."

49:46 Speaker 3 This guy, this guy that said oi is not coming anyway?

49:48 Speaker 2 No, no.

49:49 Speaker 3 I see.

49:49 Speaker 2 This guy who's not saying oi.

49:50 Speaker 3 Ah.

49:51 Speaker 2 The guy who's saying oi, he knows he has to come.

49:52 Speaker 3 The Chaf Chafes.

49:53 Speaker 2 He knows he has to come. I'm like, "Oh, shit." I said, "Well, yeah. This guy's a dunkem Farbrengen."

50:00 Speaker 3 No one was taking attendance to see-

50:03 Speaker 2 No

50:03 Speaker 3 ... you have to come to check your card.

50:04 Speaker 2 Only Yun, only Yun Ishama took attendance, and the, and the Rebbe took attendance.

50:08 Speaker 3 The Rebbe knew who was there.

50:11 Speaker 2 If somebody that came and he went home apparently, Well, then he, this is Not here. That's as they would say in Jever, as "Dach s'dol ah goyen," okay? Rebbe saw him, the guy was checked out. At a, at a time I, I'm, I knew who it is, but it's a long time ago.

50:32 Speaker 3 But you never, you never missed a

50:37 Speaker 2 No. Had a book of Zichronot even when I got married. The only time I missed was the, the Rebbe had the groundbreaking, and I knew it's going on, but I had customers, I told them I'll be there at 4:00. Tell the guy the next day I-

50:53 Speaker 3 So that was the middle of the week

50:54 Speaker 2 Right, during the week. Shabbos?

50:55 Speaker 3 The, the groundbreaking, 770.

50:57 Speaker 2 Shabbos, never. Never. There was a time I didn't even go home.

51:02 Speaker 3 So you're saying, but you were already-- Since you're a kid, you're-

51:06 Speaker 2 I was in-

51:06 Speaker 3 You're, you're into it

51:06 Speaker 2 ... I was in Boro Park, yeah, even so, even, even if I lacked the Torah, I'm not here to put myself down or up. It was part of my-

51:14 Speaker 3 You're saying

51:14 Speaker 2 It was-

51:15 Speaker 3 ...

51:15 Speaker 2 It was, if I put my mind to it, not all of them, but if I put my mind to it, I would, yeah. I'm not showing off or-

51:21 Speaker 3 You weren't doing Chazara.

51:23 Speaker 2 And the Chazara was always in the background, and sometimes I had what to say, but I didn't have the bright guys. You had guys like Yosef Yechzi, if you turn around, give you a dirty look-

51:32 Speaker 3 There's a, there's a hierarchy how it works anyway

51:35 Speaker 2 Like, yeah.

51:36 Speaker 3 One of the integral components of being a Hasid are the Chassidishe Yamim Tovim and Yemei Depagrah. Whether it's Heh Tovis, Yud Shevat, Yud Alef Nissan, or Gimel Tamuz, these days give us an opportunity to connect with our Rabbeim, to connect with each other, and be better Chassidim. What is the story behind each of these days? How did the Rebbe commemorate and celebrate these days? And most importantly, what are the lessons, the takeaways, and the action items, HaMa'aseh Hu Ha'Ikker needed for each of these days? All of this and much, much more are answered in the new set recently published by Der Her. Our Days is a journey through the Chabad calendar in story, meaning, and practice. With over 700 beautiful glossy pages with elevated content, beautiful, beautiful photographs, you, your family, and friends will enjoy and live with each Chassidishe Yamtiv. This book is a must for every Lubavitcher home, for every shul, for every school. It is a perfect gift item. This will not collect dust. It will be used day after day, month after month, year after year. You can have the set. Go to derher.org/ourdays, order your set today and start living the Chassidishe Yamim Tovim. But you had like, you had, um, like a connection to Yale even though you weren't like part of the Chezem or anything, no?

53:16 Speaker 2 Yeah, I had a chaz-- My connection to Yale happened in, um, in Bais Medrash Din. I was the first one to pick up Negunim. Uh-

53:24 Speaker 3 Oh, so where does the-

53:25 Speaker 2 He would never l- teach us a new nigun until we knew the old one.

53:27 Speaker 3 Where does the whole Menagem thing in the Basaski Mishpacha come from?

53:30 Speaker 2 My Zayde, my father's father.

53:33 Speaker 3 So it's Yeruša.

53:34 Speaker 2 He was the Menagem song.

53:36 Speaker 3 In Stalin.

53:37 Speaker 2 He was not a Mena- not a Menagem. The-

53:40 Speaker 3 Where? In, in America?

53:41 Speaker 2 Stalin. America, Zichronot even-

53:44 Speaker 3 In Europe

53:44 Speaker 2 ... even as a book in New York, yeah. Had a phenomenal Chuzmir nigun. As a matter of fact, that saved his life.

53:51 Speaker 3 How?

53:52 Speaker 2 He was drafted in the Russian army at the age of 16. Now, of course, he's 16. He had a brother, Dovid, who passed away at the age of 11, 12. When the drafts come, those days there wasn't computers or anything or telephones, came to his house to pick up Dovid. He said, "Dovid passed away." "He had passed away? He, that's Dovid." But Zayde was built well. "He's not, he's not Dovid, he's Abraham, Marom," or whatever the, however they pronounce it in Russian. They didn't believe him. They took him. They pack up and go. Told him, "You have to pack up and..." And he came there and they said, "Do you have any special talents?" He said, "He's musical." So he played the tuba in the Russian march band, which always performed in Moscow, Leningrad, whatever it was then, and he didn't go to the front. But then the war broke out in Turkey. I think the Russian had a Russian-Turkey out. You know history better than I do.

54:46 Speaker 3 Um, not-

54:46 Speaker 2 Russian-Turkey War.

54:47 Speaker 3 I, I guess not that well, yeah.

54:50 Speaker 2 Russian-Japanese, uh, I don't know.

54:51 Speaker 3 Russian-Japanese was the war, yeah.

54:52 Speaker 2 Japanese. He was worried about being, uh, he had his week off and on his way home-

54:58 Speaker 3 This is in the times of the Rebbe Rashab, the Russian-Japanese, yeah.

55:00 Speaker 2 Yes, yes, yes.

55:01 Speaker 3 Okay.

55:01 Speaker 2 He was born in 1890.

55:03 Speaker 3 Okay.

55:05 Speaker 2 So he says he's talking about 18-- 1910, 1911. Well, no, even earlier, 1907, 1906. On his way home, he stopped by his town rabbi. He's worried that even he's a musician, but when they're gonna need more guys in the front, they'll say, "The heck with you. We need people in the front." So he told him, "Go to America." He said, "Stop. America? America is today. You go to America," he says, "You'll be, you'll be fine." Rebbe had a haste, went home and parted with his parents. Took him about a year to get here. Of course, he had to work for train tickets. He had to push work and to be a, a push cart guy to make his ticket. Finally, he collected enough money to buy a ticket to New York. Actually, he landed in Chi- in, in Chicago. That was the port of entry. Everyone thinks he came in, in Ellis. Ellis Island became the-- When somebody said they came to Ellis, he came to the American border More people arrived between Detroit and Chicago than Ellis Island.

56:08 Speaker 3 Yeah.

56:08 Speaker 2 Ellis Island, famously, of course, they put up the Statue of Liberty there. But most of them, he went there and they, he said his youngest father's brother was by the, on the dock. "Oh, Abraham, Shalom Aleichem, how are you?" Yeah, he doesn't, didn't even know him. He knew he was there, and he saw a book with a shikkel barrel. He said to him, "Tomorrow morning, that's coming off." He does it. And the beard, he says, "If you wanna live here in America, you'll never get married with a beard. You'll never get a job if you shame yourself." He says, "Let me worry about it." So he stayed with him for a few months, and then he threw him out. Of course, he was more unemployed than employed. He, uh, he wasn't poor, but, you know, to feed another mouth, and the guy's not contributing anything, and he was more annoyed in the whole thing that the guy's not adjusting to the American standards. So he threw him out, and he went on his own, and it was one night he decided that tomorrow that's not gonna... His father, who was still alive, came to him. His father, who was still alive, came to him in a dream, and he says that these three words, "Avraham haltzach."

57:19 Speaker 3 Hmm.

57:21 Speaker 2 This, you usually hear about a dead person.

57:24 Speaker 3 Yeah.

57:24 Speaker 2 A live father came to him in a dream. He said, "Ha, Avraham haltzach." Say, that's all he needs, an extra push. Eventually, he got married, I think, my bubbe was either four or six years older than him. Why'd she take him? She was a Lubavitch. She was a Chabadnik.

57:40 Speaker 3 Your mo- your grandmother-

57:42 Speaker 2 My, my bubbe's elder, her father was Leah, um, Moshe Leo ben Sher Zion.

57:47 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm.

57:48 Speaker 2 I'm not sure as of yet whether she was a Cha- a Lubavitcher or a Ladyher or, or a Kopuster. But she was a-

57:56 Speaker 3 Chabad.

57:57 Speaker 2 She taught us, she taught us how to study.

57:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

57:59 Speaker 2 Even when we were stolen. As a matter of fact, there's a whole story about that. It's an interesting story.

58:04 Speaker 3 Okay, so go, go back. So, so this is the whole, this is how the Bashatzes got to America.

58:10 Speaker 2 That's how much-

58:10 Speaker 3 But what-

58:10 Speaker 2 ... he came with a single book.

58:12 Speaker 3 But what, um, she think she, be- because of the Nigun, that was your connection with Yale.

58:18 Speaker 2 Of course, we, uh, we, we won't go into that. So he used to go, "Yale," he says, "He liked my singing style because I was the first one." He would never go on. He'd be, "Oh, at least somebody knows it." So he went to the next song. He said, "Do you know this Nigun?"

58:30 Speaker 3 Wait, this is in Bedford, he was doing the Nigunim?

58:32 Speaker 2 This is in the Vaibishul every Friday, every Shabbos afternoon between Min- between the Rebbe's Mincha and Ma'ariv. It was interesting, I think, uh-

58:40 Speaker 3 So he, he, he did this-

58:41 Speaker 2 ... oh, next to the Rebbe's-

58:41 Speaker 3 He did this, Yale did this his whole life.

58:43 Speaker 2 Yeah.

58:43 Speaker 3 See, I used to go to the, to Yale's Nigunim.

58:45 Speaker 2 Yes, mostly, yeah, but-

58:46 Speaker 3 I'm saying like he-

58:47 Speaker 2 Now I'm thinking about it, it was mamish next to the Rebbe's room. The Rebbe heard his singing, for sure.

58:51 Speaker 3 In the Vaibishul, you mean the Cheder Sheni-

58:53 Speaker 2 Which is now, which is now Label's office. Well, Label's got it already.

58:57 Speaker 3 Oh, you mean this is, this is-

58:59 Speaker 2 Saying the original 770 Vaibishul, no. That's where Kroll started.

59:04 Speaker 3 I don't understand. I, I don't understand what you're talking about.

59:06 Speaker 2 Label's office used to be the Vaibishul. The only Vaibishul.

59:10 Speaker 3 Vaibishul of what?

59:11 Speaker 2 770.

59:12 Speaker 3 Oh, you're talking about the first 770, that-

59:15 Speaker 2 When they actually built a roof, yeah.

59:16 Speaker 3 That was the, uh-

59:17 Speaker 2 Not chalach, but it was a real-

59:18 Speaker 3 When, when they built o- over the chalach.

59:20 Speaker 2 When they put the roof, yeah.

59:21 Speaker 3 So Label's office was the Vaibishul. It was mamish next to the Rebbe's room. Kapishate. Mam-

59:25 Speaker 2 And it was sort of out to left.

59:26 Speaker 3 It's 10, it's five feet away from the Rebbe's room.

59:28 Speaker 2 10 feet or whatever.

59:28 Speaker 3 Whatever.

59:29 Speaker 2 The Rebbe heard it for sure. I'm sure he enjoyed it, too. You know, the old Rebbe.

59:33 Speaker 3 You didn't think about it then. You didn't think about it then, that the Rebbe's sitting a few feet away from you.

59:36 Speaker 2 Of course, the whole place was so small. Remember, with the kids, I used to play right at the door.

59:41 Speaker 3 Who was by this Nigunim? This was, uh-

59:43 Speaker 2 Me and Shmulov Sr.

59:44 Speaker 3 Bachim. It was the poor Bachim.

59:46 Speaker 2 Kid Bachim. Y- you call Ba- Bachim 15 Bachim? Kid Bachim.

59:51 Speaker 3 It was, it was Yale's students in Bedford that would come to his thing.

59:53 Speaker 2 Yeah, th- that's the boys. Uh, just, let me see, 13, 14, 15.

59:56 Speaker 3 It's very interesting that Yale, in those years, he was teaching young Bachim. He wasn't teaching all the Bachim.

1:00:01 Speaker 2 We were, we were chassidim then.

1:00:04 Speaker 3 Was he able to relate to people?

1:00:07 Speaker 2 In his own way. I liked him because of the Nigunim. Otherwise, "Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." His way of talking was weird.

1:00:13 Speaker 3 So, so Bachim didn't appreciate Yale.

1:00:17 Speaker 2 S- Shmulov Sr. and I, and, um, Asif Deitsch, alav hashalom, zol lang lechayim. There was like four or five guys who, who got him. We, he, we got his essence, not his scholar.

1:00:28 Speaker 3 He Fabrayn, he Fabrayn for you, too, right?

1:00:30 Speaker 2 He told us stories, as much as he can bring himself down to say to... He knew it's 15-year-olds, and he'd like to tell us a story, but he would tell us very flashy stories with a page full of stuff, you get. It was jokes, very Yiddishe jokes. I think I've mentioned to you, but I don't, at least once, Yale told us a story about how to act like he's very smart. He, when he thinks of a funny story, he starts laughing. Him and Yale-

1:01:00 Speaker 3 That's how he, that's how he laughs.

1:01:02 Speaker 2 There was a wink by a Bachar. "Do you remember when I used to shiv a Bachar in the dark? Klap Bachar." It's like, "Oh, Bachar," we call it. You know what that means?

1:01:13 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:01:14 Speaker 2 Enlightened. And then, "Mah renkum lidal?" It was learning.

1:01:20 Speaker 3 This is in Lab- in Lubavitch?

1:01:21 Speaker 2 This is in Lodz. Lubavitch.

1:01:24 Speaker 3 What are you talking about? You're talking about a story Yale said happened to him.

1:01:26 Speaker 2 Yale's telling us a story in Beth, in, in Beth Din in 1967, '66. And he was farbrengen with us. This wasn't during learning. This was a yemot hapageah. And he says, "What, I've only got a short farbrengen, an hour." So how Bachar call it. He had all these tzinus that made the story interesting.

1:01:49 Speaker 3 He acted out the story.

1:01:50 Speaker 2 Yeah. Then comes the, "Veitzner kumt ay muffin, uh, redden in dem ulam," and this ulam was like a famous ulam. They didn't ever heard of the ulam. Might have heard of it, but they didn't know it was famous. They went to, they would shivah Bachar. And the guy had a speaker. They'd never heard of him either. She said, she said, "Well, what are you so excited about? That today, you know who's coming today to, let's say, the Ulam, uh, the Barclays. You know who's coming to the Barclays today to speak? Schweddel Beddel."

1:02:24 Speaker 3 Okay.

1:02:26 Speaker 2 He looked at him, "Eh, he wasn't there, but Lonan." Said, "He also the bachor asked him," he feels so, "I think the bachor here, for sure."

1:02:35 Speaker 3 Okay.

1:02:35 Speaker 2 I can see from the, I can see from the question. So they said, "Look, let me ask you a question." She asked him Yiddish, but I'll say it in English. How far is it from... Yiddish sounds better, the joke, but I have no choice. How far is it from, from Moscow or from Leningrad to Tel Aviv? So on the spot the guy says, "Astronomy is not my specialty." So astronomy.

1:03:02 Speaker 3 Astronomy.

1:03:03 Speaker 2 I said, "Well, let me enable you to go on." I said, "Well, let me just finish my, finish my, finish my, finish my, uh, the Yiddish word to use. That's not my specialty." Astronomy is astronomy. It is my, is my fach. In Yiddish, it's not my fach. And every time Yossel tells the story, at least 10 times, he would start laughing. Astronomy is not my fach.

1:03:29 Speaker 3 That's the punchline.

1:03:30 Speaker 2 That the Oofnik had this calling-

1:03:32 Speaker 3 Astronomy

1:03:33 Speaker 2 ... geography, mixing it up with astronomy.

1:03:34 Speaker 3 It's like, uh, I heard that, um, I heard that Vol, um, Peretz Hirshberg. So he, after-- He was looking, and Nachman Hama, you know, he, uh, gezucht a rebbe. He was, he was telling the bachurim, I'm sure I heard this from-

1:03:50 Speaker 2 He, he wasn't the only one, but okay.

1:03:51 Speaker 3 So I, I heard this from one of the bachurim that... I heard this from a Shliach who was a bachur in Montreal.

1:03:56 Speaker 2 The world was totally destroyed.

1:03:57 Speaker 3 Right. So he's looking... So anyways, he went to a certain... The end of the story is that he came to the Rebbe and that was it, right? You know.

1:04:03 Speaker 2 Came to... Yeah, but he, w-me, he became a rebbe himself.

1:04:06 Speaker 3 Yeah, I'm saying-

1:04:07 Speaker 2 But where was the stepping stone? He was in Montreal.

1:04:09 Speaker 3 So, yeah, yeah. I'm saying, so he, one of the things he says is he went to a certain Rosh Yeshiva, a famous Rosh Yeshiva who, who, who will remain nameless for now. And he goes to the Rosh Yeshiva, and the Rosh Yeshiva said-

1:04:19 Speaker 2 Tell him, him don't go.

1:04:22 Speaker 3 The Rosh Yeshiva said, "Before you talk to me in learning, you should just know a disclaimer. I only know the Yeshiva Shemesachtas." And Hirshberg said, "Nach vilef minut, I saw dos echad kenen nisht." So

1:04:33 Speaker 2 Dos kenen ech nisht.

1:04:34 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:04:38 Speaker 2 It's a Hirshberg one.

1:04:40 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:04:40 Speaker 2 He loved Rebbe, by the way.

1:04:42 Speaker 3 Hirshberg.

1:04:43 Speaker 2 First, he loved him for his yidi and Torah. Once he got to know the Rebbe on a personal level, and he had that Varemkeit chalal, and Yiddishkeit beflat. But he still hamasht yi, ami stam misht the Rebbe.

1:04:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:05:01 Speaker 2 He loved Rebbe, Rebbe. If you hear he say something good about the Rebbe, he didn't care who, where he was standing with freedom, it would lay sin on you. You know the story of Moshe Weber? You know Moshe Weber?

1:05:14 Speaker 3 Yerushalayim.

1:05:15 Speaker 2 You know who he is?

1:05:16 Speaker 3 Yeah, from Yerushalayim.

1:05:17 Speaker 2 Right. He was Mevareng in. There would... It, it was a new p- a new safer of Ramim coming up, and it was either a day before the Ramim, a day after, or that day. And they went like this. They come for Ramim, and the Rebbe was like struggling to... A lot of people like him, like to... I'm using the word "struggling" here for lack of a better word. So everybody's like... Some people knew it. Some people had Ramim on the table too. Like, uh-

1:05:49 Speaker 3 Yeah

1:05:49 Speaker 2 ... like with the, uh, with the mafte, you know?

1:05:53 Speaker 3 Yeah, okay. Yeah.

1:05:54 Speaker 2 You know the story with the mafte.

1:05:55 Speaker 3 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

1:05:56 Speaker 2 Father, uh, grabbed my father off. I told him before-

1:05:58 Speaker 3 The Rebbe wanted him to correct. Yeah, okay.

1:06:00 Speaker 2 Yeah, and my father the next week was the gabbi. It was a complicated week with this and that, like three different mafte. My father took a chum, started inching it over to the Rebbe. So he picked up a vibe and gave a look. Ooh, he took that chum away. "You just told us to do it."

1:06:18 Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah. Doesn't mean kip should he know? Okay, no, no. So, okay, so-

1:06:22 Speaker 2 So, so Moshe Weber said to him, "The..." I don't know whose story happened first, so I'm just telling you, um, that he's a gallant. Rebbe's asking a mishne chacham. He wasn't your, he wasn't your Elchan. He wasn't even, he wasn't even your spring Elchan, zechar ma'at. Man, it was cool of Miz. But finally, so the Rebbe's asking, and, uh, and everyone's... And he seen the Rebbe's not returning the sefer, so he told the Rebbe the passage, and the Rebbe gave him a nod. Thank you.

1:06:53 Speaker 3 Yeah, the Rebbe liked it.

1:06:54 Speaker 2 And the Rebbe, the Rebbe repeated the whole passage, and then he went on with the-

1:06:58 Speaker 3 The passage or the-

1:06:59 Speaker 2 The, the, whatever it's called

1:07:00 Speaker 3 ... the name of the safer, the Rambam?

1:07:01 Speaker 2 The p- I meant to say the pisukim.

1:07:03 Speaker 3 Oh, you're talking about the passage in the Rambam at the-

1:07:05 Speaker 2 Right.

1:07:05 Speaker 3 Ah.

1:07:05 Speaker 2 He starts off that safer.

1:07:07 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:07:08 Speaker 2 It's usually chakecha, one of them.

1:07:10 Speaker 3 Right, right.

1:07:10 Speaker 2 It wasn't that one, but another different one.

1:07:12 Speaker 3 So you're saying the Rebbe acknowledged it, like appreciated it.

1:07:14 Speaker 2 He, he appreciated it.

1:07:15 Speaker 3 He appreciated it.

1:07:16 Speaker 2 But like just saying, like-

1:07:17 Speaker 3 Hamash.

1:07:18 Speaker 2 Yeah, and the Elom was looking, and it would dagger eyes.

1:07:21 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:07:22 Speaker 2 The chutzpah. That I know who it's coming from.

1:07:26 Speaker 3 Right.

1:07:27 Speaker 2 You know, don't, don't get

1:07:32 Speaker 3 You're saying if R Basovsky did it, the dagger eyes are warranted. If Moshe Weber did it-

1:07:36 Speaker 2 Exactly. Exactly

1:07:37 Speaker 3 ... the, the, the-

1:07:38 Speaker 2 Exactly

1:07:39 Speaker 3 ... he's helping the Rebbe. He wants to help.

1:07:40 Speaker 2 Yeah.

1:07:41 Speaker 3 Actually, he reminded me that, um, there was someone... There was a video that the Rebbe comes into shul, and the Rebbe's giving out coins to the children like he did. And basically, the Rebbe's tallis is falling, and it even, it, it-

1:07:57 Speaker 2 It's out of, it's out of whack.

1:07:58 Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah. And, and it even goes over, off the Rebbe's head. The Rebbe was very machpid.

1:08:02 Speaker 2 Oh, the beracha.

1:08:03 Speaker 3 No, no, the Rebbe never... No, that's what falls off. It falls off entirely. There's a shailah with the beracha. But even the head, okay-

1:08:07 Speaker 2 But his was, was like this

1:08:09 Speaker 3 ... fell off once

1:08:10 Speaker 2 Went all the way.

1:08:11 Speaker 3 Oh, he went all the way, yeah.

1:08:12 Speaker 2 The whole shul was talking about it after davening. Did the Rebbe make a bracha or what?

1:08:17 Speaker 3 Okay, yeah. So, so the Cha-- the Rebbe was very machmir to always have his head covered with a tallis the whole time he's in shul.

1:08:26 Speaker 2 Have a, a, a covers with

1:08:30 Speaker 3 I think so, yeah. It's like-

1:08:31 Speaker 2 Sure

1:08:31 Speaker 3 ... the Rebbe's not walking out the big-b-g- saying the Rebbe has his head covered.

1:08:35 Speaker 2 Sure.

1:08:36 Speaker 3 Yeah. So the Rebbe, so the middle of the Rebbe-- the, the tallis is falling, and the Rebbe is... It's, it's almost falling off. For short, it comes off the Rebbe's head in Gantzen.

1:08:45 Speaker 2 Somebody wanted

1:08:45 Speaker 3 No, no, that's... So someone put... And then even when the Rebbe gets to his place, Rebbe is, like, fixing it the whole time. So someone posted a clipping of this video on WhatsApp. Someone else writes on WhatsApp, "Well, what's the geschmack to, to post this video?" You know, like, the Rebbe, you know, the tallis flying. Okay. So then, then afterwards on the same, uh, group, someone else, someone else wrote-

1:09:09 Speaker 2 Oh, this went on one of the WhatsApp groups?

1:09:11 Speaker 3 Yeah, now, yeah. S-someone posted the video of this. Someone else says, "Well, it's paskened. What are you posting such a video, right?" You know. And, uh-

1:09:18 Speaker 2 It's Rebbe

1:09:19 Speaker 3 ... yeah, whatever. And then-

1:09:21 Speaker 2 No, but the answer was that's Rebbe.

1:09:22 Speaker 3 One, one second. So someone else wrote, "Actually, let me tell you a story that I heard from some peyleter that was there when this happened." And he said, "I was there." This peyleter told me that he was there when this happened, the Rebbe's tallis fell off, and that's when I under-

1:09:35 Speaker 2 Al-almost-

1:09:35 Speaker 3 Almost, yeah. That's when I understood what's his machlas. Why? Because in any other case if it was a peyleter Rebbe or any other Rebbe, all of a sudden, the G-- No, the gabboim would run in to help him and... But the Rebbe, all the maskilim were standing around. No, no, no, no one touched him.

1:09:51 Speaker 2 Pure machlas. Beis A machlas. What happened, Be-- If you know the background to the story, that's pure machlas.

1:09:58 Speaker 3 Of what?

1:09:59 Speaker 2 The Beis A story.

1:10:00 Speaker 3 Oh, the Beis A. No, say the story. The Rashi.

1:10:03 Speaker 2 You know the story, you know, right? You want me to repeat the whole story? The Rebbe came in. It was a loft Shabbos, not , before Rebbe. And Zam Udukhman, the Rebbe the Rebbe he always said, "Well, maybe," said the Rebbe, he said, "Should, shouldn't ." Matter of fact, when Mamaleh Muzikier, in the Mamaleh Muzikier, he once pa-pa- It said the Rebbe, uh, Maidels. Rebbe would bench. Noch mensen, then after he said the Rebbe would bench, and he said he's not gesundheit. And the Rebbe, the Rebbe laughed.

1:10:43 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:10:44 Speaker 2 It happened a few times-

1:10:45 Speaker 3 Cha Zam Udukhman made the Rebbe laugh a few times.

1:10:47 Speaker 2 Yes, yeah.

1:10:47 Speaker 3 There's a few stories.

1:10:48 Speaker 2 See, because he d- he didn't do this shtick. Matter of fact, but other name, the guy who started making Rebbe laughs. So he also did. Not because he was making a mistake. He would say the Rebbe

1:11:00 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:11:00 Speaker 2 But when you say the Rebbe the Rebbe would bench is funny. He also did it, and the Rebbe gave him a look like you need a broche to... You have to go to a doctor.

1:11:12 Speaker 3 Don't try this at home.

1:11:13 Speaker 2 Yeah. Came out to Hillel. That little clap was like-

1:11:17 Speaker 3 Yeah

1:11:17 Speaker 2 ... was a cheap shot. You know what I'm talking about, yeah.

1:11:21 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:11:21 Speaker 2 It was...

1:11:24 Speaker 3 So what's the maise with the Rashi? So Zammu, Zammu gets up and announce-

1:11:27 Speaker 2 Zammu just went and got up to him and said, "Rebbe Rebbe Rashi Beis A," meaning it pashut Beis is, uh, Beis is not Beis is, um,

1:11:43 Speaker 3 Yeah.

1:11:49 Speaker 2 turned around. He was white. May- for lack of a better word, the Rebbe was enraged. And he came away from his place. He left his sidon, his omit, clothes. I was there. No, I didn't hear the story. I was there. From I came before the Rebbe. Most of the times I walked to shul, 20, 30, maybe 40-

1:12:12 Speaker 3 This is after davening?

1:12:13 Speaker 2 This is before davening.

1:12:14 Speaker 3 He announced before davening? That was a Saturday?

1:12:16 Speaker 2 That was a Shabbas. That was a Saturday, yeah.