Rabbi Mendel & Chanie Fogelman: "Pastrami Shlichus" In Central Massachusetts

00:00 Speaker 1 No matter where Rabbi Mendel Fogelman goes, whether it's the kitchen, or the sanctuary, or the office at the Chabad center he and his wife Chanie run, the food orders always seem to follow him.

00:13 Speaker 2 Hello?

00:13 Speaker 1 Yes, this is Chanie, yes.

00:14 Speaker 2 Do you sell half-sour pickles also?

00:17 Speaker 1 I have, I give half-sour pickles with all these sandwiches. Did you want to buy some?

00:21 Speaker 2 'Cause I'm coming there tomorrow to buy, to buy a couple pounds of pastrami.

00:25 Speaker 1 All right. We'll get... We- we'll make sure you get some good-

00:27 Speaker 2 And I need-

00:27 Speaker 1 We're gonna make sure you get some good half-sours with that. We'll sell them to you.

00:30 Speaker 2 Okay.

00:30 Speaker 1 But as good as those things are, they enable the Fogelmans to offer so much more, because their kosher takeout has whipped up a recipe for success that goes far beyond the culinary. It's making a positive impact in their Jewish community, and far beyond it. I'm Gary Wolk, and this is Lamplighters: Stories from Chabad Emissaries on the Jewish Frontier. Life as a Chabad emissary is often joyous, but it can be unpredictable, and even dangerous. Chabad has become a ubiquitous presence in every corner of the world, but behind every Chabad house are emissaries, regular people striving to transcend their circumstances, and the community that supports and relies on them. These are their stories. Chanie's Kosher Takeout is located in a plain brick building at the end of a residential cul-de-sac across from a spacious park in Worcester, Massachusetts. It's one of the many things Chabad of Central Massachusetts offers. But if not for the small sandwich board sign by the front door, you'd never know that there were culinary gems inside. I walk in through a small vestibule, and I'm hit with the aroma of savory pastrami and half-sour pickles. I'm there to talk with the proprietors, but I'll have to wait a bit, because Rabbi Mendel and Rebbetzin Chanie Fogelman are everywhere at once. So are their children. They zip into and out of the kitchen, talk to customers, and prepare to send away a gigantic to-go order.

02:19 Speaker 3 Let's get as many as we can back here.

02:20 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans hand about 80 sealed bags to an Uber driver parked just below a large Star of David stained glass window. He struggles to fit them all into his compact car. The order includes about 75 sandwiches, as well as brisket plates, sides, and desserts. It's destined for another Chabad center about 50 miles away. Once the bags of hot, freshly made food are safely in, the driver is off.

02:50 Speaker 3 Go on, see.

02:51 Speaker 2 All right. So long until-

02:52 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans and I walk past the order desk, the ark containing seven Torah scrolls, and the tables that accommodate sit-down customers. We settle in the rabbi's office for the interview, but that will have to wait a bit longer, because Rabbi answers another flurry of phone call orders before we're finally able to discuss the origins of Chanie's Kosher Takeout.

03:14 Speaker 3 We used to have between 45 and 70 people in our home Friday nights, and the cooking in the kitchen at our house, although it's a nice kitchen, w- we weren't able to handle it.

03:24 Speaker 2 When it come to 70, it was, like, already hard to work from, uh, one oven.

03:30 Speaker 3 So Chanie asked, "Would it be okay, can we start cooking here?" So we brought it over here.

03:35 Speaker 1 By over here Rabbi Fogelman means at their Chabad center's larger industrial kitchen. They'd cook the food at the synagogue, and bring it home before Shabbos. Problem solved. But Rabbi Fogelman had another idea.

03:49 Speaker 2 So we said like, you know, "So you're already cooking here. How about selling a little bit? We will be able to cover the cost of the meals."

03:56 Speaker 1 But Chanie and Rabbi realized other potential benefits.

04:00 Speaker 3 One of them, of course, is to bring about the idea of kosher in the city, and in order to bring that about you have to have really good food so people really appreciate it and say, "Wow, this is great food, and it's kosher."

04:12 Speaker 1 And there was another mission: to meet more Jews.

04:15 Speaker 3 It's very easy to talk over food. It's much easier to ask them to put on tefillin, or ask them if they have a child that's, uh, available for our preschool or our Hebrew school.

04:23 Speaker 1 With those goals in mind, in 2017 they began offering food for sale at the synagogue.

04:30 Speaker 3 A big smorgasbord with 10 salads, five kinds of meats, and chickens, and kugels.

04:35 Speaker 1 There had been a couple of delis in Worcester, but they weren't kosher, only kosher style. So the Fogelmans recognized they had an opportunity to offer delicious homemade kosher food to anyone who wanted it.

04:49 Speaker 2 Challah, will be fish-

04:51 Speaker 3 Dips

04:51 Speaker 2 ... dips, salads, uh, chicken, meat-

04:56 Speaker 3 Kugel

04:57 Speaker 2 ... soup, kugel, and dessert. And people ask me, "Oh, do you have a vegan? Do you have this, do you have that?" I kind of like every week decided to add another dish.

05:10 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans did that for about three years, but-

05:13 Speaker 3 Corona canceled that. May of 2020 we decided let's try like everyone else. You see it all over the newspapers, curbside pickup. Let's have people give us orders, and then we'll bring it outside to the cars.

05:26 Speaker 1 The business did well, and after the state's mask mandates relaxed, the Fogelmans opened their Chabad center to walk-ins, and set up tables in the shul's cavernous sanctuary. And then business really began to take off.

05:40 Speaker 2 The first clientele was purely Jewish people. Then from Facebook, it really kind of like blew up and a lot of people came, Jews and non-Jews, they came to buy.

05:53 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans began to meet people in the community that they say they wouldn't otherwise have met. One of those, an older man, was asked by Rabbi Fogelman if he was Jewish.

06:03 Speaker 3 And he says, "Yes, my mother's Jewish, but I was brought up Catholic. My father, who was Italian-" Made sure I got baptized, and I was baptized, and that's how I grew up. And I said, "Baptized from baptized. We should put on tefillin and have a bar mitzvah today." And we rolled up the sleeve and we put on tefillin, and when he read the part about not looking at other gods, he went like this, "Uh-huh."

06:25 Speaker 2 Yeah.

06:25 Speaker 3 He's he, he, he acknowledged those words.

06:29 Speaker 1 And this guy had kosher catering for his bar mitzvah.

06:31 Speaker 3 Yeah. That's true. I didn't think of that, right. He had a nice kosher caterer, right?

06:35 Speaker 1 Afterward, that man's wife, who is not Jewish, made sure that their house had a kosher mezuzah on their front door. There's also the story of the woman who hadn't set foot in a synagogue for 67 years, the man who asked between bites of his pastrami sandwich whether it would be okay for him to come to Rosh Hashanah services, and the person who told Rabbi Fogelman...

07:00 Speaker 3 "You did what my parents couldn't do." I said, "What was that?" He says, "Come to a shul. I never walked into a shul. I never wanted to walk in a shul, but your pastrami brought me to a shul."

07:09 Speaker 2 You know, so those are people that we reach.

07:13 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans met younger Jews too. Many have enrolled their children in Chabad of Central Mass preschool, Hebrew school, and afterschool programs.

07:22 Speaker 2 So we see people becoming part of the community just because of a takeout.

07:28 Speaker 1 And it's a symbiotic relationship. Profits from the takeout help pay for programs, which bring more people to the shul, where more people learn about and try the takeout, which has also led to more kosher observance at home.

07:42 Speaker 2 Parents will tell me, like, um, parents from Hebrew school, "Wow, now I can make Shabbat," you know? So they'll come here and they'll buy, and they'll put, like, a tablecloth and they'll make a meal for Shabbat. It's definitely makes people, uh, thinking about more of, like, bringing kosher.

08:00 Speaker 1 Chanie's Kosher Takeout now offers about 20 side dishes, including Israeli salad, kugels, soups, french fries, and knishes. Entrees include teriyaki salmon, brisket, and chicken schnitzel. There are six kinds of sandwiches, challah, various dips, and chocolate chip cookies. Customers can order by the tray for Shabbos meals or parties, and everything is homemade. But the staples seem to be the pastrami and corned beef. The reviews have been superlative. One of the most glowing endorsements came from Cunningham & Associates, a consultancy firm in Worcester. In March of 2021, the firm was looking for incentives to get employees who were working at home to venture back to the office.

08:47 Speaker 4 We ended up coming up with this lunch bracket because it was around the time of March Madness.

08:51 Speaker 1 That's Anthony Desimone, a tax expert at Cunningham.

08:55 Speaker 4 We had 32 food organizations throughout Worcester. Now, one of the rules was no chains. So we're looking for more of that home Worcester feel.

09:04 Speaker 1 One of Anthony's colleagues had noticed the buzz Chanie's Kosher Takeout had generated on Facebook, so they reached out to Rabbi Fogelman, who has more than his share of chutzpah.

09:14 Speaker 2 The first time when they came and they were telling my husband about the contest, he says like, "Yeah, I'm sure we're gonna win. We have the best food," you know?

09:25 Speaker 1 Chanie's was a late entry, and the only kosher establishment in the contest. Despite Rabbi's optimism, what were the odds that they'd win the bracket? But in the first round...

09:35 Speaker 4 First thing I tried was the pastrami sandwich. Unbelievable

09:40 Speaker 1 As the tournament progressed, Anthony and his colleagues sampled pizza, poke bowls, and fancier dishes from some of Worcester's more established restaurants, but Chanie's kept rising to the occasion.

09:52 Speaker 4 The schnitzel sandwich is the best sandwich around. It is incredible. The chicken is perfect. The sauce in there is perfect. We raved about it like crazy here.

10:06 Speaker 1 They also tried Chanie's fish plates, mushroom barley soup, and Chinese chicken. Some of Anthony's colleagues played a little prank on him when it came time for him to call in an order for the next round. That order, of course, included chicken schnitzel sandwiches.

10:21 Speaker 4 They asked, "Hey, can you ask for extra cheese?" I said, "Uh, okay, I don't think it comes with cheese, but sure." So I asked for extra cheese, and, um, Rabbi Fogelman on the other line, he goes, "No." I'm like, "Oh, okay." He goes, "It's kosher. You can't have cheese." And then, then it all clicked. I go, "Oh my God, they got me." Oh my God.

10:40 Speaker 1 Anthony isn't Jewish, and he likes cheese on his sandwiches, but now...

10:45 Speaker 4 I don't even want it for a sandwich. I just want that schnitzel.

10:48 Speaker 1 Chanie's made it to the Sweet 16, then the Great Eight.

10:52 Speaker 3 Then they ordered again, and they came back and told us, "You're in the top four." So I say, "We're in the top four? That's crazy." We're talking about non-Jewish restaurants, top of the line in the city. They told me, "You decimated them. It's yours to lose."

11:05 Speaker 4 Every time it was a Chanie's day, it's crazy. The entire office would come in and, "Oh, it's a Chanie's day," and everybody in the office raved about it. It's top-tier food, kosher or not. It's just top tier.

11:17 Speaker 1 But there was something else on the menu: community involvement. The Fogelmans were seeing increased profits for their incredibly hard work, and they had decided to reinvest all of it into their programs. They had hired professional teachers for their afterschool, Hebrew school, and summer camp. They had hired a bus and driver, and offered free tuition for families that couldn't afford to enroll their children. And Chabad of Central Mass began building a new wing for their classrooms. All that got the attention of Cunningham & Associates.

11:51 Speaker 4 So not only was the food incredible, the story was the best story of anyone we had on the bracket.

11:56 Speaker 1 In January, the contest winner was announced, and it was Chanie's Kosher Takeout. The Fogelmans were very happy, but...

12:04 Speaker 2 I didn't see any other way, you know? We are, we are shluchim, so it's the Rebbe's bracha, so it had to be first place

12:13 Speaker 1 And they, uh, gave us a $500 donation.

12:16 Speaker 3 They invited us to come to their office. They gave us, like, those big checks.

12:20 Speaker 1 And this coming July 4th, you're gonna cater our company picnic.

12:23 Speaker 5 Best food. We want them at our event. So we're gonna continue the relationship that way. Any time we want anything catered, we know who to call.

12:33 Speaker 1 Business has picked up even more after Chanie's big culinary victory. There have been stories in The Boston Globe, the Worcester Telegram, and on Boston-area news broadcasts. And it's just been crazy since then. I mean, it's really, really been something. Now Chanie's is open Monday through Friday, barring Jewish holidays. Thursday is the biggest night, when it's not uncommon to see the takeout line stretching several hundred feet from the order counter all the way out the front door. And there are lots of sit-down customers these days, like Dr. Larry Bache, a professor and associate dean of research at the Massachusetts College of Pharmacy School of Optometry. Today he's enjoying chicken tenders and fries, but his go-to delicacy is the pastrami sandwich.

13:22 Speaker 6 But it has to come with coleslaw and Russian dressing. It's what Hashem has for lunch every day, you know, and a cream soda. A lot of people in the Jewish community come together here, and I mean, everybody talks to each other and walks from table to table. And it's just very friendly and happy. It's a very happy, uh, atmosphere here.

13:39 Speaker 1 Sergeant Leilani Pelt is a paralegal in the Massachusetts National Guard. She's here with her young son, who attends the Fogelmans' Hebrew school. She says she's seen people enroll their children after trying the takeout.

13:53 Speaker 7 It brings more awareness to the synagogue, and I think it also helps with maybe Jewish families who ha- don't have a shul. They start coming here, and they find the community that maybe they didn't have before.

14:05 Speaker 1 Today Pelt's son orders his favorites, the sesame noodles and the cucumber salad. She got the hot brisket sandwich.

14:12 Speaker 7 You can't beat the food that you get here, and it's all kosher.

14:16 Speaker 1 Pelt, like the Fogelmans, says she's been pleasantly surprised at the response of people in Worcester's non-Jewish community, like Patricia Haddad.

14:25 Speaker 7 I found out about it on Facebook, rave reviews about the food.

14:31 Speaker 1 Haddad is of Lebanese descent. She knows Middle Eastern food, but her favorite is pastrami. This is her first trip to Chanie's. Just don't ask her to pronounce the name of the takeout.

14:42 Speaker 7 Chain-ee's? Chain-is? Chain... Mm.

14:46 Speaker 1 Haddad says she'll eventually get the pronunciation because even though she hasn't yet tried the pastrami, she plans to come back for more based on the aroma alone.

14:56 Speaker 7 I just know I'm, I'm going to love it.

15:00 Speaker 3 We like to make it a happy experience coming here, really do, f- for everybody, Jews, non-Jews. We make it a really nice experience and give them a good memory that they came to Chanie's Kosher Takeout. Huh?

15:13 Speaker 1 As the Thursday night rush brings more customers, Rabbi Fogelman gives out some free samples to people waiting for their orders, or waiting to interview the customers. Here's a tip from your humble reporter. Try the cholent that simmers in a big pot to the right of the order table, and then buy as much of it as you can carry.

15:31 Speaker 3 Be careful. It's very hot.

15:32 Speaker 8 Thank you.

15:34 Speaker 1 10 Jewish men have gathered in the far corner of the sanctuary. They say the evening prayers as takeout customers bustle in and out. It might seem odd to some that talking with God and noshing pastrami are happening in the same room, but Chanie Fogelman says that in Judaism, both activities can be part of the same goal.

15:55 Speaker 3 When people eat kosher food, it's make the, um, spark stronger, the neshama stronger to be closer to Yiddishkeit. So it's not just like getting a good food and a quality food. It's also, like, spiritually.

16:12 Speaker 1 Business continues to boom at Chanie's Kosher Takeout. More and more local Chabad houses are running events catered by Chanie's. Rabbi Fogelman estimates the takeout sells about 400 pounds of pastrami, 300 pounds of schnitzel, and 100 pounds each of corned beef and brisket per month. He makes two trips a month to New York to restock. That's a lot of food, but none of it goes to waste. What isn't sold at the takeout is used for Shabbos meals at the Fogelman home and distributed to the elderly and the disadvantaged before Shabbos. Leftovers are sent to local college students when the Sabbath is over. When you began, did you anticipate that this takeout would be beneficial in so many different ways?

16:58 Speaker 3 No, not in this many ways.

17:00 Speaker 1 The Fogelmans estimate they've raised over $100,000, all of which goes back into community programming.

17:07 Speaker 3 Now we're busier than ever, and the growth is incredible.

17:10 Speaker 1 Rabbi says he's getting more and more advice from people who suggest that opening a dedicated restaurant would mean even more profit. His response...

17:19 Speaker 3 So I have to explain to them that's not my mission. I'm not here to be a restaurant. I'm here for a higher purpose, whether it's to show people kosher, whether it's to find a Jewish kid to come to day camp. And all these things are actually happening. They're really happening. This is the reality. This is real. Right on the table, here it is.

17:35 Speaker 1 There are nearly 4,000 Chabad houses around the world, each one offering its unique brand of outreach. Some offer kosher restaurants, although almost always in places that have a lot more tourist appeal than Worcester, Massachusetts. So would the Fogelmans recommend kosher takeout as a way for Chabad emissaries to meet more members of their communities?

17:56 Speaker 3 They can only consider it if both the wife and husband know how to cook. It's a huge effort. Huge. It means shopping. It means cooking. It means prepping. They really have to commit to it, but it'll be a benefit to them that they wouldn't believe. If they can do it, they're going to meet their community. They're gonna meet people that they've never dreamed of meeting.

18:16 Speaker 1 This model is what Fogelman half-jokingly refers to as pastrami shlichus. Rabbi, that's a gem of a marketing slogan. You should trademark that.

18:25 Speaker 3 That's correct. Right. So if you wanna meet people in your community, the first step is to get them to eat something. Once you get that, everything else, all the doors are open.

18:42 Speaker 1 I'm Gary Wolk. Thanks for listening to Lamplighters: Stories from Chabad Emissaries on the Jewish Frontier. We welcome your questions and comments about what you've just heard on Lamplighters. Please email us at podcast@lubavitch.com. And if you know of a great story involving Chabad emissaries or the people they inspire, please let us know about them. That's podcast@L-U-B-A-V-I-T-C-H.com. To subscribe digitally to Lubavitch International Magazine or to receive it at your doorstep, please visit lubavitch.com/subscribe. This is a Lubavitch International podcast.