Episode 37: "It's natural for you to give birth" 👶🏼 | With Nechami Segal, birth and life confidence coach, doula and childbirth preparation instructor

00:00 Speaker 1 At twenty-one, Nechami found herself accompanying a friend through childbirth, and the rest is history. She took a natural approach and, together with tools from Chassidus, built a childbirth-preparation method that shows things can be different—and should be. Join us for a deeply personal conversation about our first shlichus with Nechami Segal, founder of the “It’s Natural for You to Give Birth” method. This episode was recorded with the sponsorship of Pninim.com, Israel’s largest pearl importer. On the website and in the store in the Diamond Exchange district, you’ll find an enormous, stunning selection of original, distinctive pearl jewelry, without middlemen’s markups. So if you want to treat yourself to top-quality jewelry at the best price, Pninim.com. For details: 058-763-6736. A reminder: if you enjoyed the podcast and found it helpful, you’re warmly invited to pass it on and share it with anyone you care about. Intro, and we’ll begin. How can we turn our lives into lives of shlichus, full of meaning? I’m Chani Moskowitz, a shlucha in Kharkiv, Ukraine. On this podcast, we’ll meet women who have brought their shlichus into a variety of fields. Through them, we’ll help every woman find and refine her own shlichus in this world. Because living the lives we were created to live is as good as it gets. Shlichus as a Way of Life. Starting now. Welcome to another episode of Shlichus as a Way of Life. Today we have a special guest I’ve been waiting nine months to record a podcast with. Actually, exactly nine months minus a day. Plus a day.

01:47 Speaker 2 It’s like the podcast’s pregnancy.

01:49 Speaker 1 Yes, exactly. Because from the moment I came out of the delivery room, I knew we’d do a podcast someday. But because our guest works with births—

02:03 Speaker 2 Thanks to that.

02:04 Speaker 1 Thanks to that. Right, thanks to that. So we scheduled the podcast, and then it was, “Sorry, Chani, I’m at a birth.” Then we scheduled another date, and it was, “Sorry, Chani, I’m at a birth,” or “I’ve just been at a birth,” or “I’m about to have a—” In short, someone’s giving birth all the time. So—

02:19 Speaker 2 I truly learn so much from every birth I’m privileged to attend. So...

02:25 Speaker 1 How many births have you done? I mean, attended?

02:27 Speaker 2 Attended, yes. I counted up to 250. I used to write down each birth: the woman’s name, a few things that made it special, and what I learned from that birth. Then I stopped keeping track. I’d say it’s probably over 300 by now.

02:44 Speaker 1 Wow. How do you take all that in? It’s like G-dliness revealed, again and again and again. It’s—

02:52 Speaker 2 It’s being present for moments when you simply see the miracle of creation. And it never stops moving me. Every time, it’s an extraordinary experience all over again. Experiences of G-dliness, of miracles, and of each woman’s personal journey. Every birth is different. Every woman’s experience is different—what she brings forth from her inner strengths during that birth.

03:13 Speaker 1 Absolutely. So let’s go back a little, and tell us... First, give us some background. How many children do you have?

03:19 Speaker 2 So, nice to meet you. I’m Nechami Segal, a shlucha of the Rebbe in Netanya and mother to seven treasures, baruch Hashem: six girls and our prince, a boy. I’ve had the privilege of teaching childbirth-preparation material for many years now, since my eldest—who’s nineteen—

03:40 Speaker 1 Wow.

03:40 Speaker 2 A year after she was born, I was already accompanying a friend through childbirth. I realized I’d been privileged to discover something wonderful that, from other women’s stories, I knew they weren’t experiencing. I felt it was my shlichus to pass it on. Over the years, I accompanied more births here and there, with a strong sense of shlichus.

03:59 Speaker 1 Where did that suddenly come from? As the eldest child, were you curious about the subject, or...?

04:04 Speaker 2 No, no, not at all. The way I gave birth the first time—I spent a lot of time in the water, and it was a gentle, natural birth. I came away from it with a very positive experience, baruch Hashem, without needing stitches, without tearing. I realized that was something precious that women often don’t experience with a first birth. The tools that helped me give birth that way have helped hundreds of women to this day, baruch Hashem, and surely thousands through all the classes I’ve been privileged to teach. And that really is my shlichus: to give a woman the experience of feeling ready to give birth, of wanting to give birth—not just waiting for it to be over, not wanting to think about it, or thinking, “How frightening, another birth,” or being afraid of birth even before her first one.

04:55 Speaker 1 Why do you think it’s like that? You know, I remember when I was a little girl. Once I was walking down the street, and two women ahead of me were talking about childbirth. One told the other how painful her birth had been, and the other said, “Okay, well, everyone gets through it somehow.” I don’t know, I might have been eight. Ever since then, I remember telling myself, “One day I’ll give birth too. Well, I’ll get through it somehow.” It really stuck in my head. And I wonder, why do we grow up like that? Why is it like that?

05:24 Speaker 2 We really do live in a society that plants fears about childbirth. And every woman listening can take on the privilege and the responsibility of giving our daughters a positive message, because these things take root at such a young age. Look how that one sentence—after all, you must have heard so many other sentences as a child—

05:42 Speaker 1 Yes.

05:42 Speaker 2 And this one stayed with you. Look how long it’s lasted.

05:43 Speaker 1 Absolutely.

05:44 Speaker 2 Sometimes women come to me and say, “When I was little, I was at the dentist, and it hurt so much that I reacted in such-and-such a way. My mother said to me, ‘If this is how you are now, how will you give birth?’”

05:56 Speaker 1 Seriously. Wow, what a thing to say.

05:57 Speaker 2 And it stays with her. So what is that woman left with before giving birth, if not fear? If not being, as they say, scared to death?

06:04 Speaker 1 Maybe it’s a kind of bravado, like showing, “Look, I gave birth. I went through what’s supposedly the greatest pain there is,” and then spreading that feeling to other women. But it’s not right to do that.

06:15 Speaker 2 We need to change the way we think and make knowledge about childbirth accessible—to show that it’s possible. That’s our shlichus. Because it really is absurd. Who will bring the next generation into the world if not us women? Only we can do that. Yet our shlichus comes with our fears, our traumas, our scars in body and soul. That doesn’t make sense. We’re supposed to be experts at this. And the good news is that we can be. It’s simply a matter of giving women the knowledge and tools that, in the past, surely passed from woman to woman, generation to generation, mother to daughter. Think about our grandmothers. Where did they give birth? Our great-grandmothers?

06:52 Speaker 1 In the backyard.

06:54 Speaker 2 One woman told me, “My grandmother just walks around the house, pointing things out: ‘I gave birth to this child here. I gave birth to that child on this floor tile.’”

07:00 Speaker 1 Wow, that’s wild. Think about it.

07:02 Speaker 2 Those were our grandmothers. In other words, when births happened close to everyday life, a woman could accompany her sister through childbirth, support her neighbor or her sister-in-law during a birth. She would see, “She got through it well, and she got through it well, so when my time comes, I’ll be able to give birth like that too.” But whatever the historical reasons for most births now taking place in hospitals, that setting makes us think of birth as a medical problem. Yet most births are not medical events. Birth is part of what our bodies know how to do, just as every system in our bodies works and functions. We don’t need to teach our respiratory system to breathe, or our digestive system to digest food, or our bodies to recover from a virus after a few days. Our reproductive system knows how to function too. We just need to trust it and ease our fears.

07:58 Speaker 1 So you’re saying that I, or any other woman, know how to give birth, but the circumstances of our time and society put up all kinds of barriers that we need to remove so we can do it as naturally as, say, digesting food.

08:14 Speaker 2 That’s an excellent question, and it gets right to the heart of what childbirth preparation is. After all, my slogan is “It’s natural for you to give birth.” And we’re talking here about every kind of birth. Every woman, no matter how she gives birth—whether it’s a natural birth or not—Hashem gave her the knowledge to do it. So what happened to that knowledge? We hear birth stories; we see the statistics. What happened to us? Where is that knowledge of how to give birth? In some hospitals, we see that twenty percent—twenty percent—of births end in a cesarean section. That’s a lot. One in five women will finish a birth with surgery. What happened to us?

08:50 Speaker 1 Something has gone wrong here.

08:51 Speaker 2 Right. So where does that come from? To understand that, we need to understand how our bodies are built, where birth comes from, and what role the brain plays in birth. In the animal world, every female brings the next generation of offspring into the world, and they don’t go to any childbirth preparation course. Are they afraid before they give birth? Well, we have no way of answering that.

09:16 Speaker 1 We could ask one of them.

09:17 Speaker 2 Yes, but the point is that their brains release the hormones of birth, and they simply do it. And that same part of the brain gives us the knowledge of how to give birth, too. The thing is, we really aren’t like animals. What do we have in addition? Two brains: the front brain and the back brain. The front brain is the conscious mind; it’s about being in control of the situation. It answers question after question. It handles memory and learning—the part that’s active in all of us right now. The back brain is the subconscious, what isn’t under our control. When is it active? At night, when we sleep. We can’t control what dreams we’ll have, right? And where does birth come from? Is it under our control or not? Can a woman say, “I’m giving birth today, at three, four, and…”? No. Why? Because birth comes from the back brain. In other words, it depends on the release of hormones, the hormone that produces the waves of birth. What are waves? What we’re used to calling contractions—I like to change that term. If “waves” speaks to you, think about what “contractions” does to you. Just hearing the word contractions—what does it do to you?

10:24 Speaker 1 What does the Hebrew word for contractions actually mean? Where does it come from? It’s like the hinge of a door, or the axis of…

10:30 Speaker 2 A door hinge makes opening possible. Yes, it allows the door to open. And contractions also open the cervix. We also see in Tanach that the same word can mean messengers. So they’re messengers bringing you the news that in just a moment you’ll—

10:46 Speaker 1 Be able to hold your baby. A very…

10:49 Speaker 2 So this righteous woman is clicking her tongue, but most women associate it with—

10:53 Speaker 1 Yes, pain.

10:54 Speaker 2 Pain, and then—

10:55 Speaker 1 Tightening.

10:56 Speaker 2 Tightening and stress and closing up, pressure—and all those things are the opposite of giving birth. To give birth, you need to relax. It’s about opening, and about the release of hormones that produces what makes the waves happen. What are these waves, really? Why do I call them waves instead of contractions? They’re waves of love that bring you closer to your baby. There are gentle waves, right? Like waves in the sea. That already brings something calming to mind for a woman. And the uterus really does work in waves—the contractions of the uterus. Think of a tube of toothpaste: when we squeeze the bottom, what’s inside comes out through the opening. That’s how a wave works, too. The uterus contracts like a sack, and through the opening—the cervix—what’s inside, the baby’s head, is pushed a little farther and a little farther toward the opening as it widens, until the baby comes out. So you want those waves, because you want to hold your baby already. You want to give birth. Sometimes I ask a woman, “Do you really want to experience the waves of birth?” If she thinks about whether she wants contractions, sometimes she says no. Every woman will immediately say, “Yes, of course I want to give birth.” But wait—look me in the eye. Are you really ready to go through this process? And then it’s, “Wait, no, no, I’m not ready yet. I don’t want to. I’m afraid maybe this will happen to me.” And then come all the stories: what happened to this woman, the story I heard from that woman, what I heard as a little girl, what I’ve heard now, and what happened in my previous birth, if this isn’t her first. So what do we do with all those thoughts? Let’s see. Let’s go back for a moment to the fact that the back brain releases oxytocin. Oxytocin produces the waves of birth. We’ve understood what waves are, and oxytocin is released only when there’s calm

12:35 Speaker 2 and relaxation. It’s also called the love hormone. It’s released only when we feel safe, whenever we bond with someone else. It’s also released in a couple’s relationship. It’s released during nursing, which is a connection with the baby. And so that same wonderful hormone, the love hormone, sets birth in motion and helps it progress. So for birth to progress, what does a woman actually need? She needs her back brain to be active. And the remarkable thing is that these two brains work like off and on switches. When one is on, the other is off; they aren’t both active at the same time. So if a woman is afraid, worried, or tense—or even if there are bright fluorescent lights and people are asking her questions, making her recall things—all of that activates the front brain, and her oxytocin levels automatically drop. And then, where did labor go? Where are the waves I had on the way here—good waves? A woman gets to the delivery room, and suddenly they stop. How often do we hear stories like that? Then they tell her, “Oh, you’re not progressing.” What does she actually need? What’s called an oxytocin-friendly environment. Dim lighting, a little darkness, whatever she likes and whatever makes her feel good. Pleasant music, deep breathing, a message of safety and love. That allows the opening to progress. So what does a woman actually need to learn before giving birth? She doesn’t need instructions on how to give birth, any more than we need instructions on how to breathe. Reading another book or watching something else online isn’t what will make us more prepared for birth. Women sometimes tell me, “I took courses”—usually the courses offered by the health fund that provide information, or courses at hospitals that talk about what to do if something happens. “If this happens, we can do that.” I don’t even want to say what those “ifs” are, because we want to give a positive message, not bring in worries. But

14:26 Speaker 2 all that information doesn’t help a woman when the time actually comes. Women tell me, “Nothing from the course helped me. I got there to give birth and… I couldn’t even remember it.” Of course I couldn’t remember it. If I were remembering things, I wouldn’t be giving birth. The part of the brain responsible for memory isn’t supposed to be working right now. So what does a woman really need? Tools that prepare her emotionally and mentally to be calm, to feel secure, and to strengthen her belief that she can do it. And when that process uses the tools of Judaism and Chassidus, that’s the best there is, because it’s a teaching about the soul. We connect with the G-dly strengths that every Jewish woman has.

15:02 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

15:04 Speaker 2 Then it’s easier.

15:05 Speaker 3 I think that’s… I… Wait, I didn’t say that I took your childbirth preparation course, and that’s where all this started.

15:10 Speaker 2 An important detail.

15:11 Speaker 3 A minor detail. And I actually hesitated a lot, because I was quite close to giving birth. I think I was halfway through my eighth month. Suddenly I said, “Wait, a course.” And we’d been in touch before…

15:24 Speaker 2 Wait, before which birth did you take the course?

15:26 Speaker 3 Yes. I… I didn’t even know you had a course. I asked you, “Do you know of any online course I could buy?” And I hesitated, because I was about to have my fifth baby and had been through four births—two with an epidural, two without. For the two without an epidural, I had really worked on my mindset and chosen not to have one. And I said—how can I put this positively?—I kept asking myself, “Do I need this? Don’t I need this?” And something inside me said, “Knowledge is power. Come on, learn more.” From the moment I opened the first lesson, I just said to myself, “How does anyone give birth without learning this?” Because, I don’t know, it’s like… I don’t know, it’s basic. It’s really basic. Because, just as you said, the world puts so much on us. We live in a world where there’s concealment—concealment of the good, concealment of G-dliness—but it’s there. It’s there. Giving birth is something good, and it’s something you can do in an amazing, empowering way. It’s unbelievable that not everyone knows this. It really is. I remember taking the course and saying, “Where have I been until now? Where have I been?” It was just incredible. And I think the course really has—what do I mean, the course? I’m talking about you, about the whole approach—several things that address several different situations. Like what you said about creating an oxytocin-friendly environment—that’s the term—and, more broadly, coming in with confidence. Knowing what you’re walking into. Knowing how much strength you have in that situation. You know, so often people wish you an easy birth, but it sounds like they’re leaving it up to fate. Of course, with Hashem’s help, with Hashem’s help. Obviously Hakadosh Boruch Hu is there, and He is the One guiding the birth. But

17:20 Speaker 3 We have an obligation to make our own efforts, and the work we do with our minds has so much power to influence things, as with anything else. The mind rules the heart. In the end, we can come prepared, with tools to work through things in our heads and manage them. I really felt that firsthand. And there’s something else that’s less pleasant to talk about. That whole medical environment: you walk into the hospital, and right away there are the doctors, the emergency room, the ward, and they start giving you this whole list of labels. Okay, two and a half centimeters dilated, this and that, and you already feel like you’re in some kind of medical drama. You have to remember that everything is okay. Protect that little bubble of “I’m giving birth. I’m going through an enjoyable process. I came here for an experience.” I remember my husband saying to me, “I don’t get it—did you come on a school trip?” I had really gotten into it. I’m saying this now, nine months later, and I think to myself, wow, that’s incredible.

18:11 Speaker 4 You can see the excitement and the sparkle in your eyes.

18:13 Speaker 3 I just kept saying, “Wow, it’s finally here. How exciting!” And I had that sheet with the... Oh, I can’t even remember anymore. You say that memory makes us forget our births.

18:25 Speaker 4 You wrote empowering statements.

18:26 Speaker 3 Empowering statements.

18:27 Speaker 4 Personal ones, addressing your fears. Every woman has fears; that’s natural.

18:31 Speaker 3 Nechami explains something really cool in the course: you put all your fears down on paper, and then for each fear, you write a statement that neutralizes it. What was interesting was that I wrote a list of fears, wrote statements that neutralized them, and repeated them every day—homework, like you said.

18:50 Speaker 4 You’re amazing.

18:51 Speaker 3 And after a few days, I realized that a particular fear wasn’t there anymore. I didn’t need that statement anymore.

18:56 Speaker 4 It simply worked. It’s a tool that works.

18:58 Speaker 3 And the statements changed.

18:59 Speaker 4 Amazing.

19:00 Speaker 3 I also gave birth on Shabbos. So I could bring the sheet with me, but not the... Nechami also has an audio track with music that helps you relax, and I couldn’t use that. Maybe some rabbis would permit using it. I don’t know. Interesting.

19:16 Speaker 4 Each woman really should ask her own rabbi, because I’ve heard different opinions. I mean, you’re allowed to travel on Shabbos, you’re allowed to turn on the water heater.

19:21 Speaker 3 For a woman in labor, it’s very...

19:23 Speaker 4 Each woman should ask her own rabbi what’s right for her.

19:25 Speaker 3 It’s something you really need to ask in advance, because in the moment you can’t...

19:27 Speaker 4 You can’t call the rabbi.

19:29 Speaker 3 Interesting—maybe you can call him on Shabbos, too. Anyway, I had my sheet. You have to do the work in your head. You have to understand, to get into this mindset of “My mind is on my side here, and it’s going to determine what happens.” And I—look, I took the microphone from my own podcast. But I really do feel the need to say that with my previous birth, my fourth, there was a very difficult situation with the doctor, and they induced labor in ways I could have avoided. I know that in hindsight. This time I felt really confident. There was a moment when two doctors came in and said, “Okay, you’ve been here too many hours. We should induce labor now.” So I asked them, “Why?” There’s no way I would have said that before. No way. I said, “Why induce labor?” They told me, “It’s taking time. You know, it’s not good for it to take so long.” I asked, “Why isn’t it good for it to take time? Is there a problem?” I was hooked up to the monitor. “Do you see a problem?” “There are some slight decelerations.” So I said to them, “Give me five minutes to think,” like you say. Then, when the midwife came in, I asked her, “Tell me, what are these decelerations?” She said, “Look, between us, these are the decelerations you’d expect. They happen during contractions, and everything is fine.” So I said, “I’m patient. I can bear the... uh...”

20:44 Speaker 5 “I’m experiencing it.”

20:44 Speaker 3 “I’m experiencing it.” You should know, that’s really how I felt. Obviously it’s hard, but you learn to make room for it and even enjoy it. It sounds crazy, but that’s how it is. I remember my sister saying to me, when I was having pushing contractions, “Why are you laughing?” I was in the middle of pushing contractions and running through a guided visualization in my head. It’s just unbelievable. I had no laughing gas, no epidural, nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing. I’m not an angel, and I don’t have superpowers. I’m Chani, giving birth and feeling everything just like everyone else. But the mind has incredible powers. We have incredible powers that we can discover and use to have a completely different experience. Okay, I’m giving you back the microphone.

21:27 Speaker 5 When you say that, I think it’s the most important thing. Women can see, on a relatable level, that we’re all ordinary people. This isn’t some select group. It isn’t someone...

21:36 Speaker 3 Exactly.

21:36 Speaker 5 ...with a high pain threshold who can do it. It’s not just women who don’t feel anything and whose births are all easy. No, it’s any woman...

21:42 Speaker 3 Right.

21:42 Speaker 5 ...who does that work with her mind, as you call it. It’s really about the way our thoughts shape our reality, and we have a way to bring pain down to the level of sensation. Yes, it’s here, it’s present. No one gives birth in her sleep, but this is possible for me. I can do it, even with a smile, even laughing...

21:59 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

21:59 Speaker 5 ...feeling connected, with love. Then it stays with a woman as a positive memory, and she wants to give birth again.

22:04 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

22:04 Speaker 5 Women come out of the birth saying, “I want to give birth again.”

22:08 Speaker 3 Absolutely. And when you see wom... when you see success stories—I don’t remember, I saw a video of a woman, maybe it was Tiferes, during her first birth. You could see her a little earlier, working through the waves, and she was calm. You watch her and tell yourself, “It’s possible. It’s possible. This is something I can do.” That’s so different from what we usually hear during pregnancy: the story about this sister-in-law, that friend, that neighbor, that sister—what might happen, what emergencies things could turn into, and what situations we need to be prepared for. The story is actually the complete opposite.

22:45 Speaker 5 Right. So one of the important processes you go through with the tools from the course is changing your beliefs and perceptions. You can change the subconscious, because we’ve learned that birth comes from the subconscious. You can go in there, examine things, put them in order, clear the table, so to speak...

23:01 Speaker 3 Exactly.

23:01 Speaker 5 ...and build strong beliefs that strengthen you and move you toward your goals. And you knew how to ask the right questions. You knew how to connect confidently with what was right for you. Because sometimes a woman says, “They’re delivering my baby,” as though the birth has passed into someone else’s hands. But no. I’m saying this with such emotion—I really have goosebumps, if that can come across through the microphone: I want every woman in the world to take responsibility for her birth, to take responsibility for her womb. It’s ours, and it has such an impact on the babies who are born. It’s the earliest possible girsa d’yankusa, what we absorb in childhood. After all, we know that things from an early age affect us for life. The experience of birth is one of the most powerful things affecting the child who is born, affecting their personality...

23:38 Speaker 3 Wow, that’s true.

23:39 Speaker 5 ...their trust in the world. If a baby is born gently to a calm, happy mother who welcomes them with love. Every mother welcomes her baby with love. The question is how you get there—whether you experience the journey in a way that feels possible for you, that you connect with and love. That’s a lasting benefit for the child. A woman who comes out of her birth feeling empowered has a better relationship with her husband afterward, and breastfeeding goes better. Studies really show this. Her health is better; the child’s health is better. She gains so much. It’s worth every bit of preparation before every birth, to experience that change in perspective and come in with confidence. And the key is different for every woman, because each woman is afraid of something different.

24:22 Speaker 3 Absolutely. I think another thing that really characterizes this whole process is that you develop self-awareness, which is so necessary. Because you’re the one giving birth, as you said; you need to be active. You haven’t come to have someone else deliver your baby. You’re the one giving birth. The midwife is there, just in case, to catch the baby. But another very important thing to say is that birth really can go in many, many directions. Someone listening to us now might be thinking, “Okay, I’m not one of those women. I’m someone who gives birth with an epidural.” For example, you talk about the advantage of giving birth in a squatting position. I really wanted to give birth that way. In practice, the midwife didn’t—well, she didn’t let me at that moment.

25:06 Speaker 5 In upright positions generally, not necessarily squatting...

25:08 Speaker 3 Yes.

25:08 Speaker 5 Just not lying on your back.

25:10 Speaker 3 So in the end, I think I did. I was lying on my back and saying to her, “No, no,” and she said to me... I realized that at that moment, it was better for me to get on the same page as her. But it also helped me feel, “I’m here now; everything will be okay.” Wow. Okay, if I keep going, I’ll end up turning this into a childbirth-preparation course. But really, I think even a woman who plans to give birth with an epidural comes in with a completely different approach. And what happens before the epidural? Besides, sometimes you can’t get an epidural in the end. So come with a full toolbox, and give yourself the chance to have the best possible birth experience—and enjoy it as much as possible.

25:50 Speaker 5 Whatever scenario you find yourself in.

25:52 Speaker 3 Be prepared for every scenario. Yes.

25:54 Speaker 5 Now, you mentioned success stories, so I want to clarify that every birth is a success, no matter what tools a woman used or how the birth ended. What’s amazing is that even when women experience something different from what they planned, something that isn’t how they dreamed it would be, they come away feeling good. Because the main tool is knowing that Hashem is guiding your birth and trusting Him. If something differs from your plan, you know you’re in His hands, and you did your best. That’s why every birth is a success.

26:28 Speaker 3 Yes.

26:28 Speaker 5 And it depends on how the woman interprets what she experiences. So even in, say, the most extreme case, where the birth ended in a C-section—women tell me, “I had a C-section before, and now, after this course...” Yes, it’s a very extreme case, but it really illustrates the point. “This birth also ended in surgery, but my whole recovery was completely different because I accepted it. I didn’t fight reality. I was less disappointed. I felt the hashgachah pratis all along, in the way things unfolded. My connection with my baby was completely different.” In other words, whatever kind of birth she has, the tools from the course benefit a woman tremendously, because they’re tools for life.

27:07 Speaker 3 Absolutely. Give us something practical that can really help. I think the vast majority of women listening to us have given birth. I imagine so. I imagine so. Even someone who hasn’t can already picture herself in the delivery room right now.

27:20 Speaker 5 And if you haven’t, I’m glad you’re listening, because this is exactly the stage when I feel a responsibility to make sure young women get this knowledge. Then they can start having children on the right foot. Why should they need a healing experience later?

27:34 Speaker 3 Right.

27:34 Speaker 5 You can have a good experience with the process right from your first birth—

27:37 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

27:37 Speaker 5 —the whole process.

27:38 Speaker 3 On the other hand, if someone listening is already a grandmother, first of all, the Rebbe says we don’t cry over the past, and what happened was through hashgachah pratis. And think about whom you can pass this knowledge on to. Even if you’re someone’s sister, mother, grandmother or mother-in-law, the smallest piece of knowledge can help, and—

27:58 Speaker 5 Right. So no guilt trips.

28:00 Speaker 3 Yes.

28:00 Speaker 5 You did your best, and everything happened exactly as it was meant to. The past is hashgachah pratis; the present and future are free choice.

28:05 Speaker 3 Exactly.

28:06 Speaker 5 Now the choice is yours, and you can make it.

28:10 Speaker 3 Where do we start? Say someone’s listening right now. Let’s imagine a woman named Racheli, who’s six months pregnant, and all day long her sisters tell her horror stories. Even if she tells them she heard a podcast that gives you tools, they’ll say, “Forget it, that’s all nonsense. We’ve actually been through it.” What can you say to her?

28:34 Speaker 5 Okay, first of all, the most important box in our body is the brain. It has the greatest influence on our experiences in life and in birth. And I invite every woman, starting now, to stop listening to traumatic birth stories. When someone starts telling you about something you don’t want to happen to you, just say, “No, thank you,” and leave the room. I remember when I was in my ninth month, before my sixth birth. I’m a high school teacher, and I was sitting in the teachers’ lounge when the dramatic stories started. I’m sure every woman has experienced that on a park bench, and when you’ve experienced—

29:09 Speaker 3 What else is there to talk about if not births?

29:11 Speaker 5 Really, the power of the Infinite is revealed in birth, so there’s no end to what you can say about it.

29:14 Speaker 3 Exactly. Absolutely.

29:16 Speaker 5 And it started: “My grandmother,” “my aunt,” “my sister-in-law”—everyone had a story. Now, I was about to give birth. What about my mind? Don’t I get scared? I have feelings just like everyone else. I also had a responsibility to come to my own birth feeling confident. People know I’m the one who talks about birth, and I’m a doula, and—but when I was about to give birth myself, I chose to turn inward. I wasn’t there to talk to other people or convince them; I was focusing on myself. I never try to convince anyone, actually. I share the information, and each woman chooses for herself. So I simply chose to leave the teachers’ lounge. I finished my sandwich in the school office because I didn’t want to keep hearing those stories and take on more fears on top of the ones I already had and was working through. That ability to say, “No, thank you,” and switch on the filters in your mind—to decide not to listen to what doesn’t suit you or help you—is so important. Think about how you want to give birth, and speak to women who gave birth that way. That will give you strength. Find women who gave birth the way you want to, consult with them and draw strength from them. It makes such a difference. The beliefs a woman brings with her affect her ability to believe in herself.

30:26 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

30:26 Speaker 5 If I can do it, then anyone can. So whether you’re not yet pregnant or you’re already pregnant, start filling your mind with messages of confidence and calm about birth. That’s the first thing.

30:41 Speaker 3 Contemplation in the mind gives rise to feelings, which give rise to character traits that change the whole picture. We have a choice. We can choose what to think about. That’s a principle for life in general.

30:51 Speaker 5 Right.

30:51 Speaker 3 Replacing one thought with another. You may hear all kinds of things. I think what trips people up is the belief that listening serves them. You hear someone’s story—

31:01 Speaker 5 Exactly.

31:02 Speaker 3 —and think, “That way I’m preparing myself for every scenario. I’m hearing all these stories, so I know the range of possibilities.” But—

31:09 Speaker 5 “So that if it happens to me, I’ll know what to do differently from her to get a better outcome.”

31:13 Speaker 3 Exactly. And the basic thing to understand is: no, it doesn’t serve you.

31:17 Speaker 5 There’s no connection.

31:17 Speaker 3 There are other thoughts that will serve you.

31:19 Speaker 5 Exactly. There’s no connection between other women’s stories and your birth—none at all. Even your previous births don’t determine this birth. Every birth is unique, and through positive thinking you can shape your reality. We know, “Think good, and it will be good.” That’s the saying of the Tzemach Tzedek. And, “One who trusts in Hashem is surrounded by kindness.” The commentators explain that this means unearned kindness. You don’t have to think, “I deserve it.” No. Your trust brings you kindness—not listening to more stories of births you wouldn’t want to experience yourself. And when a woman changes her mindset and surrounds herself with a supportive environment—sometimes that’s hard. Many women tell me that when they start the course, it’s as though they get a taste of the light, and then they start spreading it and talking about it: “Wow, you can reduce pain! You can give birth in water! You can give birth calmly! You can relax! You can smile even when you’re fully dilated!” They tell other women all this, and then it’s as though someone lets all the air out of their balloon.

32:13 Speaker 3 Like, “Come on, get real,” right?

32:15 Speaker 5 Right. Her older sister says, “Just wait. Let’s see you after the first contraction.”

32:20 Speaker 3 That’s why I think it’s really important to believe in it. You can learn everything, but if you approach it with skepticism and don’t take it in—because ultimately, this is work you do in your mind. Only you can do it. If you don’t come with an open mind, it’s all on you. But that’s also something to be aware of: “I’m coming as a blank slate. I’m willing to listen and replace my old beliefs with new ones.”

32:48 Speaker 5 Right.

32:48 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

32:49 Speaker 5 Yes, it really is work, and it’s joyful work.

32:52 Speaker 3 Yes, you can really feel that. Wow. So what else, Nechami? What else does a woman approaching birth need to know?

33:00 Speaker 5 Well, there are physical things too. Besides mindset, there are practical things that are simply worth knowing. Things she can add to her diet that soften the cervix and allow dilation to progress efficiently. And there are ways to increase the flexibility of the ligaments and muscles so the baby’s head can move through the pelvis more easily.

33:22 Speaker 3 Exercises, basically.

33:23 Speaker 5 Exercises, right. It’s the kind of knowledge that, as you said, makes you suddenly think, “How did I not have this for my previous births?”

33:30 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

33:30 Speaker 5 It’s a must.

33:31 Speaker 3 Right.

33:32 Speaker 5 And sometimes it really is different from what’s customary in hospitals. A woman enters the delivery room and understands that she’s supposed to give birth there, and there’s a bed. It’s as if, where does the patient belong? In bed. But what place does a bed have in childbirth? Let’s see what our sources say. In Tanach, we see a woman crouching to give birth. It says, “sitting on the birthstool,” and in Parshas Shemos, with the midwives, Pharaoh tells them, “Look at the birthstool.” What is that? Rashi explains: the chair of a woman giving birth. Where does a woman give birth? On a chair? Not on a bed.

34:05 Speaker 3 Why did it become this way?

34:07 Speaker 5 Because that position is easier for the doctors. If they need to intervene, they don’t have to bend down. It’s easier for them to see...

34:14 Speaker 3 Control.

34:15 Speaker 5 And to control the woman giving birth.

34:18 Speaker 3 Yes.

34:18 Speaker 5 But...

34:18 Speaker 3 In a sense, you actually lose control when you’re in that position.

34:21 Speaker 5 Completely, completely.

34:22 Speaker 3 Although, again, it’s important to point out that even when you end up in that situation, you can still do the work in your mind and control what you can. But it’s important to know about other options, and what the ideal actually is. What’s ideal.

34:34 Speaker 5 Right, any position that lets gravity work downward. I mean, what makes sense? The baby’s head is moving down, so gravity...

34:41 Speaker 3 Gravity.

34:42 Speaker 5 Gravity is a huge advantage in childbirth. You can give birth standing, sitting, or on all fours. All those positions also reduce pain and help labor progress. There are other tools, too.

34:57 Speaker 3 There are tools that can help speed things up and move the... forward during contractions. Mainly in your mind too, I think. Oh, I don’t want to go into too much detail about my birth story, but I had this real moment...

35:11 Speaker 5 But do tell us what helped you.

35:13 Speaker 3 I had this moment after several hours of contractions, and the midwife said to me—after the doctors had come in and told me what was going on and all that—she said, “I think something is a little stuck for you.” And I realized there was something I needed to release a little in my mind, and then in my body too. I won’t go into too much detail, but there was this movement where I said, “Okay, I’m opening up, I’m letting go,” and it really gave things a boost. And sometimes women say that once they were given an epidural, once they were connected to it, suddenly labor progressed.

35:49 Speaker 5 Exactly. Why? Because relaxation helps labor progress. The uterus is a muscle that works in harmony only when it has plenty of oxygen. It has circular muscles and longitudinal muscles. Picture a kind of crisscross pattern forming a sac. They need to work together, and for them to work in harmony, plenty of oxygen has to get there. How does plenty of oxygen reach an internal organ? When the woman breathes deeply and isn’t stressed. That means she isn’t afraid or worried. And the brain doesn’t distinguish between imagination and reality. Everything might be fine right now, but the woman imagines a scenario she doesn’t want to end up in, and to the brain it’s as though that’s happening right now...

36:24 Speaker 3 That’s the reality.

36:24 Speaker 5 And it simply sends less oxygen to the uterus, so dilation progresses less...

36:30 Speaker 3 Wow.

36:31 Speaker 5 And the contractions get farther apart. Or it can even be full throttle—you’re having contractions, but you’re in neutral, and dilation isn’t progressing. So what do you need in order to progress? First of all, your inner state. Yes, your mindset is the most powerful tool of all. Once a woman is calm and feels secure—and there really are practical ways to get there—it might sound mystical, this idea of thinking differently. But it isn’t. In the end, it comes down to very practical tools. A woman knows: one, two, three. You might think there’s no time to do deep inner work. Say a woman is now in her sixth month. Can she resolve all her inner challenges? We all have unresolved things. So there really is a kind of shortcut, a way to speed up the process. When a woman uses it, she can truly reach a state of deep relaxation and confidence. Then, when she breathes deeply and is calm, with those inner issues settled, labor progresses.

37:19 Speaker 3 Yes. On the one hand, it really is a process you go through. I actually started the course late. How much time did I have? In practice, I gave birth in week forty-one, so I had a little time, but to be safe I finished it beforehand. Besides, I enjoyed it so much that I devoured the course. Remember I called you and said, “Open up the next lesson for me already! I’m curious to hear it.”

37:37 Speaker 5 What did you tell me—that in four days...

37:39 Speaker 3 I finished.

37:40 Speaker 5 You finished watching the whole course.

37:41 Speaker 3 Yes, yes.

37:41 Speaker 5 It was like...

37:42 Speaker 3 From morning till night, at double speed. Yes, because this was already my fifth birth, there were a few things I sped through a bit—things I knew—but not many. Most of it was new to me, and there were a lot of things I wanted to hear again, but I didn’t have time. We also moved house right afterward. But wait, I brought this up because there was something specific I wanted to say. What were we talking about just before?

38:05 Speaker 5 That being able to let go emotionally allows labor to progress physically.

38:09 Speaker 3 Oh, the process. I wanted to say that you really do go through a process to reach that level of ability. Whether it’s practicing that amazing guided imagery...

38:21 Speaker 5 Mm-hmm.

38:21 Speaker 3 You know, I did—Nechami holds this gathering for women preparing to give birth. I didn’t attend in person; I joined on Zoom. That’s when I understood the importance of practicing the guided imagery. I did it, and it simply works. You enter another world, and it worked for me during labor. I won’t tell you what I was imagining, but it was just wow, wow, wow. Do you realize that I’m remembering the moments of my labor that should supposedly have been the most painful, and I’m on a high? It’s incredible, absolutely incredible.

38:54 Speaker 5 I want to talk about that high. Besides the oxytocin—

38:57 Speaker 3 I’m full of oxytocin right now.

38:58 Speaker 5 Exactly, you can see it in your eyes. Besides oxytocin, there are other special hormones called endorphins. They’re natural painkillers. It’s like an epidural from the brain. They’re released when a woman is truly calm and relaxed, and they’re related to morphine. It’s like a drug.

39:14 Speaker 3 And when you know that while it’s happening—I’m remembering now that I really did know it—when you remember that your breathing is going to help relieve the pain, you say, “Okay, I’m taking this medicine,” so to speak—

39:25 Speaker 5 Yes, yes.

39:25 Speaker 3 And you’re in a process where you have one hundred percent control. It’s incredible. It really is incredible.

39:30 Speaker 5 There’s something confusing about the words “relaxation” and “control.” They’re opposites. So which is it—am I in control, or am I letting go? You control your fears. When you control your thoughts, you’re able to relax and let go.

39:44 Speaker 3 That’s something—

39:45 Speaker 5 You don’t know what will happen when the moment comes.

39:46 Speaker 3 For your whole life. I think you really teach a lot of tools drawn from Chassidus, from its teachings about the soul and how we can manage ourselves.

39:56 Speaker 5 From Tanya.

39:56 Speaker 3 We need to learn to manage ourselves through Tanya. These are tools that then stay with us in every situation. You mentioned the dentist earlier. You can sit at the dentist’s office and use guided imagery too. In the end, our lives are full of challenges, of potential pain.

40:15 Speaker 5 Someone told me that laser treatments don’t hurt her anymore after taking the childbirth preparation course.

40:20 Speaker 3 Yes, because you’re learning to manage the—manage the pain, manage the fear.

40:23 Speaker 5 Your sensations. Right, right.

40:24 Speaker 3 And to control yourself by managing your thoughts. It’s amazing. So what I wanted to ask you is: yes, you go through a process. I was a little worried that I was going through it too quickly, though it turned out to be fine. I mean, I would have liked time to do more exercises and things like that. But what about someone listening to us now who’s in week thirty-nine?

40:45 Speaker 5 Amazing.

40:45 Speaker 3 Or someone who might even give birth this evening. Give her a tip—the shortest route to something that will help her.

40:54 Speaker 5 First of all, check in with yourself about what makes you feel good. Do that for yourself, and bring it with you to the birth. Do you like a pleasant scent? Bring it along. Good music? Make yourself a playlist of what you want to hear. Surround yourself with the people you want there to support you, and talk with them beforehand about what you want to hear and what helps you. One woman wants to hear, “You’re amazing, you’re a hero, you’re a lioness.” I’ve heard so many kinds of support. It’s different for everyone. Just figure out what helps you and communicate it to whoever is with you. What do you want your husband to say? If your mother is coming to the birth, talk through your expectations with her. Don’t bring pity or a sense of helplessness into the room. “Oh, you didn’t sleep all night. How will you have the strength?” A woman giving birth doesn’t need to hear things like that. She has strength that the others in the room don’t have. The mother hasn’t slept, the doula hasn’t slept, her husband hasn’t slept, but the woman giving birth has infinite strength—the power of creation revealing itself through her. Her hormones are working differently. Those endorphins really give her a feeling of strength, a kind of high, a sense that she can make it through this journey. So just lift the energy. When you’re with a woman in labor, only encourage her. No matter what’s happening: “You can do this. You’re capable. You’re closer than ever.” Those things are always true.

42:05 Speaker 3 Yes, with every moment that passes, you’re closer than ever.

42:07 Speaker 5 Exactly. Just give her that confidence—show her that you believe in her. Because what fills the room now is what will fill her mind. She can always play the audio track with relaxation and guided imagery. She downloads it onto any device and listens, whether through headphones or out loud in the room. It creates a completely different atmosphere. Women giving birth say, “Wow, it’s magical in here.” You walk into the room and just want to stay.

42:29 Speaker 3 Have you encountered resistance from medical staff? I’m sure you have, I think, right? Say a woman arrives with you, and while you’re there she says, “I think this, I want this, I feel this,” and she’s told no.

42:44 Speaker 5 Look, there really has been a major shift in delivery rooms today.

42:48 Speaker 3 Yes?

42:49 Speaker 5 The natural approach has really taken hold. Medical centers and hospitals showcase it; they put it front and center: “We have a natural birthing center,” “You can give birth in water here”—

42:58 Speaker 3 Yes, but what happens in practice?

42:59 Speaker 5 Okay, in practice, it’s a matter of different approaches—

43:00 Speaker 3 For example, I gave birth at a certain hospital that I won’t name. I’ve given birth at four hospitals in Israel by now. I’m really sampling them all.

43:06 Speaker 5 Yes.

43:06 Speaker 3 So I happened to be stuck there during COVID, and I gave birth there. It was really awful, especially how they kept pushing and rushing me: “Come on, get out of the delivery room already.” Then a few months later I saw an ad for the place: “With us, this and that—come to us, we do things naturally.” And I thought, if they’d asked me... I mean, the overall approach may be progressing, but in the end you can get a doctor or a midwife who doesn’t care about anything they advertised in the paper.

43:36 Speaker 5 Yes, the approach of the place—

43:37 Speaker 3 Or even the delivery room next door. Even if you yourself are in a natural birthing room, they have a different protocol, a pattern they’re used to. How can I, on the one hand, stay in control of myself and do the inner work that will make birth a positive experience, while on the other hand managing the whole situation? Sometimes you also have to manage all the people who came with you. I mean—

44:00 Speaker 5 Be their host.

44:01 Speaker 3 Yes, and stand up to the medical team.

44:04 Speaker 5 Yes. So first of all, it’s really important for the woman giving birth to be firm about what she wants. When the staff see that she wants something specific, they understand that it matters to her. That’s her approach, and they allow it. From what I’ve experienced firsthand, I do see them allowing it. In very rare, extreme cases, a woman can ask to—It’s also a good idea to say when you arrive at admissions, “I want a natural birth, and I want to work together with the team.” They all want what’s best for you. They do holy work, sometimes under difficult conditions, with one person covering several rooms. They genuinely want to help as much as they can. In an extreme case, if you see that this really isn’t right for you, know that you always have the right to ask for someone else. And you don’t have to be the one managing that yourself. Ask whoever is with you to do it—that’s something to arrange beforehand with your husband, your mother, your doula, whoever is there. Usually it’s important for a family member to say it, because you’re a customer. Hospitals compete for women giving birth, right? They advertise. After all, you never see an ad saying, “Come get your cast put on here.”

45:11 Speaker 3 Yes.

45:11 Speaker 5 But you do see ads saying, “Come give birth here.” Why? Because they earn a lot from it, and they want you to leave happy so you’ll come back and recommend them to your friends. So that’s an important card to have—use it. They want you to be satisfied. Ask for what you want. There’s always someone there who will go along with you. You just have to find that person on the shift. One woman arrived at the delivery room for her first birth. She really wanted to be in the water, so she got into the shower. She told me about this afterward; I wasn’t there. The midwife knocked and said, “Come out, I need to examine you. Come lie on your back. What am I supposed to enter into the computer?” And she told her, “Then bring me another midwife who’s willing to deliver my baby while I’m on all fours, who’s willing to let me stay on all fours.” That midwife left, and the shift supervisor and another midwife came in. They allowed it. She gave birth to her first baby on all fours. She came out so satisfied and happy. It was simply a matter of communicating what she wanted. Now believe in it. Daven that you’ll have the right people sent to help you. Believe that it’s possible, and with Hashem’s help you’ll experience that good.

46:15 Speaker 3 I think it’s also about believing you deserve it. I mean, don’t come to the hospital feeling as though they’re doing you a favor, that you have to go along with everything. “They’re the doctors, and who am I?”

46:25 Speaker 5 “They know more than I do.”

46:26 Speaker 3 Yes. And that’s why having this knowledge is so important. When they tell you something, you understand what they’re talking about. Even just knowing the stages of labor—that’s something I didn’t know before. I gave birth four times without knowing it.

46:38 Speaker 5 Yes.

46:38 Speaker 3 About the initial stage and the latent stage. I still remember the—

46:41 Speaker 5 The initial stage and the latent stage, yes. Being able to stay at home as long as possible, under the best conditions. Along with that, I do want to stress that Hakadosh Boruch Hu gave us medicine as a beneficial body of knowledge, and medicine saves lives. It’s just that when it comes to birth, the way delivery rooms and maternity wards are set up often doesn’t fully serve the woman’s interests. They’re busy, there are women in the hallway, and they need to free up the room. Those things have nothing to do with the health of the woman giving birth.

47:13 Speaker 3 The hospital has other interests.

47:14 Speaker 5 It has other interests. So it’s important to gain the tools to tell the difference: when is this a medical situation where I’m glad medicine is available and I’m willing to accept it, and when can I say, “No, thank you,” and create a healthier experience for myself?

47:31 Speaker 3 Exactly, exactly. Wow. Wait, so we were in the middle of talking about what a woman could know—

47:39 Speaker 5 When she’s about to give birth.

47:41 Speaker 3 Yes, very soon.

47:42 Speaker 5 Very soon.

47:42 Speaker 3 What could help her?

47:44 Speaker 5 So we talked about practicing breathing. How do you do it? Simply breathe in much more air—as much as you can. Really fill your lungs like a balloon, draw the air down into your belly, and then breathe out slowly.

48:06 Speaker 3 As you say that, I find myself starting to breathe that way. Like so many things, it’s good in general to be aware of our breathing. And besides the birth course, you also teach all these tools from Chassidus through—what do you call it? Nefesh Techilah?

48:19 Speaker 5 Mm-hmm.

48:20 Speaker 3 You teach all the tools from Chassidus through—what’s it called? Nefesh Techilah?

48:24 Speaker 5 Right. The main idea of Nefesh Techilah is for a woman to understand that everything happening in the body and everything happening in the world comes from its source in the soul. As the Rambam says, a healthy soul in a healthy body. We know that when we’re calm inside, things work out better with the children and in our marriage. So these tools of awareness—boruch Hashem, I’ve had the privilege of studying and teaching Tanya for many years, since before I got married.

48:50 Speaker 3 Wow.

48:51 Speaker 5 I taught classes for young women before I got married, and after I married, for women from all different communities. It’s amazing how each time these teachings reach the deepest places in the soul. Every woman connects with them and truly gains tools for a happier life, a life more in harmony with every part of herself—to be happier.

49:11 Speaker 3 What a gift, truly.

49:12 Speaker 5 And now, with the growth of digital platforms, I’ve started the Oshos Chayim club, where a woman anywhere in Israel or around the world can study Tanya and get practical tools to make her life happier.

49:25 Speaker 3 Absolutely. Oshos Chayim. Is that what you call it, Oshos Chayim? Or am I imagining it?

49:28 Speaker 5 Exactly. It’s called Oshos Chayim, and it’s not—the Oshos Chayim program isn’t about pregnancy and birth.

49:33 Speaker 3 Right. But here you are talking about pregnancy and birth, and every, every, um, every area you mention, I think: it’s good to know this for all of life. Because in the end, it really all comes back to the same point: knowing how to handle things.

49:44 Speaker 5 Right, right.

49:45 Speaker 3 And “handle things” might sound a little heavy. It’s the opposite: knowing how to live.

49:48 Speaker 5 Knowing how to live. So that’s what the Rebbe says: instead of calling them challenges, we call them... Sorry, it starts like this: instead of struggles, we call them challenges, or instead of difficulties... I’m getting more precise as I remember the actual wording. Instead of difficulties, we have struggles. Challenges, right? But we can also call them opportunities. So birth is an opportunity. Everything difficult in my life is an opportunity for growth. It’s an opportunity for healing. Hashem doesn’t put you in any situation for no reason. Everything has a purpose. Ask why Hashem is bringing this situation into my life. Once you listen to your inner voice and have an answer, when a woman does that homework, things work themselves out and she grows. It’s a nisayon, a test, that brings a nes, a miracle, and lifts you up. So when you get tools for growth, that’s really the spiritual work of every pregnant woman. She’s experiencing growth and change in any case, and she’s doing that spiritual work too. These are tools that help her during birth, and they’re tools for life.

50:50 Speaker 3 Completely, completely. I also think that the way you experience things really affects the atmosphere in the whole house. For example, with this birth, I really had far fewer worries. Not just fewer worries—I was so looking forward to it and already wanted to go through it well. I don’t remember who I was talking to before the birth. About two weeks before the birth, she said to me, “So, are you getting ready?” I said, “What do you mean? I can’t wait.” And she thought I’d fallen out of a tree. She said, “What do you mean, you can’t wait?” I can’t wait to go through it. You know, I’m not waiting to be on the other side of it. I’m waiting to go through it.

51:20 Speaker 5 To be in it.

51:21 Speaker 3 Yes, to be present in the experience. And I’m sure my daughter, who’s already almost—she was eight—that she could sense it. She could sense that this was a positive experience.

51:34 Speaker 5 And that her mother was looking forward to it and happy about the birth.

51:37 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

51:37 Speaker 5 Wow, that’s a gift you gave her for life.

51:39 Speaker 3 It really is. Because ultimately, that message isn’t something you can teach. You can only convey it through yourself, through how you relate to something and how you truly feel. So it’s just amazing.

51:50 Speaker 5 Another tool that really helps everyone is being here and now. What does it mean to be here and now? Not thinking about the past or the future, but about this moment. Say a woman is in labor. Be here and now. There’s a wave right now, so you just breathe through it.

52:05 Speaker 3 Wow, that really helped me.

52:07 Speaker 5 Now you’re between waves, so you just rest. You might even fall asleep. You always have those gifts of a break, even when you’re very close to giving birth. Rest and gather strength for the next wave. Now, what does it mean to be in the past? It’s thinking, “Oh, I didn’t sleep all night. How will I have the strength?” For example. Or being in the future: “If this is how I feel now at six centimeters, what will happen at nine?” Sometimes just a woman’s fear of what will happen—

52:31 Speaker 3 Our automatic reaction takes us straight there. It’s, it’s crazy.

52:34 Speaker 5 Right. And really, you have to do the opposite of that automatic reaction: whatever happens will only be good. The One who gave you the strength for now will continue to give you the strength for later. The same One running the birth, the same Aluf, Alufo shel Olam—the Master of the world. Aluf starts with an alef. Add that alef to golah, exile, and you get Geulah, redemption. And according to Chassidus, pregnancy and birth are truly an analogy for exile and Geulah. So adding the alef is a tip for giving birth. That alef means letting go of the reins. It means knowing that control is in the Creator’s hands and that you can let go, rather than being afraid: “Oh, what will happen, and how will I have the strength?” Because you have the best person in charge. He is the doctor, the doula and the midwife. He is everything. To give birth, all you need is a mother, a baby and G-d. You have that anywhere, in any situation, and you simply can do it. So when you let go and leave it to Alufo shel Olam, you relax. And when a woman is relaxed, she really can be here and now, without worrying about what comes next. And with every challenge in life, you say, “Okay, what do I have in this moment? What can I do with the children at home right now, at this hour?” Give the—like you said, it affects the atmosphere at home, because when a mother is happy, the whole house is happy.

53:47 Speaker 3 Right.

53:47 Speaker 5 And when a mother feels good after giving birth, the whole household benefits.

53:51 Speaker 3 Absolutely. In general, after giving birth, when you’re more connected to yourself and to the experience you’ve been through, you’re not like, “Oh my goodness, I’ve just given birth, poor me, and...” You learn to see more—just as during the birth you saw more of the strength you had, so too afterward. Yes, I didn’t sleep last night, but what a gift I have in my arms, and what a privilege I have, and how much strength Hakadosh Boruch Hu gives me even though I didn’t sleep last night. Really changing your whole frame of mind is—

54:18 Speaker 5 It’s your inner dialogue.

54:19 Speaker 3 It’s revolutionary.

54:20 Speaker 5 The revolution is really in my inner dialogue. I can tell myself that I’m unfortunate and stay in a place where I feel like a victim and want people to pity me. Or I can tell myself: I’m strong, I can do this. If a woman tells herself during a wave, “I’m doing this. I’m strong. I can do it. I have strength”—yes, instead of “I don’t have the strength,” just say, “Hashem gives me strength.”

54:41 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

54:42 Speaker 5 That’s it. Even the longest wave is sixty, seventy seconds—no more. All you have to do is get through this wave. And a woman gets through one, and then another.

54:49 Speaker 3 Exactly.

54:49 Speaker 5 And gives birth with joy. Then she says, “Wow, did I really do that? Unbelievable.”

54:53 Speaker 3 Exactly. As they say, keep your head where your feet are. Be present, and it’s amazing. It’s amazing. How old were you when you first accompanied someone during birth?

55:04 Speaker 5 Uh, twenty-one. Twenty-one, twenty-two, something like that.

55:08 Speaker 3 Before—had you—did you accompany a birth before you’d given birth yourself?

55:10 Speaker 5 No, no.

55:11 Speaker 3 After.

55:12 Speaker 5 Yes. I got married at twenty, gave birth at twenty-one, and my oldest was a year old then. My firstborn was a year old.

55:19 Speaker 3 Sorry, we breezed through the midwives and all that.

55:23 Speaker 5 Listen, the woman I accompanied was actually a friend, very close to my age, and she wanted me to come with her for the birth. It was twelve hours at Tel Hashomer. I’ll never forget it. She had a natural birth, and she still thanks me to this day for that experience. And that really opened the door to—

55:41 Speaker 3 It made you want to do more. How amazing. But I don’t think you mentioned that you’re also a biology teacher. That fits so well.

55:48 Speaker 5 Right. So a few things. Also, as a high-school biology teacher, when—

55:53 Speaker 3 What don’t you do?

55:55 Speaker 5 Sweetheart, plenty.

55:56 Speaker 3 No, you didn’t mention that you’re also a bridal instructor. Or did you? No, I don’t think so.

55:59 Speaker 5 No, definitely not. Yes, that’s true. Really, it’s all the same—

56:02 Speaker 3 Right, it all connects so well. It’s amazing.

56:04 Speaker 5 It’s that body-soul connection. Because biology is the body. So I bring that into the classroom too. I try to bring it together with the soul and that inner connection. Preparation for marriage is also about body and soul. There are the halachos, there’s the outlook, and there’s the physical connection to the body and to the experience. And when a bride comes to it with confidence, it’s amazing how that also affects her pregnancy and her birth experience.

56:28 Speaker 3 Right. Do you already bring a little about birth into your bridal instruction?

56:31 Speaker 5 Of course, of course. In fact, two weeks ago I was invited to a training program for bridal instructors. I taught them a class there called “Preparing a Bride for Her First Pregnancy,” and it’s very important to talk about it. Sometimes brides become pregnant within a month or two, and even if it’s after a year—

56:52 Speaker 3 It’s no less important.

56:52 Speaker 5 The instructor. Yes, uh, the bridal instructor is sometimes the only person who gives the bride guidance on these subjects. Sometimes a bride will turn to her, or she won’t, and what she received from her will be all she has on the subject. Certainly in the first weeks and months of pregnancy, when she’s still keeping it private and won’t tell anyone. So it’s a real shlichus to give her that message of confidence while she’s still a bride. But let’s go back a little further. What happens in high school? I prepare students for their biology matriculation exams, and sometimes a student will suddenly say in class, “I’ll only give birth with an epidural.”

57:33 Speaker 3 And she doesn’t notice which teacher is standing in the classroom.

57:36 Speaker 5 I stop the lesson. Now, I completely respect that choice, and an epidural can be good sometimes. As we said, when a woman relaxes, labor can progress. If she has no other way to relax, it’s good that an epidural is available, because it can help her relax and move forward.

57:48 Speaker 3 Yes.

57:48 Speaker 5 If, at that point, she can’t use other tools, or she’s used them and that’s it—

57:51 Speaker 3 No, there’s no ideal here of giving birth without an epidural. It’s about understanding what’s involved.

57:55 Speaker 5 Right. Right, right. The ideal is for you to be okay.

57:59 Speaker 3 Exactly.

57:59 Speaker 5 For you to come away with a good experience. You choose what’s right for you, and I truly believe every woman knows what’s right for her. Sometimes a woman has had unpleasant experiences with an epidural and simply wants to manage without one. And sometimes she’s open to anything and discovers she didn’t need it.

58:14 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

58:14 Speaker 5 It’s a medical intervention like any other, so it’s certainly worth avoiding if you can.

58:18 Speaker 3 Definitely.

58:18 Speaker 5 So let’s go back to the time—

58:19 Speaker 3 To the classroom. Yes.

58:21 Speaker 5 And when a student says that, it’s surely because of things she’s heard from family and friends. I stop the lesson and really talk about birth as something you can experience in a good way. They look at me like this, unable to believe it. You can give birth calmly? What, you can give birth—

58:38 Speaker 3 Wow, I hear you.

58:39 Speaker 5 Joyfully? You can give birth and it doesn’t have to be the nightmare of your life. Giving birth isn’t necessarily a trauma. You can look forward to it. I give them a taste of tools for easing pain, which, by the way, also help a girl with menstrual pain and at other times in life.

58:54 Speaker 3 The delivery room.

58:54 Speaker 5 We’ll talk about that. Right, right. I give them little bits that are appropriate for their age, and I tell them: When the time is right, you’ll learn there are more tools. But believe already now that you can do it, that you’re capable, and that birth can be a good experience. You can give birth while relaxed. Water eases pain. This really is a shlichus. And then, a few years later, they call me: “Teacher Nechami, I remember you said in class that you have tools to ease pain and that birth can be a good experience.” Then they sign up for the course. Sometimes they come to me for kallah classes first, and then the registration—

59:30 Speaker 3 Oh, wow, you’re really with them from the classroom all the way to the delivery room.

59:34 Speaker 5 It means accompanying them at such meaningful turning points in their lives. I remember a birth I accompanied—

59:38 Speaker 3 That’s a special connection.

59:39 Speaker 5 Of a former student, okay? There are students I’ve already accompanied through three births, boruch Hashem. I’m privileged to be there at such meaningful moments for them. Anyway, here’s what happened. The midwife asks the woman giving birth, “Who is she to you?”

59:53 Speaker 3 Okay.

59:54 Speaker 5 She means me, and the woman tells her, “She’s my teacher.” The midwife looks at her as if to say, “What’s gotten into you? You brought your teacher into the delivery room?”

1:00:02 Speaker 3 Wow, that’s incredible.

1:00:03 Speaker 5 So it really is a different kind of relationship. I very much speak with them as equals. I respect them the way I’d want people to treat and respect me, and apparently it goes both ways.

1:00:13 Speaker 3 That’s special. Really special. You teach someone for a few years, then you’re her kallah teacher, then you prepare her for birth and accompany her through it. Wow, the only thing you’re not is the sandak. That’s the one thing you haven’t—

1:00:23 Speaker 5 It really is a different approach to teaching. I feel it’s a shlichus too: being a teacher for life isn’t just about preparing students for matriculation exams. It’s listening to them and giving them answers to the questions that genuinely trouble them at that age.

1:00:37 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

1:00:37 Speaker 5 And to every young woman listening now, I mean this from the bottom of my heart: Do you have questions? Find someone you can approach. Don’t give up until you find answers that satisfy you. If one person doesn’t answer you, look for someone else. You deserve to live with peace of mind and feel connected to your way of life, to your identity, and to your womanhood too.

1:00:56 Speaker 3 Absolutely. Earlier, when you were talking about kallah teachers and this matter of pregnancy, I was thinking you should speak to biology teachers too—to teachers in general.

1:01:06 Speaker 5 I actually have a workshop that I give in high schools. I’ve been to several high schools around the country. It can be for twelfth grade, or for various study days about the Jewish home. Young people today are exposed to these things. They’re exposed to them anyway. It’s our shlichus and our responsibility to give them the information in a way that’s entirely holy. It’s reassuring, so they don’t need to look elsewhere, and it helps them too.

1:01:33 Speaker 3 Wow, amazing. It really is important for every girl to know that everything is okay and that there are answers to everything. Life isn’t one big tunnel of uncertainty. We have this gift called Chassidus, which really brings clarity to everything. And not just every girl—every woman needs to know that, and every Jew.

1:01:58 Speaker 5 And married life is a good thing. Being a mother is a good thing, and so is the path to motherhood. Sometimes a woman tells me, “I just want to raise them. I want to be handed the baby ready-made.” So don’t worry: Hashem didn’t make this journey for no reason. It’s about being ready to experience the birth rather than fighting it. There’s also a question of faith here. It says in the Tanach, “In pain you shall bear children.” So where does this idea come from? What is this fantasy?

1:02:26 Speaker 3 How can you come along and claim that it’s possible to give birth without pain?

1:02:28 Speaker 5 To have a good experience.

1:02:29 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:02:29 Speaker 5 A good experience. Yes, I want to emphasize that. Sometimes people say to me, “What, you said it doesn’t hurt?” No, I didn’t say it doesn’t hurt. I said you can experience it in a positive way, and there are tools that help. Above pain is suffering. Suffering is how you interpret the pain. If a woman interprets it differently, she isn’t suffering. Please, don’t suffer. I’m begging you. Every woman in Israel deserves not to suffer. Beneath the pain is a sensation. In other words, it’s possible. Okay, so how does that work? What about the pain mentioned in the Tanach? What about Chava’s curse? Someone told me she was walking through the delivery ward and heard someone in one of the rooms shouting, “Chava! The apple!” As if—

1:03:06 Speaker 3 Someone was calling her to account.

1:03:07 Speaker 5 Yes.

1:03:09 Speaker 3 Wow.

1:03:09 Speaker 5 So, yes, all those sounds and things you hear outside delivery rooms—know that that woman hasn’t been given guidance. She could have been given a tool right then that might have helped her. Don’t get stressed. If you’ve heard one woman sounding a certain way, you can have a completely different experience.

1:03:25 Speaker 3 Wow, that’s one of the things about the delivery room—the screams from the other rooms.

1:03:29 Speaker 5 So, young women listening now, don’t be frightened by that sentence.

1:03:32 Speaker 3 Yes. No, look at it the other way: you can recognize that you feel for her, that she’s in pain, without taking it as something that has to affect you.

1:03:42 Speaker 5 Actually, releasing the energy and moving through this journey by using your voice can be a kind of therapy. There is such a thing as voice therapy, but a woman needs to be taught what kind of sound to make.

1:03:52 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:03:52 Speaker 5 It’s important to make low sounds, not those high-pitched “ow” sounds, but a low sound. And that’s good. We won’t go into all the sounds now, but you can learn it, and it’s truly a way to find relief and ride out the wave. Okay, how did we get onto this? Let’s go back.

1:04:06 Speaker 3 Not to give people anxiety about giving birth.

1:04:08 Speaker 5 Yes, yes.

1:04:08 Speaker 3 How did we get onto this? Wait, wait, back, back, back. You hear another woman

1:04:15 Speaker 5 screaming. Let’s continue from there.

1:04:21 Speaker 3 Yes. You didn’t say—you said you might hear another woman screaming, and then… No. Okay, I’ve lost it.

1:04:27 Speaker 5 That even if you’ve heard—okay, even if you’ve heard women describe certain experiences, know that there’s an approach you can—

1:04:35 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:04:35 Speaker 5 Learn about, get to know and connect with, and it can help you. We were talking about preparing kallahs, right? From here, from here—

1:04:43 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:04:43 Speaker 5 We stopped.

1:04:45 Speaker 3 So, you were talking about the workshop you give in high schools. Wow, I hadn’t heard about that. How special.

1:04:50 Speaker 5 Yes, yes.

1:04:51 Speaker 3 It’s one of those things that makes me say you have to know which generation to be born into. Though really, it’s also a sign of the decline of the generations. I think… Right, it’s the kind of thing that makes you say, “Wow, why didn’t we have that?”

1:05:02 Speaker 5 Mm-hmm.

1:05:02 Speaker 3 But the need is greater today. It really is. That’s just how it is.

1:05:07 Speaker 5 Right.

1:05:08 Speaker 3 It’s something—

1:05:08 Speaker 5 It’s the ascent of the generations. These generations have more strengths, and that means they search more. And they deserve it. They deserve to learn all of this in an orderly, structured way, from someone with a sparkle in her eyes—

1:05:23 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:05:23 Speaker 5 So they come away wanting more, feeling that there’s something to look forward to. The whole subject of family purity is a mitzvah that needs to be presented as something to look forward to, because there’s no example they can learn from by imitation. Right? Everyone knows how to wash her hands because she sees her family doing it.

1:05:39 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:05:39 Speaker 5 But here there’s no imitation. Once we awaken that anticipation from a place of yiras Shamayim—because this is a mitzvah that women throughout the generations have given their lives for—you, too, will be able to fulfill it with joy and in a good way when the time comes. So you don’t even need to give too many details. When the time comes, she’ll hear about it and know everything. But she should know she has something wonderful to look forward to.

1:06:03 Speaker 3 Wow, really.

1:06:04 Speaker 5 And it’s the same with birth.

1:06:05 Speaker 3 Exactly. And it really all connects. This whole process you go through with women—it’s amazing. I can already picture you accompanying your daughters at their births and coming full circle again and again. It’s amazing.

1:06:18 Speaker 5 Wow.

1:06:18 Speaker 3 Have you ever thought of becoming a midwife?

1:06:20 Speaker 5 That’s a good question. I feel more like a teacher of childbirth. I’m probably a teacher at heart, which is why I haven’t left teaching entirely. People always asked me, “How do you do both at the same time?”

1:06:29 Speaker 3 How do you do both at the same time? Seriously, it’s not obvious, because being a teacher is a full-time job—

1:06:35 Speaker 5 Well, as a high-school teacher, more of my hours are focused on preparing students for their matriculation exams. At the same time, most births happen at night. It’s important to bear that in mind, because a natural birth, especially if the woman’s brain has initiated labor, will happen then. Anyone can think about the births she’s heard about around her and see that it really is so. Labor will start sometime between about seven in the evening and five in the morning. If her water breaks, it will usually be during those hours.

1:07:04 Speaker 3 Right.

1:07:05 Speaker 5 Why? Because the body needs to relax. You’ve checked off all the day’s tasks, and the drop in adrenaline and stress, and in the activity of the frontal brain, as we said, allows oxytocin to rise and labor to progress. So it’s never that a woman needs me at a moment’s notice. I’ve never had to leave a classroom and go straight to a delivery room. There’s always a process: it starts, then it progresses. And the amazing thing is that, with siyata diShmaya, things have simply worked out. I could write a book about it—hashgachah pratis. Say I had a practice exam on Monday and a matriculation exam on Thursday: the birth happened on Tuesday. It really fit in between.

1:07:45 Speaker 3 Here, too, you have to do that work of relaxing.

1:07:47 Speaker 5 Wow, wow.

1:07:49 Speaker 3 Incredible.

1:07:49 Speaker 5 First of all, I try to apply all these tools myself. I wouldn’t tell a woman to do anything that I haven’t felt works for me and helps me. I have affirmations of my own, too: “Births happen at the time that’s right for me and my family.” And I also have to say that I asked the Rebbe what I should give up. There was a point when I simply asked which one to leave, this or that, and I got a clear answer in Igros Kodesh: to continue in both roles—

1:08:16 Speaker 3 Wow.

1:08:16 Speaker 5 Both “teaching in the classroom as part of his work with the students” and—and these were the very words of that letter, which gave me strength—“his work among the adults in his community.” Both are very important roles, and he should continue in both with even greater vigor and strength. And with siyata diShmaya, it worked out.

1:08:35 Speaker 3 Wow, wow, wow, wow.

1:08:36 Speaker 5 But more than being with a woman during labor—women give birth all over the world, and being there for their births isn’t my goal. I do have a goal, though. Like I said, I’m a teacher of childbirth. I have a real passion for women to have good birth experiences. That’s my shlichus. So the tools I give them during pregnancy are what they’ll take with them into labor, even if they have another doula, and even if they don’t have a doula.

1:09:03 Speaker 3 That really is—

1:09:03 Speaker 5 Women send me messages afterward: “I felt you in the delivery room. You were with me.” But I’m not the essential part of it. You don’t need to have me there.

1:09:09 Speaker 3 That’s exactly right.

1:09:10 Speaker 5 It’s not me, but Hakadosh Boruch Hu. And that’s what women experience. They say, “The tools from the course helped me during labor, and we didn’t specifically need you.” Of course not—and that isn’t what matters at all.

1:09:22 Speaker 3 You can reach that point.

1:09:23 Speaker 5 Not being dependent—not on a doula or on anything else. You can give birth from within yourself. Of course you need to arrange support; that’s very important. It’s a must. But at the same time, everything depends on the siyata diShmaya you draw to yourself. How? Through letting go and having trust, and through making informed choices. For that you need knowledge, and that’s something you can get.

1:09:48 Speaker 3 Absolutely. I think this is also about taking the technological tools we have today and using them for holiness. Really. In the past, to prepare for birth, you had to physically go somewhere and sit face-to-face, whether in a group or one-on-one, and listen from beginning to end. Today you can speak to thousands of women while you’re asleep in bed. Someone who lives in—I don’t know—South America can listen and get these tools. That accessibility is amazing. At first you were working more as a doula, but now more women are listening to your course without actually having you there at the birth.

1:10:33 Speaker 5 And that’s a good thing. There’s no way I could be at every birth.

1:10:35 Speaker 3 Right. In other words, you’ve taken your strengths and passed them on in a more effective way.

1:10:40 Speaker 5 Right. For years, I’ve had this burning desire to get this message out to the world on a large scale. It doesn’t make sense for it to depend on my schedule. How many people can I meet in a week? It has to reach far more.

1:10:50 Speaker 3 You can multiply yourself. That’s...

1:10:52 Speaker 5 Oh, and this was before COVID, by the way. Digital courses started taking off during COVID, but I began before that, because that was exactly the goal: for a woman anywhere in the world to be able to watch from her own home. Now, I have to say I was very worried about it, because I strongly believe that the trust built during birth preparation is what makes it work. The woman’s confidence, something about that personal process—one-on-one or in a small group—is what makes it possible. Looking each other in the eye.

1:11:21 Speaker 3 A certain connection. Right.

1:11:22 Speaker 5 Right. It’s essential, especially with such an intimate subject. And then I said, “Let’s try.” I started, and women told me, “I felt as if you were sitting beside me in my living room, explaining it to me.” The trust that developed, and the results women came away with, strengthened my confidence that this really could work this way too. And it’s amazing. Probably the combination of models and slides also helps make everything as clear as possible.

1:11:49 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

1:11:51 Speaker 5 And there’s an advantage: a woman can watch at any hour. One woman even told me, “I woke up in the middle of the night in pain, opened the section on pain relief, watched you, did what you said, the pain went away, and I went back to sleep.” How could I ever have helped someone to that extent in an in-person course?

1:12:05 Speaker 3 Right.

1:12:05 Speaker 5 Right when she needed it.

1:12:07 Speaker 3 No way. Wow, you’re right. That’s incredible. You’re reaching so many women. And by the way, maybe this is a good opportunity to give the phone number where people can reach you, follow your status, see your content, and find out about and purchase the course. When I got here, I said to Nechami, “Oh, what a shame. We’ll publicize the course, and then some women will say, ‘I don’t have internet access, so I can’t watch it.’” And Nechami said, “No, that’s not a problem. The entire course is available on a USB drive too,” and showed me this lovely, colorful USB drive. So you can simply plug it into a computer and watch from beginning to end. You don’t even have to wait for a new section to open each week.

1:12:50 Speaker 5 You can watch it all at once, and it stays yours for life.

1:12:53 Speaker 3 Exactly.

1:12:54 Speaker 5 Yes.

1:12:54 Speaker 3 Oh, that’s amazing. So go ahead and give the phone number.

1:12:56 Speaker 5 Okay. For the content I post on my status, it’s 054-649-7702. You’re warmly welcome to follow. And for assistance, support, or questions, the office is here to help and available Sunday through Thursday, from nine to three, at 053-770-1089.

1:13:25 Speaker 3 Great! Tell me, can someone taking the course consult with you along the way or ask questions and things like that?

1:13:31 Speaker 5 Good question. There’s always a need for answers to questions.

1:13:36 Speaker 3 Because I’m trying to imagine how you can keep up with it all.

1:13:38 Speaker 5 Right, so I hold an hour of questions and answers on Zoom. I say an hour, but it always takes longer—

1:13:44 Speaker 3 It runs over.

1:13:44 Speaker 5 Because it really matters to me that every woman gets an answer. I won’t leave the Zoom meeting until every woman has had all her questions answered. You can ask anonymously, or send questions in advance and I’ll answer them. And if a woman can’t be there at the time, the recording goes up and she can watch it later. There’s an in-person meeting in Netanya, which has its own advantages. Women come out of it saying, “Now I feel like giving birth. Now I feel completely ready.” And for anyone who can’t come, there’s a parallel meeting on Zoom. Besides that, there’s also a support group.

1:14:13 Speaker 3 Which is amazing. I was at the Zoom meeting. I don’t—now I can’t even imagine what the in-person one is like.

1:14:17 Speaker 5 Yes. With refreshments too—

1:14:18 Speaker 3 The Zoom meeting on its own, yes.

1:14:19 Speaker 5 A little pampering, and the option of getting a booklet. Here, you can also, um, see—

1:14:23 Speaker 3 Getting ready for the next birth already.

1:14:25 Speaker 5 Yes, yes. A booklet that brings together all the material and exercises. Of course, anyone who doesn’t come in person can get it by mail too. In addition, I’ve opened up other program options. Besides the program we’ve been talking about until now, which is Platinum, there’s also VIP, where you can get an answer to any question within twenty-four hours from a professional doula who studied with me. She’s a mentor in the “Natural for You to Give Birth” method. And also—

1:14:48 Speaker 3 You train doulas too.

1:14:50 Speaker 5 Yes. And two consultation sessions—phone calls during the pregnancy. So anyone who wants even closer support has the VIP program too.

1:15:00 Speaker 3 Yes. And by the way, it’s important to mention that I think a lot of women don’t know they can actually get reimbursed by their health fund for the course.

1:15:07 Speaker 5 They come out ahead. Women come out ahead because they get seventy-five percent reimbursed by the health fund, and some hospitals give reimbursements too.

1:15:15 Speaker 3 Oh, really?

1:15:15 Speaker 5 Like Laniado, Shaare Zedek, Hadassah. Then they get another reimbursement—five hundred, six hundred shekels, two hundred and fifty. Each hospital—

1:15:22 Speaker 3 You come out with money left over.

1:15:24 Speaker 5 You come out ahead.

1:15:25 Speaker 3 Wow, that’s incredible.

1:15:26 Speaker 5 Really.

1:15:26 Speaker 3 So definitely, don’t think twice about it.

1:15:28 Speaker 5 And if you’re not pregnant yet, it’s worth upgrading your supplemental health coverage, because this is only included in the higher-tier plans, so you can get the reimbursement.

1:15:37 Speaker 3 Wow, absolutely. We saved this for the end—you have to hear about how Nechami gave birth seven times. Yes.

1:15:46 Speaker 5 Boruch Hashem, seven births. Yes.

1:15:48 Speaker 3 Go on, tell us.

1:15:52 Speaker 5 So how did I actually get into this whole field? You asked me about my first birth.

1:15:55 Speaker 3 Yes.

1:15:55 Speaker 5 I told you about the birth, but now I’ll tell the whole truth about it.

1:15:58 Speaker 3 Yes, now you’ll set the record straight.

1:16:00 Speaker 5 Yes. I was seven months into my first pregnancy. Third year. An average woman from Kfar Chabad going to a childbirth-preparation course. The woman teaching the course told us about her births: she’d had three births in the hospital, with all the usual stories that go along with that. For her fourth birth, she gave birth at home. She was in the water, and she said to me—she said to all of us in the course—“It was more comfortable for me than having an epidural.” My eyes went wide. What? You can give birth at home? Who gives birth at home? Crazy, irresponsible women who put themselves and their babies at risk. What do you mean, give birth at home? I had no idea such a thing existed. She lent me a book by Ilana Shemesh called The Guide to Home Births in Israel—Giving Birth at Home is the name of the book. So I sat and read it. I came from a very scientific background, okay? My degree is in the sciences. I’m a researcher. I really looked at the statistics. I felt as though I was doing a doctorate on it, and I simply learned that it was safe. The World Health Organization recommends home births as safe births. Essentially, the reason is that there are fewer unnecessary interventions, and the woman is in an environment where she feels safe. For each person, it’s about where it’s right for her to give birth, yes? But a woman for whom it is right feels secure, and the birth happens in a healthier way. You can really see it in the statistics. The rate of C-sections—we said twenty, sometimes even twenty-five percent, for hospital births—can be three percent for home births. Why does it drop so much? It’s simply safer. Of course, that’s for a woman whose pregnancy meets the conditions for a home birth, whose pregnancy isn’t high-risk, and there are a few other rules as well. There are also far, far fewer assisted deliveries and other interventions—really, tiny percentages. So once I understood that it was safe, and there were

1:17:49 Speaker 5 answers in the book to all the “what do you do if...” questions, and I could see that it really was possible, along with the moving birth stories in it, I read that book and said, “This is how I want to give birth.” My husband asked his rav—he was an avreich in kollel at the time—Rabbi Tvardovitz in Kfar Chabad. Rabbi Tvardovitz said to give birth wherever the woman wants. What sound thinking: wherever the woman wants to give birth, that’s where she should give birth. Who’s giving birth? The woman. So I had settled all the spiritual questions too. I consulted a mashpia, wrote to the Rebbe, and boruch Hashem, I had a wonderful home birth. I was in the water, in a Jacuzzi. Remember, I’m talking about more than nineteen years ago. There were no water births in any hospital, and there were no natural birthing centers. A woman who wanted to be in the water couldn’t have that. Thanks to more and more women in Israel choosing that path, it created pressure so that today hospitals also offer the option of giving birth in water. I was very comfortable, and I gave birth without tearing or stitches, and came away wanting to do it again. Labor started in the afternoon and ended in the evening. I realized that there was a great light here that other women weren’t experiencing, and I felt a shlichus to share that light. Boruch Hashem, since then I’ve had seven home births.

1:19:04 Speaker 6 Incredible.

1:19:05 Speaker 5 I’ve never given birth in a hospital, and my message is that it doesn’t matter where you give birth: give birth where it’s good for you. If a hospital makes a woman feel secure, then she should give birth there. Right?

1:19:16 Speaker 6 Yes.

1:19:16 Speaker 5 That’s what’s right for her, and certainly if there’s a medical need. But take responsibility for your body and your experience. It’s in your hands. So where does “with Hashem’s help” fit into that statement? Let me show you. The Zohar says that when a person stands with a shining face below—this is practically a translation from the Aramaic—a shining face is shown to him from above, because a person’s joy draws another, higher joy toward him. We tend to think that everything that happens from above is like a lottery, a random draw. What will my birth be like? This woman had one kind of birth, that woman had another. What will my fate be? What will happen at my birth? So look at what our sources tell us: the way a person positions herself shapes the realities she draws into her life. When you come with confidence and emunah, you’re open to the kindnesses of Hakadosh Boruch Hu. So whom does it depend on? When we say “with Hashem’s help,” whom does that depend on? How did Hashem design reality? Everything that comes from the higher worlds reflects the state a person is in down here. So in the same breath as saying “with Hashem’s help,” you know that you’re responsible for your birth experience. That’s my message. That’s what matters to me; it’s in my soul. It doesn’t matter where you give birth. Of course, if anyone wants information about home births, I can share what I’ve learned from experience. Some of my births were in water; for others, I didn’t make it into the water in time. I want to tell you about one of those births, my sixth. I’d been afraid of the final stage of labor before that birth, because during my fifth birth I’d given birth in the water, in the bathtub, and I remember the moment when the baby’s head was really moving down and I felt something in my lower back... I went, “Oh, G-d.” By the time I said, “Oh, G-d,” I was already a doula, and I understood that this was my transition stage. Transition is the stage when, in just another moment

1:21:00 Speaker 5 A woman goes through the transition stage of labor, and it can be marked by a kind of breaking point, a natural one, when she says, “I can’t do this anymore. It’s hard for me,” and so on. Each woman has her own words for it. So I said, “Oh, G-d,” and then I realized this was my transition stage. That actually helped me relax more deeply. I understood that this was what I needed. I put on headphones. I remember debating whether to put my head underwater with an earbud in—would I ruin the headphones? What mattered more to me: having my ear underwater, which would help me relax and feel comfortable, or being able to hear, which meant keeping my head out of the water? Anyway, that relaxation helped me so much, and so did the recording saying, “Breathe deeply, relax.” And baruch Hashem, she came out in no time, and the birth went well. Then, before my sixth birth, I said, “This time the birth will be smooth, without that breaking-point moment.” I kept telling myself, “I’m going to have a smooth birth,” and I practiced a lot by listening to relaxation and guided-imagery recordings. And baruch Hashem, I really was so deeply relaxed that she just slipped out. I gave birth without pushing. The midwife never even told me to push. You can give birth without pushing; you can just gently breathe the baby out. The baby is being pushed out anyway, wave after wave.

1:22:16 Speaker 7 Why do midwives say, “Push, push”?

1:22:19 Speaker 5 Because that’s what they know. A lot of the time, they don’t believe it can happen any other way because they genuinely haven’t seen it. And I’m not judging them. A midwife with forty years of experience might tell a woman—and I’ve heard this—that for a first birth, an epidural is the only way. And this woman tells me, “My neighbor has been a midwife for forty years. That’s what she says.” And I tell her, “You can also give birth without one the first time. Do you want an epidural? Please, have one; that’s your right. But if you don’t want one, I’ll hold on to the belief with you that it’s possible.” I’ve seen for myself that it’s possible. Hundreds of births like that happen in Israel and around the world. First births, too, can be natural, smooth and wonderful. So why do midwives say that? Some simply don’t know anything different. They really haven’t seen it. They haven’t seen a woman give birth without pushing. That’s what they learned. And... that’s it. So it is possible. A woman doesn’t need to be told—and certainly a woman having a natural birth doesn’t need to be told—“Push.” It’s like telling you, “Excuse me, you need to go to the bathroom.”

1:23:12 Speaker 7 Right.

1:23:13 Speaker 5 You feel it. And that brings me back to the moment when I really understood the enormous power of relaxation: with just a few gentle breaths, the baby came out. I had a recording I’d practiced with, but it was missing the G-dliness, the trust in the Creator, the soul, the Jewish element. There are lots of meditative things online—meditations and relaxation recordings—and they’re good; they really helped me. But I was looking for something more Jewish, more connected to G-d. I’d always dreamed of something like that, and Hashem helped me make that dream come true. I recorded it in a studio, with original music based on Chassidic niggunim, soulful melodies in the background, and guided imagery and relaxation for birth that’s connected to the Creator. And baruch Hashem, hundreds of women—and sometimes—

1:24:06 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:24:06 Speaker 5 —use just that. There are doulas who recommend the recording to every woman they work with, because they see how much it helps.

1:24:12 Speaker 7 It’s truly a gift to the world. Wow. It sounds like one little thing you did along the way, but honestly, even if just one woman uses it, it would have been worth it for that alone.

1:24:23 Speaker 5 So when you asked about a woman who’s about to give birth, this is something she can take with her right now. The more you practice beforehand, the more you practice during pregnancy, the faster you can reach a deeper state of relaxation. That’s why practicing matters. But even if you haven’t practiced, or you’ve practiced only a little, it’s still a real benefit to have it help you during labor. And you really can join the course at any stage. I remember a woman who bought the course in week thirty-seven, gave birth in week thirty-nine, and wrote to me that she’d achieved every one of her goals. She’d had an easy birth and was really happy. So it’s never too late.

1:24:57 Speaker 7 You really have nothing to lose. Even if you’ve only heard part of it, every few minutes you listen to are a bonus, something you didn’t know before.

1:25:05 Speaker 5 And everything happens at just the right time. Just relax; you’re not missing anything.

1:25:08 Speaker 7 Exactly.

1:25:08 Speaker 5 When you get to the birth, you have everything you need.

1:25:12 Speaker 7 Exactly. Whenever you heard this podcast, that was the moment you needed to hear it.

1:25:16 Speaker 5 Absolutely. And when we talked about “In pain you shall bear children”—we never answered that question.

1:25:22 Speaker 7 Oh, wow. You’re right. So finish that thought now.

1:25:26 Speaker 5 So I’ll close that loop: it doesn’t actually say how much pain. It doesn’t say how much a woman has to suffer. Maybe feeling heavy during pregnancy, being a little tired and having trouble falling asleep has already fulfilled your share of “In pain you shall bear children.” Who says there has to be more? Maybe everything women have been through over the generations has fulfilled it, and now we’re just moments away from the Geulah, already tasting it. Women say—and it’s really become a phrase—“I had a Geulah birth, a birth of redemption.” We know that in the Geulah, those feelings won’t be there. Well, six at once, for that matter.

1:26:00 Speaker 7 Right, you’ll have to make new courses tailored for that.

1:26:02 Speaker 5 So sometimes—

1:26:03 Speaker 7 Or maybe they won’t need them anymore.

1:26:04 Speaker 5 Exactly. Women ask me, “How long will I have access to the course?” And I tell them, “As long as women are giving birth and this course is needed, you’ll have access to it for life.” And when I say “for life,” what I’m really saying is that, with Hashem’s help, very soon we won’t need it anymore.

1:26:18 Speaker 7 Right.

1:26:18 Speaker 5 So there’s an opportunity to taste births of the Geulah. Apparently there is—I’m not saying anything based on my own ideas, only on what I see around me: women say they really are having good experiences. So take from the Torah, too, what empowers you and gives you strength, and know that Hakadosh Boruch Hu wants things to be good for you. Hashem wants every woman to have a good experience. Believe that you deserve it, and experience it.

1:26:47 Speaker 7 Absolutely. Tell me, what about... Let’s say I’ve watched the course, and I come prepared with all the tools and knowledge. But what about the people who come into the delivery room with me—my mother, sister or a friend? I’m not talking about a doula, or even my husband. What about them? Don’t they need some kind of preparation? They’re part of the birth, after all.

1:27:12 Speaker 5 Let’s start with preparing as a couple, because every birth begins with the couple’s life together. First of all, they’re together at home, figuring out when to leave, what to bring, and how to support the woman giving birth so labor can progress. That support from her partner is really significant. That’s why some of the videos in the course are specifically marked as suitable for couples to watch together. Every video says whether it’s suitable for that.

1:27:36 Speaker 7 Oh, right, right.

1:27:38 Speaker 5 If they want to watch it together—or whether it’s meant only for the woman giving birth. When your partner knows what matters to you, and you both share the same vision for your birth, it makes a difference. I give him tools in the course for how to support you. They all want to help, but they don’t know how. Once they do, the woman’s whole experience improves. It’s night and day.

1:28:01 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:28:01 Speaker 5 I’ve heard it from husbands who say, “The course helped me so much. I knew how to help my wife, understood what she needed at each stage, what was normal, what wasn’t, and what was okay.” That preparation is really important, especially before a first birth, when there are terms they genuinely don’t know. It’s important that they understand the language spoken in the delivery room, what things mean, and what’s legitimate and normal. Sometimes it’s simply better to wait at home a little longer, because you want to arrive and give birth. You don’t want to get there and be told, “Turn around and go home.” So for all those decisions, the husband’s knowledge is very important.

1:28:37 Speaker 7 Very much so.

1:28:38 Speaker 5 And a mother who comes to be with her daughter during the birth also needs tools for supporting her. Some mothers come to the in-person session. Lately, at many of the sessions I give, there’s one mother, sometimes two, who come. As far as I’m concerned, there could be many more. I have a dream of making a course for mothers, too, and holding sessions just for mothers—

1:28:58 Speaker 7 Let’s do it.

1:28:58 Speaker 5 But until that happens, with Hashem’s help—

1:29:01 Speaker 7 Because it really is a role. It’s a big responsibility. Say I think about my sister asking me to come to her second birth—not tomorrow, but someday. Of course, there’s intuition and all that, but you can also give birth on intuition alone. The question is how the experience goes. I’m sure there are lots of tools you can learn as a support person.

1:29:23 Speaker 5 Right, there are physical tools too, like pressure points, positions, movements and exercises. It really helps when the person with you reminds you and tells you what to do, or actually applies pressure. Places to massage, both to help labor progress and to ease the pain. And there are mental tools too, for how to support her emotionally—

1:29:38 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:29:39 Speaker 5 And be there for her.

1:29:40 Speaker 7 What to say, what not to say. That’s also part of discussing expectations in advance—

1:29:43 Speaker 5 Right. Right, right. So the mother can come too and get all these tools, and that’s really, really important.

1:29:51 Speaker 7 And just being on the same page. If the mother comes in thinking, “First thing, you get an epidural,” and that’s not at all where you are—or whatever, that’s just an example, it could be other things—then there really has to be some coordination.

1:30:05 Speaker 5 Right, right. It’s important that whoever is with you holds on to your goals for the birth together with you, and that you really say what you want. Because even if there’s a moment when your confidence falters—and that’s normal, because we have two souls—even if that happens, if they know what matters to you, they’ll help you hold on to the belief that you can do it and give birth the way you want to.

1:30:24 Speaker 7 Absolutely. I think it’s important to say this too, because I felt it during labor: after you’ve done all this preparation, it’s not that you arrive at the birth and just function perfectly the whole way through. Every so often you have to—well, it’s different for everyone, but you might have a moment when you falter. The difference is that you have the tools to get back up. There can be a moment during labor when you feel like you’re breaking—

1:30:43 Speaker 5 Which is normal—

1:30:44 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:30:44 Speaker 5 And it’s also a sign that you’re about to give birth.

1:30:47 Speaker 7 And you need a moment to focus on yourself and say: “Chani, what do you know? What did I learn? Take a second and remember.” You might have a moment when you feel like you’re breaking, and I think perhaps it’s even inevitable that you’ll have a moment like that. But at that point, you need a second to collect yourself and say: “You have knowledge, you have strength. Breathe, and you know what to do. You know how to help yourself.”

1:31:07 Speaker 5 When a woman feels that things are getting more challenging, that’s actually a sign she’s close and will soon give birth. What she needs then is more encouragement and more support, and she does it.

1:31:18 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:31:18 Speaker 5 Now, there doesn’t have to be a moment when you feel like you’re breaking. You can just breathe, relax and keep going until you’re holding your baby, right? But even if that moment does come, it’s a sign; it’s actually a good thing. When I see that things have gotten harder for a woman, I’m happy inside. I’m not happy that she’s having a hard time—

1:31:35 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:31:36 Speaker 5 But I’m happy because I know she’s really, really close to giving birth. And what does she need now? I tell her: “Imagine you’re climbing a mountain. Look back. You’ve come through all nine months of pregnancy, and you’ve come through the beginning of labor.” She knows she’s already in active labor; she knows she’s making progress. “What’s left? Just a few more steps. You’re at the summit, holding your baby.”

1:31:53 Speaker 7 Any minute now.

1:31:54 Speaker 5 And then she talks to her baby and says, “Come to me.” Whether it’s a boy or a girl—or even if they don’t know, she can talk to the baby’s head and tell it to come down. She talks to the baby and says how much she loves it and how she’s waiting for it. It’s a partnership between the two of them. The baby also goes through a journey during birth, and research actually shows that when a woman feels more connected to her baby, her birth experience is better.

1:32:17 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:32:17 Speaker 5 So that connection is expressed in words too. I tell her, “Talk to your baby,” and she gives birth.

1:32:23 Speaker 7 Wow, wow, wow, amazing! Tell me, Nechami, I have a question. You talk a lot about ideas rooted in Judaism—“Think good and it will be good,” and so on. Is your course meant for religious women, women of faith, or do you also have women from other backgrounds?

1:32:41 Speaker 5 The amazing thing is that women come from every background, across the whole spectrum. There are women who are somewhat religious, and women who aren’t religious at all. I remember one birth I attended with a couple who didn’t look religious. When I entered the delivery room, they were already inside, and the midwife looked at them and then at me, as though she couldn’t understand the connection. He had tattoos all over his body, and in walks this rather ultra-Orthodox doula.

1:33:11 Speaker 7 This gentle-looking woman.

1:33:12 Speaker 5 And they greet me with, “Our angel!” They’d been waiting for me so eagerly. Of course, this was after the course and our meetings; we’d already built that trust. But the midwife couldn’t understand the connection. What had they found in an ultra-Orthodox woman? So the point is that the content really does speak to people. There’s the approach to birth—the natural approach—which is grounded in biology and science, things that are happening all over the world. It’s a new spirit in childbirth. And people want that connection to the Divine, that place of faith. It doesn’t matter what background they come from or what they call it.

1:33:48 Speaker 7 They knew beforehand, though? They knew you were religious and—

1:33:52 Speaker 5 Right, right. The women who aren’t religious mostly come through recommendations from their friends.

1:33:57 Speaker 7 Right, how did she find you?

1:33:58 Speaker 5 People can watch videos on YouTube. Yes, they can follow me on social media and find me that way too, but it’s mainly, mainly word of mouth.

1:34:07 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:34:07 Speaker 5 Especially with something so personal, you’re not going to choose someone based on an ad.

1:34:10 Speaker 7 Absolutely.

1:34:10 Speaker 5 You’ll go with someone a friend has told you about and recommended, saying, “Only take this course.”

1:34:14 Speaker 7 Even before I gave birth, a friend and my sister-in-law had already taken your course because, really, once people hear you talk about it... So—

1:34:23 Speaker 5 Yes.

1:34:23 Speaker 7 It’s word of mouth.

1:34:24 Speaker 5 Yes. Everywhere I go. Yesterday I was at a wedding, and a woman came up to me and said, “You don’t know me, but I want you to know that my birth was so much easier because of you. I attended your Zoom session.” That was just a free workshop, and it helped her so much during labor. And another woman said, “I’m about to give birth. All my friends told me to take only this course, so you can sign me up already.” They come with that level of trust, knowing that—

1:34:46 Speaker 7 That’s amazing. So anyone who watches your status can see that you also offer free workshops and things like that.

1:34:53 Speaker 5 Right, right. I also have a gift: a video guide. I recorded “The Five Keys to Reducing Pain in Labor,” and I give away the first chapter with love. From there, people can stay up to date too.

1:35:08 Speaker 7 So how can they get it? Can they write to you at the number you mentioned, for example, and—

1:35:12 Speaker 5 They can write to me at the number I mentioned. There’s a catalog on WhatsApp, and they can find the gift there.

1:35:18 Speaker 7 Ah.

1:35:18 Speaker 5 There are also links below the YouTube videos that lead to the guide, and of course they can contact me by phone or email.

1:35:26 Speaker 7 Yes, and even if you have a dentist’s appointment coming up, get this guide. It really applies to any kind of—

1:35:32 Speaker 5 Any kind of pain. Yes. It’s really about bringing anything you want into your life and releasing any pain from your life.

1:35:39 Speaker 7 Beautiful, beautiful.

1:35:41 Speaker 5 So you have a page that brought about a complete change. Do you remember it?

1:35:44 Speaker 7 The page with the—

1:35:44 Speaker 5 Yours.

1:35:45 Speaker 7 Empowering statements. Right, I told you that page completely changed things for me. It had all the empowering statements I wrote for myself, and they totally changed my birth experience. Right, interesting. You know, I wonder if I still have it saved somewhere. I wonder if I have it for the next birth. Though I think you need to write them anew for every birth, because, as you said, each birth is an experience of its own. You have to approach it as: no matter what I’ve been through, no matter what happened before, I’m coming now to experience giving birth. And by the way, during labor I ended up using mostly the statements from your list of suggested ideas.

1:36:26 Speaker 5 I suggest them; I give examples.

1:36:28 Speaker 7 Because even though you’re the one who phrases them, I think each woman really makes them personal. I mean, there’s a lot of room for your own interpretation. Even when you say a statement as written, you add something to it; you bring it closer to yourself. So in practice, I think most of the statements I used for myself came from your list, and it was just amazing.

1:36:46 Speaker 5 And you say this applies before every birth. Some women have simply watched the same course again, because they felt those tools had helped them and wanted a refresher. You need to prepare yourself emotionally anew before every birth.

1:36:56 Speaker 7 Right.

1:36:56 Speaker 5 The record was a woman who joined the course before her thirteenth birth.

1:37:01 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:37:02 Speaker 5 For the first time.

1:37:03 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:37:03 Speaker 5 And afterward she wrote to me about how it changed things after twelve previous birth experiences. She wrote: “During the pregnancy before my thirteenth birth, I had more strength than before any of my previous births.” So the strength we gain from setting our intentions, from where we place ourselves with these tools, is a gift for life. Even before a tenth or eleventh birth—across the whole range—a woman can give herself this gift.

1:37:29 Speaker 7 Tell me, there’s something I’ve heard called “processing a birth experience.”

1:37:33 Speaker 5 Oh, what an important topic.

1:37:33 Speaker 7 Are you familiar with it?

1:37:34 Speaker 5 Of course. I help women process their birth experiences.

1:37:36 Speaker 7 So tell us a little about that. I really don’t think there’s enough awareness of it at all. I didn’t even know you worked with this too. Well, I already said there’s nothing you don’t do, but...

1:37:45 Speaker 5 Don’t exaggerate.

1:37:47 Speaker 7 Almost.

1:37:48 Speaker 5 So what actually is birth processing? Birth is a very powerful experience. It’s truly extreme. And when a woman gives birth, she’s fulfilling her purpose, so what she experiences is deeply significant to her. If things didn’t go the way she wanted and the experience brings up difficult feelings after the birth, it’s very important to process them, give them space, and reframe them. To find a perspective that lets you integrate what you experienced into your life and move forward in a good way, rather than carrying something that makes you not even want to remember it. That can naturally lead to fear before the next birth. And when you process the birth with tools from Chassidus, there’s room for the Divine perspective: everything that happened was through hashgachah pratis. You did your best, without guilt. And when a woman finds the good in the process she went through—

1:38:44 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:38:44 Speaker 5 —and sees what inner strengths she discovered and how they helped her in those moments, she comes away empowered. A woman told me, “You completely changed the way I see it. I came out of that birth feeling so defeated.” After processing the birth, she simply felt she was back—back to herself, back to her strength. And certainly, if worries from a previous birth come up as another birth approaches, it’s important to do this processing. Some women come a month or two after giving birth, and others come a year or two later. A woman can find closure and feel at peace with the experiences in her life. She’s no longer resisting them, asking, “Why did this happen to me? Could I have done something differently?” and so on, or dwelling on how people spoke to her or treated her. Sometimes it also involves practical tools: how can she act differently to prevent what she can prevent? Because, as we said, Hashem has given us many, many things to choose for ourselves. So that’s a real gain.

1:39:38 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:39:38 Speaker 5 It’s an important process.

1:39:39 Speaker 7 Good to know. By the way, you said “empowered,” and that reminded me of something else that really stands out. When you come to a birth prepared, with all your strengths and the ability to—as you said—relax on the one hand and take charge on the other, you feel very empowered. You come out of the birth and say, “Wow, I’m a superhero. I got through that so well. I was in control of the situation and managed it.” Though I’m a little hesitant about those words even as I say them, because you do have to be careful with “control” and “management.” You always have to remember that fine line between relaxing and—

1:40:15 Speaker 5 Relaxing, accepting, and making space for it. Yes, I actually—

1:40:18 Speaker 7 Letting go.

1:40:18 Speaker 5 I accepted it, let go, and allowed it to happen.

1:40:21 Speaker 7 Yes. And I managed the situation. So it’s like—

1:40:23 Speaker 5 And I chose. That’s why I prefer the word “chose.” I chose what was right for me, and I said what I wanted and communicated it.

1:40:33 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:40:33 Speaker 5 And then she feels empowered—

1:40:35 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:40:35 Speaker 5 Because she achieved what she...

1:40:37 Speaker 7 You really discover how much strength you have.

1:40:39 Speaker 5 Wow.

1:40:40 Speaker 7 It’s amaz— First of all, a woman discovers that in every birth. But the question is whether you come out feeling, “Okay, I got through it somehow. I’m a champion, I’m a hero.” And you know, yes, you can say that every woman who has given birth is—what did you call her before? A lioness. She’s incredible and amazing. But the question is whether I went through it feeling like I survived despite everything.

1:41:00 Speaker 5 Thank goodness it’s over.

1:41:02 Speaker 7 Yes. Or, “Wow, I did it.”

1:41:05 Speaker 5 I did it.

1:41:05 Speaker 7 Like, “I did it.” It’s a feeling you really have to experience.

1:41:10 Speaker 5 And when a woman feels, “I did it,” she feels like she can do anything.

1:41:14 Speaker 7 Absolutely.

1:41:14 Speaker 5 That there’s really nothing in life, no goal you could set—

1:41:17 Speaker 7 But that really is true.

1:41:18 Speaker 5 —that you couldn’t achieve. And it really comes with these tools of thought creating reality: you let Hakadosh Boruch Hu guide your life, do your best in the choices you make, and reach that personal Geulah.

1:41:31 Speaker 7 Absolutely. Let’s sum up all of this. I think there are two or three things to take into life in general, and into pregnancy and birth in particular, from what you’ve said. Let’s make a summary so the women can leave with something practical, you know, for those who aren’t sitting with pen and paper. First, there’s this idea of living in the moment, being present—being present in the moment you’re in.

1:41:55 Speaker 5 Here and now.

1:41:56 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:41:56 Speaker 5 Without baggage from the past or fears about the future.

1:41:59 Speaker 7 Yes, all the time. After all, Hakadosh Boruch Hu renews the world and creates it anew at every moment. We need to remember that. We’re in this together with Him. At every moment, everything is open to change; everything can change.

1:42:09 Speaker 5 For the better.

1:42:10 Speaker 7 Yes, for the better.

1:42:11 Speaker 5 A change for the good.

1:42:13 Speaker 7 Absolutely. And this idea of “Think good and it will be good”—you know, sometimes it can sound a little clichéd. “Think good and it will be good,” as though someone’s just saying that to shut you up. But no.

1:42:24 Speaker 5 Women tell me, “The things I said came true, word for word.” Wow, wow, wow. I tell them, “It wasn’t me; it was you. You did that work.” It’s a tool from Chassidus.

1:42:31 Speaker 7 Give us one quick example, so they understand what you mean by empowering statements—things a woman says to herself during labor.

1:42:35 Speaker 5 Okay. The most important thing is that the statement addresses a fear. Say a woman is worried: “I’m afraid it will hurt and I’ll feel helpless.” So I ask her, “What do you want?” Because it’s important that the empowering statement not contain negatives—not contain “don’t.” What do you want? Sometimes she’s at a loss for words. “What do I want?” Wait a minute—let yourself imagine the good. Hashem can give you endlessly. So she tells herself, “I give birth calmly, relaxed, breathing and moving.” Instead of helplessness, she tells herself, “I have the strength to get through every stage of labor,” or, “Hashem gives me strength, and I discover more and more of it at every stage of labor.” So when a contraction starts, if a woman tells herself, “I give birth calmly and in a relaxed state”—

1:43:21 Speaker 7 And by the way, she’s been saying that about herself long before then.

1:43:24 Speaker 5 Right. The whole point is to repeat it, almost like brainwashing—

1:43:26 Speaker 7 Contemplation.

1:43:27 Speaker 5 Say it to yourself as often as you can, so it counters the fear as much as possible. What percentage of your day were you playing out scenarios you don’t want to happen? And what percentage were you contemplating the positive outcome—something you really need, which is to see yourself giving birth calmly? Can you imagine a contraction coming and you simply breathing deeply and relaxing, smiling and telling yourself, “Hashem is with me. Hashem gives me strength. I can do this. I’m capable. I’m doing it.” Hey, the contraction has passed. A woman can get through contractions like that, all the way to full dilation. She really can.

1:43:59 Speaker 7 Wow, that’s really how it works.

1:44:01 Speaker 5 And it’s important that the statement feel realistic to you. If you don’t believe it, don’t repeat it. That would be a joke. It’s important that you believe it’s possible for you. So how can you turn a statement that sounds absurd to you into something possible? Say one woman’s statement is, “I enjoy giving birth.” Another woman says, “Are you serious? How can anyone enjoy giving birth?” If she doesn’t believe it, she shouldn’t say it.

1:44:22 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:44:23 Speaker 5 I had a statement like that during one of my pregnancies: “I enjoy giving birth.” And it really was an enjoyable birth.

1:44:27 Speaker 7 What other statement surprised you? I’m curious. There must have been all kinds of suggestions...

1:44:32 Speaker 5 Statements that women—

1:44:33 Speaker 7 That surprised you.

1:44:34 Speaker 5 —said that surprised me. So a big part of the work is helping women make statements feel realistic. For example, “I’m strengthening my confidence in my ability to give birth.” That’s a statement about a process. Or, “I’m relaxing more and more.” It’s for anything where you’re not there yet. I’m not sure right now that I can give birth calmly, but I’m strengthening my confidence in my ability to give birth calmly. That’s possible. It’s about turning it into something that feels possible. And let’s take this as a tool for life, for anything. I can tell you from personal experience about moving house. We lived in a small, three-room apartment, and by then five girls were sharing one room. It was getting crowded. So whenever I lit Shabbos candles, and as often as I could during the day, I’d say, “We’re moving to a bigger apartment. We’re moving to a big apartment.” I would look out the window at a row of buildings where I wanted us to live. I said, not just an apartment with one more room—I wanted it to have a sun porch too. If we were moving, we might as well go all the way. I would really picture us living in that apartment, with the stairs and the girls going up and down them. After a while, they put up a “For Sale” sign. You have to understand, there hadn’t been a “For Sale” sign.

1:45:43 Speaker 7 No way.

1:45:43 Speaker 5 What does it mean that thinking creates reality? There were—

1:45:46 Speaker 7 Really.

1:45:46 Speaker 5 Suddenly there were several options, and we could choose the one that suited us. It was the strangest thing, because realistically there was no chance we could afford to make that move. And there you have it: a thought, an empowering statement phrased in the present tense, where you can see that it’s possible for you and that it’s happening. Let’s take an example involving a relationship. This applies to anything a woman wants to create. Someone described a situation between her and her husband that wasn’t so ideal. So I asked her, “What do you want?” She said, “I want us to be better friends.” So what does that look like as a process? Right now, we don’t feel that closeness in the relationship. She came up with the statement, “Our friendship is growing.” Do you believe that could happen, that it could keep growing? Okay? She came back to me afterward and said, “That’s exactly what happened. Things worked out, and I feel much closer than before.”

1:46:37 Speaker 7 Wow.

1:46:37 Speaker 5 But she needs to say it to herself as often as possible throughout the day. When do we have windows into the subconscious? When we first wake up in the morning—after Modeh Ani, when you’re not fully alert yet, but you’re no longer asleep. And before you go to sleep, when you’re no longer fully alert but haven’t fallen asleep yet.

1:46:52 Speaker 7 You’re talking about a physical state of the brain, right?

1:46:55 Speaker 5 Exactly.

1:46:56 Speaker 7 Because it’s in—

1:46:57 Speaker 5 It’s literally the brain.

1:46:57 Speaker 7 Is it called alpha waves?

1:46:58 Speaker 5 Right. Those are waves at a frequency similar to sleep. That’s when the beliefs that guide us sink in most deeply. Ultimately, we’re guided through life by our subconscious. And when a woman adjusts the beliefs she holds there to make them more positive and lets go of limiting beliefs—

1:47:15 Speaker 7 Wow, that’s so important.

1:47:15 Speaker 5 Then she creates her reality. These are tools for every area of life, and giving birth is the most powerful workshop in letting go of control. Really, nothing is in our control. What will happen tomorrow? What will happen this evening?

1:47:27 Speaker 7 I know.

1:47:27 Speaker 5 You make plans and Hashem laughs. How often do we feel that?

1:47:31 Speaker 7 Yes.

1:47:31 Speaker 5 And birth is the ultimate example. You don’t know when it will happen, how it will happen, or what will be born. They say an ultrasound is right fifty percent of the time. Either way, whether it’s a boy or a girl, that’s fifty percent. So what does it add? For all our technological knowledge, there are still so many question marks. That’s the essence of golah, exile: things are hidden. Yes, the alef is hidden. And birth is Geulah. Then you know how it happened and when it happened. So these tools for letting go of control—knowing that Hashem truly runs the world, that you can let go, that you can stop holding on—when a woman does that in childbirth, it really helps her afterward in other situations of uncertainty in life.

1:48:07 Speaker 7 Wow, amazing! Wow, Nechami, we could sit and talk for hours more. It’s just, uh—

1:48:13 Speaker 5 Right.

1:48:13 Speaker 7 A subject—how did you put it? Birth is infinite. So—

1:48:16 Speaker 5 So maybe this podcast won’t have an end.

1:48:18 Speaker 7 An endless subject. Wow. Thank you so, so much.

1:48:22 Speaker 5 Thank you for the privilege of being here with you.

1:48:25 Speaker 7 Yes, and—

1:48:25 Speaker 5 And I believe every woman can give birth in her own way, choose what’s right for her, and come away feeling empowered, with a positive experience. We’re amazing.

1:48:35 Speaker 7 We really are. May we merit to carry out this shlichus of ours in the best possible way. We have the strength. We’re connected to Hakadosh Boruch Hu, connected to our own strengths, and connected to our shlichus. I think that when you truly believe, “It’s in my hands, I have the strength, and this is the most amazing thing I can do and bring into the world,” then we’re all in this together. How did you put it? If not us, then who?

1:49:01 Speaker 5 Yes. May more and more women say, “I love giving birth.” Why? That’s my vision.

1:49:05 Speaker 7 To change reality.

1:49:05 Speaker 5 I say it about myself: I love giving birth. When I want to feel calm, I remember my births, and it makes me feel good. It’s possible. And more and more women are saying those words.

1:49:14 Speaker 7 Exactly. May we merit that, with Hashem’s help. Thank you so, so much, Nechami. It was wonderful. Thank you.

1:49:20 Speaker 5 Thank you.