Ep. 57: Is Colel Chabad a Success? with Rabbi Sholom Duchman

00:00 Speaker 1 I mean, Tele Kel Chabad is a in the entire Yiddish world and beyond, so we're definitely closer to Do you, do you agree with that?

00:11 Speaker 2 Very hard to say because, uh, again, the Rebbe looks at you not the way you are. The Rebbe looks at you the way y- y- By the Rebbe, your potential is his reality. Very, very, very, very few people reach their potential. If the game is that they impress you, so then it's, it's incredible. But, uh, if the, uh, game is about your connection to the Rebbe, so, uh

00:36 Speaker 1 I'm Yossi Kamen. Welcome to Among Chassidim By Der Her, an ongoing fabrengen about life as a Chassid, our vibrant connection with the Rebbe, and inspired living shaped by the way he teaches us each and every day. Shalom Aleichem, Rabbi Duchman. How are you?

00:53 Speaker 2 Baruch Hashem, Aleichem Shalom.

00:56 Speaker 1 Oh-

00:56 Speaker 2 Thank you very much for having me.

00:58 Speaker 1 Okay, thank you very much for being here. Um, so, uh, it's a big zechus to sit with you, and there's a lot to discuss, Kollel Chabad, the Rebbe Shlichus. Um, before that, I wanna get into a little bit, everyone knows the Duchman Mishpacha, and there's a lot of, uh, a, a lot of, uh, rich in yanin in, in that. So maybe you could tell me a little bit about where the, the, the Duchman Mishpacha, where does it come from, how far back, some of the people, and we'll start like that.

01:28 Speaker 2 Okay. I'm, I'm just gonna give you a general disclaimer for this whole, for this whole interview, okay? From, from A to Z. So I'm gonna start that with a story, okay? Yutzvat Chafshon Hamed was, uh, as everybody knows, as I'm sure you know, Yutzvat Hagadol was, uh, unbelievable in '77. It was, uh, you know, really histo- history, historical times. '77 was Mamash on wheels. Every single second, the atmosphere, the, the, the dancing, the singing, the, the corners. It was, uh, was incredible.

02:01 Speaker 1 It's a potato. Kabos.

02:02 Speaker 2 People, people coming from all over the world. I'm talking about even what's leading up to, even what's leading up to Yutzvat, fabrengens over there. And approximately three weeks afterwards, unfortunately, on Chabad Bahalot, my Zayde passed away, my father's father, uh, Reb Zalman. And, uh, one of his, uh, good friends came to bimmah lechaviv. His good friend was, uh, Hirsh Hitrik. Re- Reb Hirsh Hitrik. Also a very, very special person, helped me a lot during my, my work in Kollel Chabad, was very involved with me in Kollel, helped me especially in the, in the, in the early years. Of his office, actually, was my house, uh, for many, many years in, in Manhattan, you know. Uh, when he was still able to run around in offices. Today he can't. Today security doesn't let. But, uh, but then... But anyway, so he came to bimmah lechaviv my father. Hirsh has, uh, two sons, very good friends of mine, both of them. One is Yossi Hitrik and one is Ari Hitrik. So, and they're chaverim, they work, they went together. Hirsh and my father, maybe father maybe was a little bit, uh, older, but around, around the same age. And they're talking about what's happening, you know, about the kids. And then he says, so Hirsh says to my father that, "I asked my kids, Ari and Yossi, what's going on in '77. So many of the mashpiim came. Reb Nissem came, Reb Shmerchaim, Reb Tzemach, uh, because, you know, place is on wheels. My mashgiachim, Zalmen Hadacher,

03:15 Speaker 2 whoever." He said, "What's happening by the fabrengens? You know, could you tell me over what's going on?" So he says, "My kids answered me the following. W- we cha- we don't take part in these things for three reasons. Number one, everything they say, alles vos zi zogn iz shoin gedruckt. Everything that they say is printed. Second of all, zi zogn nisht iber richtig. They don't even appear, they don't even appear the right way. And third, vu khaz di nat be-koshur So the , so therefore, I'm making very much a very weird disclaimer that everything I have to say is already printed, I'm sure. I'm probably not gonna say it over the right way. So therefore, what, uh, what I'm gonna be speaking about, it's just maybe that a lot of things that are the way it's in my memory. I can't tell, you know, if it actually happened or didn't happen, you know. There's a lot of, uh, a lot of things that, uh... The, the third part's about, uh, being mekushar or not being mekushar, that I'll leave open .

04:02 Speaker 1 I was gonna say, that's the difference, is the Besianer koshur.

04:06 Speaker 2 Anyway, so that's, uh, so that's my disclaimer to you.

04:09 Speaker 1 Okay.

04:09 Speaker 2 So everything, everything is already printed and, and, and, and the sources and, and where it's printed probably knows better than, than the people that were there .

04:18 Speaker 1 Yeah, that's the way it works.

04:19 Speaker 2 That's the way it works .

04:20 Speaker 1 Nevertheless, there's something unique about the personal touch when someone's speaking. So anyways, so you, you made your disclaimer, so now, now, now we could go.

04:27 Speaker 2 Motiv. So you asked me about, uh, my Zayde. Uh, my Zayde, uh, Baruch Hashem, blessed with two Zaydes on, on, on both sides, both coming from Gerer Chassidim. My, uh, Duchman, of course, is my, uh, my Zayde, Reb Zalman, was, uh, always by the Rebbe. His father was by the Rebbe. His grandfather by the Rebbe, Reb Matryeyou. And, uh, my Zayde's Zayde was, was by the Rebbe, was by the Tzemach Tzedek. His father, I'm not sure. I don't know.

04:54 Speaker 1 Reb Matryeyou.

04:55 Speaker 2 Reb Matryeyou was by the Rebbe, yes.

04:56 Speaker 1 He's your Zayde's Zayde.

04:57 Speaker 2 Was by the Tzemach Tzedek.

04:57 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

04:58 Speaker 2 So it's a whole story even how he came to the Tzemach Tzedek, an incredible, incredible story. Uh, if I had to repeat, I heard it from, from my Zayde many, many times. Reb Matryeyou just a, a out-and-out chassid. I'm talking about a chassid from, uh, 150 years ago. Um, my Zayde's gone 50 years, and Reb Za- Matryeyou lived a, lived a very, very long li- uh, very long life. When he came to the Tzemach Tzedek the first time, heard it from Za- from Zayde Zalman. In fact, I'm recording even from Zayde Zalman telling the story by a tzaddik convention, which was, uh, very, very interesting. He says he came to the, to, to the Tzemach Tzedek, and, uh, so the say the way the Tzemach Tzedek was that, uh, you came, and you stayed a few, uh, you stayed a, you stayed a number of months, and the, but the yechidus, he would have to go through the mashgiach dis. There was the, he was the one that would take you in the chaim bael. He was the mashgiach dis that would take you into, to yechidus. And then, uh, he, he would register you, and then he would give you the money to be able to, to keep up. When Matryeyou came to the, uh, to the Tzemach Tzedek, he told the chaim bael, the mashgiach dis that, uh, eh, that, uh, the, "HaRebbe is like a big god. The Rebbe is like the Aibishter." And just like to the Aibishter you go with

06:00 Speaker 2 Adam Hamutzah, you don't go with an intermediary, the same thing, "I want to go into the Tzemach Tzedek for yechidus without being, without an intermediary." So Chaim Ber said, "Absolutely not. You're not going in." And he didn't let him in. One time, he was standing around, I don't know how many, how much later, and he saw that the door was open. So he knocked on the door, and he walked in. The Tzemach Tzedek looked at him and said, "My high, what are you doing here?" So he said exactly the same thing. He said that a, uh, that a rebbe is like a Yid HaKodesh, and, uh, just like the HaKodesh you go without a memutza. He said, "The same way I want to go into this rebbe without a memutza." So he says the rebbe started laughing so hard, like, uh, un- unbelievable.

06:38 Speaker 1 Tzemach Tzedek.

06:38 Speaker 2 Then he said the Tzemach Tzedek. Then he, so the Tzemach Tzedek asked him, "So how did you, where'd you get, how were you able to live if you didn't go through the Chaim Ber so you weren't on the list?" So, so he says that He says the Tzemach Tzedek gave such a scream in such pain that he hears the scream till now.

06:54 Speaker 1 Well, what you're saying because they, they would give you money-

06:56 Speaker 2 They didn't give the money, but if you want-

06:57 Speaker 1 To be, to be there in Lubavitch

06:58 Speaker 2 ... if you want, yeah, if you don't wanna go through the, through the, if you don't wanna go through the secretary on your own-

07:02 Speaker 1 On your own

07:02 Speaker 2 ... so get the money on your own, you know? That's the way basically it came out.

07:06 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

07:06 Speaker 2 He says Tzemach Tzedek was so pained that, and, and then he says Tzemach Tzedek put on, I think, his shtreimel, and he said, and he took him in Yechidus, and he says, "Aza Yechidus is keyn mol nisgivel un vet keyn mol nisayn." So that was the story.

07:17 Speaker 1 Such a Yechidus never was.

07:18 Speaker 2 Such a Yechidus never was and will never be. So that's the, uh, just just the type of, uh, of my zeide's zeide, where I'm coming from.

07:25 Speaker 1 So this is not only giving-

07:26 Speaker 2 What, what, what the focus was

07:27 Speaker 1 ... it's not only a story. It's giving the whole flavor of the whole Kesher, the whole-

07:31 Speaker 2 It's unbelievable

07:32 Speaker 1 ... Kashes.

07:33 Speaker 2 Unbelievable, it's Kashes.

07:34 Speaker 1 Yeah.

07:34 Speaker 2 Unbelievable, uh, un- un- unbelievable perspective. And, uh, I mean, we, you know, we have the, we have... In fact, I heard the tape recently not long ago, this time on the apps. They have the tape, he said, by, uh, Tach Conventions-

07:45 Speaker 1 Tach

07:45 Speaker 2 ... the tape. It's printed also. My zeide saved it the way he, but, uh, but you can hear it the way, you know, the way he says it with the passion, with the, uh, uh, uh, with the whole thing. And also I'm thinking about it, you know, it's just, uh, unbelievable, you know. I, my, my zeide, okay, passed away 50 years ago, Zamen Duchman, but, but I knew him, you know. And, uh, with, I mean, I was 17 when, when he passed away. Zeide Zamen knew Hasidim that saw the Alter Rebbe.

08:12 Speaker 1 Right.

08:12 Speaker 2 Okay? So it's precious, you know-

08:14 Speaker 1 So you're like one-

08:14 Speaker 2 It's like one removed

08:15 Speaker 1 ... it's one, one, one generation.

08:16 Speaker 2 It's one, one removed. I mean, that's, you know, it's, you know, we're talking about the people that, that saw the Alter Rebbe, you know. With the, he was, you know, uh, the, he was by, by, he was actually in . He went to to the, to the in, in, in-

08:27 Speaker 1 Zamen

08:27 Speaker 2 ... in the old days. Za- Zamen Duchman, before he came here, before he came to America.

08:30 Speaker 1 So tell me about the Zamen- ... Zamen you remember, right? So tell, tell me about Zamen. So first, so there's an then there's-

08:35 Speaker 2 So first Zamen was a very, was a very, very special, was a very, very special Yid. He was even, he was a, he was by the Frydman Rebbe. He lived in, in, in, in Leningrad during, when the Frydman Rebbe was there in St. Petersburg. He went to Lubavitch, and then he li- he was in, in, in, he lived in St. Petersburg, and obviously the

11:09 Speaker 1 She got the beracha.

11:10 Speaker 2 She heard, I heard it from, from her. Yeah, she got the beracha. She was the only one. She was nine years old.

11:14 Speaker 1 Yeah.

11:14 Speaker 2 And you know, the, the other ones were, were, were probably f- uh, th- three of the four, I don't remember the exact age, but they were born after sh- she was born she was born. So, uh, uh, so I'm, I'm, I think . Anyway, so-

11:30 Speaker 1 So, so Reb Zalman was, when the Frierdiker Rebbe left Russia-

11:34 Speaker 2 When the Frierdiker Rebbe left Russia-

11:35 Speaker 1 He stayed

11:36 Speaker 2 ... he, he, he stayed in Russia. He lived through the entire blockade, the entire blockade in Leningrad. It was a miracle how he lived, how he got through. My grandmother's sisters were-

11:45 Speaker 1 What's the blockade? When it, when it happened.

11:46 Speaker 2 The blockade was the hunger. There was not-

11:48 Speaker 1 The hunger

11:48 Speaker 2 ... the, when there was, when the Nazis, uh, uh, blocked off, surrounded Leningrad, and food wasn't able to go, and people were dying in the streets, almost from hunger. Uh, and my, my father also lived through the, the, uh, uh, blockade, then they went to Tashkent, and then they went, uh, to Germany. So this letter that I'm telling you was in Germany, that, uh, the Rebbe writes to Zeyde Zalman that, uh, "You know, it's, uh, I believe that you were there that night." There's also a very, uh, interesting, uh, letter that Zeyde Zalman writes back to the Rebbe, and he describes, he writes to the Rebbe that, "Yes, I am the person." That's, uh, very interesting, the titles also that he writes to the Rebbe, uh, Zeyde Zalman. And, uh, then he s- writes, uh, uh, this is before the New Series. This is Tof Shin. And he writes to the... Tof Shin, uh, no Tof Shin Beis, I think. Anyway, he writes to the Rebbe that, he writes to the Rebbe that, "Yes, I, I, you were the, I was the one that you gave the, the, the, the sfard to, and I brought it to you back in a , like, a, a sow, you know, a basket. And I brought it ba- a shopping bag, and then I brought it back to you, uh, right after you..." Uh, I think he said, "On Yud Beis Tammuz I brought it back to you." And he writes exactly where you, you were sitting, uh,

12:59 Speaker 2 here, and then you told me that, "I'll give you a . Uh, I'll give you a schar for taking care of the, of the sfardim, and I'll give you a that the Rebbe's gonna come back for Shabbos." The Frierdiker Rebbe.

13:13 Speaker 1 This is in Gimel Tammuz.

13:15 Speaker 2 Yeah, in Gimel Tammuz, right.

13:16 Speaker 1 Yud Gimel or Gimel?

13:17 Speaker 2 Yud Gimel.

13:18 Speaker 1 After the whole thing, yeah.

13:19 Speaker 2 This is after the whole thing, yeah.

13:19 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

13:20 Speaker 2 After Yud Gimel. And he says that they celebrate it. He s- he said what kind of mashke they had, that they drank mashke, and they, he says they were dancing with, uh, with, with socks on me, because it was supposed to be very quiet, very confidential. Nobody should know about it. And then he said that he heard, and he writes to the Rebbe that, "I heard, then we heard that, uh, Rebbetzin, uh, uh, that Rebbetzin Chaya Mushka, uh, which was, uh, uh, that Rebbetzin Chaya Mushka went to, uh, went to Kastroma to join the Frierdiker Rebbe." And he said because the reason was that Chana that they, they were talking, I don't know, the, uh, you know, the, uh, uh, the, the talk in town was, uh, that, uh, Chana is too, too sharp, and, uh, uh, Sheila is too, is too idol. But, uh, Rebbetzin is just perfect. Just the, the perfect mix to go. So that was like, you know, very interesting that, that, that he writes that. Uh, we, you know, we have the letter. I think it's also printed in the Shema Yisrael. But anyway-

14:19 Speaker 1 What-

14:19 Speaker 2 Go ahead.

14:20 Speaker 1 Yeah, what's the story with the Shema Yisrael? The Shema Yisrael is the Rebbe told him to do that.

14:23 Speaker 2 The Shema Yisrael, the Rebbe told him to do. The Rebbe continuously, uh, pushed him and encouraged him that he should write, uh, memories from, uh, what he remembered from his Zeyde, and he wrote, and, uh, this is not only that the Rebbe encouraged him, but, uh, if you take a look on the first Shema Yisrael, it, uh, come, it, it went out, "Yeitzah Eir, Isaiah Ha- HaChafetz BeErum Sheme Shritah." And in those days, Shritah wasn't a title that went to everybody.

14:48 Speaker 1 Right.

14:48 Speaker 2 Today, you know, everybody is, uh, Shritah, but it wasn't. But in, in those days that wasn't a, a usual, so I'll let you figure it out. But anyway, it's Rebbe paid for the, uh, for the, uh, for the, uh, printing of the Sefer.

14:59 Speaker 1 Right.

14:59 Speaker 2 Yeah. It wasn't, uh-

15:01 Speaker 1 "HaChafetz BeErum Sheme Shritah"

15:03 Speaker 2 "HaChafetz BeErum Sheme Shritah" you can see it.

15:06 Speaker 1 That's not such, not such a secret.

15:08 Speaker 2 I don't know. But that's the way that, that, that, that's the Sefer, the green Sefer. You can see it.

15:15 Speaker 1 Yeah. And now it's already translated to English, and so it's available, yeah.

15:18 Speaker 2 Translated to English, and now translated to Hebrew and the English on the sa- on the same page, so we could, uh, we, we can figure it out. So anyway, Zeyde Zalman, when he came here, he, uh... Zeyde Zalman, in fact, wrote, he wrote to Lashag after Tof Shin Yud. He came here Tof Shin Yud Alef, in, uh, in, in, in, in, in Av Tof Shin Yud Alef. He wrote to Lashag. After Tof Shin Yud, he wrote him that, uh, b- by the way, with mustamed, there'll, there'll be a, uh, uh... I mean, that it was before the Rebbe became Rebbe, that mustamed maybe to be a shul. They'll make a minyan there-

15:51 Speaker 1 At the Frierdiker Rebbe's Ohel

15:52 Speaker 2 ... yeah, so he wants to be the gabbi over there. You know, if he can, he maybe can get that as a job and trying to get papers. When he came to, uh, when he came to Yechidus-

16:02 Speaker 1 Well, you said, you said he was in Hanitch, like he, he-

16:05 Speaker 2 I said he was in H- no, he was in Hanitch before, before, before he, um, uh, uh, y- years before, before he came out there.

16:12 Speaker 1 So he knew about the whole concept of Ohelim, yeah.

16:14 Speaker 2 Of course, he, yeah, he was, uh, that's what I said. He went to the Ohelim. Yeah, he went to, he was by all the Ohelim. He was in Hanitch. He was in Lubavitch. And, uh, I'm not sure if he was in Neches. That I'm not sure, but, uh, maybe he was. But, uh, when he came to, when he came to this country, Tof Shin Yud Alef, and, uh, he went into Yechidut. So, uh, uh, uh, the Rebbe told him as soon as he came in, "Rabbi Zalman, from Leningrad with New York. Baruch Hashem Y'zetzech." You know, like, uh, so he says to the Rebbe, "Yeah, Rebbe. Abba deburah tzig in zeir al chayecha." The ticket was very expensive.

16:55 Speaker 1 He meant everything they went through.

16:56 Speaker 2 He was just kid, you know, and, uh, what, what they went through, you know. It was a very expensive ticket.

17:00 Speaker 1 Yeah.

17:01 Speaker 2 That he told to the Rebbe. But, uh, anyway, so, uh, he was here. He was here day and night in 770. We-

17:08 Speaker 1 Right

17:08 Speaker 2 ... Zeyde Buchar remember him. He was, uh, he was continuous here. He's just, uh, 770 was his, 770 was his life. 770 was his grace. That's-

17:16 Speaker 1 He was a figure in 770. He announced, uh-

17:17 Speaker 2 He was a figure. He davened every single day, three times a day. He didn't go... He, he lived a block away. He lived on 858 Eastern Parkway. And, uh, in the beginning, he lived in Brownsville. I don't know where, but, uh, I think m- from when he, from when I remember, he lived on 858 Eastern Parkway. And, uh, uh, uh, for, uh, uh, like, like, like, like Marsh in 770, Yemei MeGala. That's where he was except when he went home, you know, to sleep or to, or to wear in the shul, but, uh-

17:42 Speaker 1 He didn't work

17:42 Speaker 2 ... he, he didn't work. He did nothing No. When he came here, he said he wasn't told. When he came, he was a 60 years old, and he said, "That's it. I worked my, my whole life, and now I'm, uh, you know, just, uh, it's, it's not worth it." And, uh, yeah. And so that's my side. That's on the-

18:01 Speaker 1 There's a few sto- There's a story with... You mentioned the Eyal, and there's a story with him, uh, with, with the Rebbe, with the Eyal.

18:08 Speaker 2 Story with Rebbe, with the Eyal, that he-- First of all, he went to the Eyal every year of his childhood. He went to the Eyal, and he, he went by bus. You know, it wasn't, it wasn't a simple thing to go. After Rebbe Salakhana passed away, there's a letter from the Rebbe thanking him or a t-tshuva, an answer from the Rebbe thanking him that he went and he took, uh... It wasn't a minyan. He wasn't even able to get a minyan, but a live minyan to be able to go when the Matzeva, when he heard that the Matzeva was up, and he brought the Rebbe Salakhana. And, uh, when there was, uh, older Hasidim that went to the Rebbe and told the Rebbe that, uh, they're, they're very concerned that the Rebbe goes to the Eyal or not, and it's very, very cold over there. So the Rebbe said that he can thank Reb Zalman, Reb Zalman, uh, first Rebbe from the Eyal, and, uh, so they're very warm.

18:50 Speaker 1 He said to ask Reb Zalman if he goes, and he'll tell you that the Eyal is warm.

18:53 Speaker 2 He'll tell you that the Eyal is very warm.

18:54 Speaker 1 Very warm.

18:55 Speaker 2 Very warm. And, uh, there was a special love that the Rebbe had to, to see the Zalman, and he was able to see, of course, you know, a very special, uh, love. Uh, Tofshukaphei at the Rebbe Zalman was the one that made the announcement by the, uh, by the Farbrengen. He made the announcement after the Farbrengen as, uh He had a very special song that he would, that he would say it. That was his usual announcement. So as soon as he finished that announcement talking about Rosh Hashanah. Rosh Hashanah at night, so the Rebbe's, uh, like in, in, in mimicking him way, you know, like imitating like his voice. I don't remember exactly the words. And then the Rebbe said, Like the Rebbe said, like, you know, telling the Eyal that he should listen to the new- To the new Sefer. To the new Sefer, something along those lines. I mean, it's something that, uh, you can look up. It's in the Hanukah, but that was the, uh... I just remember the, the, the scene, the picture just, just to, to, to point out this point, you know, of the, uh, special, uh-

20:33 Speaker 1 Chavivus

20:33 Speaker 2 ... Chavivus, right.

20:34 Speaker 1 Yeah.

20:34 Speaker 2 The special love, which was, uh, which was, which was, which was incredible. And, uh, yeah, he was, uh, you know-

20:41 Speaker 1 He was a Rebbe to many

20:42 Speaker 2 ... also he had this very special relationship with, uh, a special, s-special that the Tofshin, uh, Yud Gi- Tofshin Yud Beis when the Rebbe Israel Yaakov passed away. So the Rebbe, uh, uh, so, uh, during Shiva, there was a minyan inside the Rebbe's room that the Rebbe davened. But afterwards, to say Kaddish and to daven for the Amud, so the Rebbe said the psalms. He did psalms for the whole year.

21:07 Speaker 1 He said Kaddish entirely.

21:08 Speaker 2 He said Kaddish, and he said, uh, he did the, uh... And then he observed the Yahrtzeit always every single year following that. The Rebbe paid him $180. The Rebbe paid him, uh, nine twenties. Rebbe gave him to, uh, uh, uh, for this.

21:22 Speaker 1 That's very special. But the Rebbe- The Rebbe said Kaddish also.

21:26 Speaker 2 Uh, the first... The, I don't think the Rebbe said-

21:27 Speaker 1 No, he didn't.

21:27 Speaker 2 The Rebbe did not say Kaddish. I'm almost sure Rebbe didn't say Kaddish, um, because otherwise the Rebbe someone would ask why he's saying Kaddish for him.

21:32 Speaker 1 Ah, right, right. Okay.

21:33 Speaker 2 It was very, uh, very, uh... I'm almost sure that's not the case. I, Okay. Um, I the Rebbe said Kaddish. I don't remember. the Rebbe said Kaddish. I don't, uh, uh, can, I don't remember. But, uh, I'm sure that those that do remember-

21:49 Speaker 1 It's very special. And he also had other functions. He led the Minchah and Seudat Shaliach, right?

21:53 Speaker 2 He led the Minchah and Seudat Shaliach, and, uh, a few times that he tr-tr- uh, that he tried to be m- to, to, to, to, to be the Admor R' Yoedah, the, the, the one that would be H70 with Admor R' Yoedah. And, uh, yeah.

22:05 Speaker 1 Especially-

22:06 Speaker 2 He was a Baruch Hashem, a very, very special Yid. So that's on, uh, that's, uh, my Zeyde. Of course, uh, my, uh, bubbe, of course, comes from, uh, the illustrious Finkelstein family.

22:17 Speaker 1 Zalman's wife.

22:17 Speaker 2 Zalman Minkowitz. Zalman's wife. Leime- Leime Minkowitz, you know, uh, in Novol, from, from Novol. And, uh, uh, and, and, and they would say, "Leime Katanoy." Okay? Leime is, is, is Katanoy. He was a very, very, uh, a very, very special Yid. And, uh, so that's on, on, on my, on my, uh, on the, uh, on the dochman side. On the Lubavitcher side-

22:42 Speaker 1 Your mother's Lubavitcher

22:43 Speaker 2 ... my mother's Lubavitcher, so Lubavitcher is, uh, also Baruch Hashem, a very, very, uh, special prominent family in Novol. Okay? They were, uh, Hasidim, Tmimim Hasidim. Uh, there was this, uh, uh, people that they were actually a village pe- a village of people. I think the name Lubavitcher is like a royal name that I think somebody bought from, uh, one of the, uh, one of the royalties that, uh, you know, that, uh-

23:07 Speaker 1 It's a Russian name

23:07 Speaker 2 ... that, uh, a Russian name that, that went to wa- that, that went off, uh, that, uh, you know, that, that, that went off the way, as we should say, that was OTD from there. And they moved away, I think so. I'm not sure even where, where, where his name was. But, uh, even Zayde Gershel. Zayde Gershel did not marry Tmimim Hasidim, but Zayde Gershel was-

23:26 Speaker 1 Why?

23:26 Speaker 2 Why? Because he wasn't, uh, uh, you know, the, the, uh, he, he, uh, he w- it was b- uh, before Tmim-- It was before Tmim-- I don't know. It was before Tmimim Hasidim. My Zayde Gershel was born in, in, in 1900, so, uh, uh, so, uh, uh, I don't know why. Okay? Maybe before or, or whatever. Okay? And, uh, he was, uh... But he learned, he even, he went, they t- they sent him to, I think, to Leningrad to, to, to, to, to study to his uncle, his Uncle Leiber. Zayde Gershel's father was named Sholom. I'm a name after him, Sholom Lubavitcher. I'm not Sholom Beram. Sholom Lubavitcher for him. He was a Yiden, he was a Yiden, he was Yiden Novol. But Tmimim were always, uh, always part of the household. When he went to study Leiber, Leiber was over there.

24:13 Speaker 1 Who's Leiber?

24:13 Speaker 2 Leiber was, uh, his uncle. Was Zayde Gershel's uncle.

24:17 Speaker 1 Lubavitcher.

24:17 Speaker 2 Leiber Lubavitcher. Yes.

24:18 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

24:18 Speaker 2 He lived in, I think, in Moscow or Leningrad. He lived in a big city. He was a very, very big Sefard, and they sent him to do, they sent him to do business, and, uh, to learn business and to learn trade. Uh, but also there was, uh, the, there were Tmimim that were there in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in the house. Like, Tmimim was part was, was, was mommy's part of his blood. And in Novol, they, the yeshiva was there. They perhaps Tmimim behind the house, uh, all b- b- Tmimim behind the house or, uh, uh, uh, office.

24:45 Speaker 1 Novol was a Hasidische center then.

24:47 Speaker 2 A Hasidische center. And in fact, uh, Zayde Sholom, when, one of the Has-- one of the Tmimim came in Novol, he bought an extra behemoth to make for the milchigs that he should have for Tmimim Hasidim. But it wasn't that he, that, that it wasn't the status. It was part of their household. It wa- you know, so even though... And, uh, by Zayde G- Uh, uh, uh, Hasidim, that was, uh, you know, that, that was, that, that, that, that was the way, you know. The, the, there was no other way. Okay? Uh, but Zayde Gershel, it was, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, by Zayde Geltsel it was, uh, the Rebbe then the Eibeshel, and then and, and, and, and, and, and then Hasidim. The very, uh, uh, just, just to give an out, uh, uh, uh, Zayde Geltsel, when he-- because they were a, uh, prominent family in Navon, and, uh, they were a wealthy family. They, they dealt with, uh, wax and, uh, uh, b-big stock room of wax. They had money all along. So, uh, when the revolution happened, the rev-revolution, everybody had to make new papers, had to get new passports. And, uh, Zayde Geltsel, uh, couldn't get a passport. He c- they didn't wanna give him a passport. There was a, a, uh, a person in charge in town of the passports, and, uh, he decided that, uh, he's not sure about the Rabashkins. You know, he's not giving them a, a, uh-

26:02 Speaker 3 Passport

26:02 Speaker 2 ... he's not giving them a passport. They were very, very upset, you know. Without a passport means that y-you can't move. You're, you're, you're, you're, you're, you're finished. You don't have a, a, a, uh, an ID. It's not a passport. It's an ID. You don't have your ID, you can't, you can't do anything. So they... What if-- What, what, so what does Zayde Geltsel do? So he sits down the best of three Hasidim, uh, Rebbe Kalatsik, uh, uh, uh, Zamamisha, and, uh, who was the third one? I don't remember who the third one was. Rebbe Kalatsik, Zamamisha. I don't remember who the third Hasid is. Maybe it was, uh, each Ka- each Karemis maybe, or, uh, okay. And so what did the Hasidim decide? That the best man, how are they gonna get him papers? So they decided, they said that he should make a Hasidish farbrengen. He should make a Hasidish farbrengen in the house, and everything will be okay. They were very simple people. With the Hasidish farbrengens, they made a farbrengen. Made a farbrengen Shabbos at shul. The farbrengen went, uh, milchigs and freichigs. That means it was six hours with everything. They emptied out the house. There was nothing left. They started farbrengen Shabbos by day, and the farbrengen went till, till, till, till, till three o- till three o'clock in the morning, and there was nothing, not a crumb of food in the house. So I heard the story from my grandmother many times, okay? So they went out. There's

27:17 Speaker 2 no be- nobody there. So, uh, my, uh, grandmother went out to buy, uh, to buy, uh, f- uh, to, uh, to buy food. She went to, to, to the marketplace together with her mother, together with her mother-in-law. They went to buy-

27:27 Speaker 3 They were married already.

27:28 Speaker 2 They were married.

27:28 Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah.

27:29 Speaker 2 To buy food. And, uh, so, uh, they went out to buy food. And, uh, so in the marketplace, they met an old cousin from a very, very long time ago. Boom. Met. "Oh, Sholom Aleichem." What's this? What are these guys doing here Sunday so early in the morning? So they s-s-tell him the story, you know, that they, they, they're visitors. They had a farbrengen in the house, something. So he says, uh, "Well, uh, who's the, who's the person that's giving you the hard time?" They said there's a new, uh, person in town. "We know this person. We're very, very good frie- we're very, very good friends with this person. Uh, we'll take care of it."

28:01 Speaker 3 It was a guy.

28:02 Speaker 2 To, yeah, it was a guy. Anyway, they went, and they're the far cousins of Mayser. They may be more friends. I don't even know. Basically, they punk knew this person. Anyway, they came to the person. So he said that, uh, one of the neighbors, from the Rabashkin neighbors who would come to the house all the time, told them that, uh, these, they're, they're very questionable. These are people that we don't know where they have the money from. They ... they. So they said, "What are you talking about? This is the finest Menschen. These are the best. These are people that are dedicated to communism in the craziest way. What are you..." Anyway, within a, a day or two, the papers were done.

28:37 Speaker 3 Ah.

28:38 Speaker 2 So that was the story of, uh-

28:40 Speaker 3 The best of Hasidim.

28:40 Speaker 2 That was the best of Hasidim, you know, what, what they, what they paskened, and, and then, and then, and it happened. They delivered.

28:47 Speaker 3 It was a Hasidish farbrengen often.

28:49 Speaker 2 It was a Hasidish farbrengen 100%. That's the Hasidism. They, they delivered. Anyway, Zayde Geltsel was a very, very special Jew, and, uh, you know, tough Jew, but that's the way it was. Really, really, uh, an incredible, an incredible Hasid. He could see the pictures, okay? He, he would stay up at the farbrengen together with, uh, with all the young people, so he-

29:08 Speaker 3 He refused to sit with the elder.

29:09 Speaker 2 He refu- not... Because he, he refused to sit because he says that, "When I sit, I fall asleep," and I didn't wanna, he didn't wanna basically, uh, uh, sleep in front of the, at the farbrengen. Our mother used to sit. It's not that he didn't sit. He sat for years. And then when the Rebbe spoke about, uh, the, the Rebbe spoke about sleeping, that it disturbs him, that it bothers him, so that's when, that's when he stood up, and he never, and he never sat down again. And he, he stood till the last day till he was able to, till, till he was able, till, till, till he was able to stand.

29:35 Speaker 3 There's also a nice story-

29:36 Speaker 2 There's also-

29:37 Speaker 3 ... with the, with the Megillah

29:37 Speaker 2 ... Megillah, crazy story with the Megillah. Yeah, you know the story.

29:40 Speaker 3 What's the story? Okay.

29:40 Speaker 2 The story with the Megillah was that he went to the, to, to... He went to buy himself a Megillah. And, uh, so the, uh, he asked the soifer, "Rabbi Matlin, Shay Matlin. Now, Shay, what's the price of the Megillah? How much is the Megillah?" So he says, "Ah, the Megillah is, is, uh, uh, very basis. The Rebbe doesn't have such a nice Megillah." You know, he was doing it as a sales pitch. So he says to himself, you know, "Well, am I gonna have a nice Megillah than the Rebbe?" So he, uh, so he said, "I'm gonna give the Megillah to the Rebbe." Uh, but you can't just give the Megillah, so you have to buy a, you have to give it in a silver case. So he went to buy a silver case, uh, for the Megillah. And, uh, he sends him the Megillah. I'm not sure. It could be. You have to ask Arik, maybe. Arik delivered the Megillah to, to 1304 because th-they, they were customers on, on-

30:27 Speaker 3 Arik Raskin

30:28 Speaker 2 ... Raskin, yeah. Uh, yeah, I'm not sure how the Megillah, the M- Megillah went through the normal channel, through 770. It was delivered through the Rebbe, through thir- through 1304. I'm not sure. But anyway, the first night, the Rebbe did not use the Megillah. And Zayde, Zayde Geltsel was, uh, unb- uh, livid. You know, he was so upset. He was, he was devastated. Rebbe shouldn't use the Megillah. But, uh, then he got a call after Ma'ariv from Rabbi Kadikow, where Kadikow said, called him and said that the Rebbe said that, uh, uh, have, uh, have a Megillah. To own a Megillah is a very big mitzvah, and therefore, for mitzvah, he, he wants to participate with money. So if Zayde Geltsel was ready to take a, a payment for the, for the Megillah, partial payment, uh, he starts with some $18, so then he'll use the Megillah. So he, uh- Of course, he said yes And, uh, the next morning to Rebbe used it. And, uh, w-w-w-w-w- her, her Rav Rab Yitzchok Rabaskin tzag a besamecha

31:26 Speaker 3 And that's the megillah with the, with the silver case that the Rebbe always used.

31:29 Speaker 2 Yeah.

31:29 Speaker 3 That, that, that was Matanah from him.

31:30 Speaker 2 That was the megillah, yeah.

31:31 Speaker 3 It's a big chiddush. The Rebbe didn't take Matanahs like this.

31:33 Speaker 2 The Rebbe didn't take Matanahs like this.

31:33 Speaker 3 I mean, there are a few things, but-

31:34 Speaker 2 It's a very big chiddush that, uh-

31:35 Speaker 3 Yeah

31:36 Speaker 2 ... the Rebbe took, uh, took with us.

31:37 Speaker 3 Did he write to the Rebbe this whole story or not, not necessarily?

31:41 Speaker 2 Did he write to the Rebbe? I'm not sure. I have no idea.

31:43 Speaker 3 That's very exciting, sorry.

31:44 Speaker 2 I don't know if he wrote the story or if he didn't write to the Rebbe. But that was the story.

31:47 Speaker 3 So he's a chassidishid basically.

31:48 Speaker 2 He was a very, very, v- very, very chassidishid. So that's, uh, in terms of the, uh, of, of the Ra- of, of the, of the Rabaskin side, he was, uh, unbelievable, okay? Very, very, uh... And, uh, we s- To the Rebbe and, uh, and to chassidim and to the system. He was a system Jew, okay? Now, by him the system was, uh, by him the system was Chabad Lubavitcher.

32:15 Speaker 3 The Rebbe system.

32:15 Speaker 2 The Rebbe system was Chabad Lubavitcher, okay?

32:18 Speaker 3 Interesting.

32:19 Speaker 2 Uh, you know. But he fought with the Rebbe system, you know. Again, everybody has their interpretation of the system. But-

32:24 Speaker 3 Good one, yeah

32:25 Speaker 2 ... but, but, uh, it's, uh, to the Rebbe system. That's the way it was. The people, you know what I mean? You know, it's like Rabbi Zlatsky and, and Rabbi Moshe Schachter, and this is, uh, you know-

32:34 Speaker 3 Now he-

32:35 Speaker 2 ... k- k- kedosh kodoshim. Doesn't even know Chabad Lubavitch.

32:38 Speaker 3 Even though he's from, he's much older than them, whatever.

32:40 Speaker 2 It doesn't matter. This is, this is, the Rebbe was mentioned. These are the people that the Rebbe put up. These are the people that have to report to the Rebbe. That's the way it was. There was no questions asked.

32:49 Speaker 3 Amazing. Okay. So we're getting closer to-

32:52 Speaker 2 So-

32:52 Speaker 3 ... to you. So

32:54 Speaker 2 My father was, uh, was, uh, of course, my father lived, uh, uh, came here. He, uh-

33:01 Speaker 3 Your father grew up in Russia.

33:03 Speaker 2 My father grew up in Russia, then he went, uh, to Tashkent, and then he went to, then, then he was, then he was a shaliach in, in Ireland for a few years

33:13 Speaker 3 What was, what was the story of the-

33:14 Speaker 2 The story was that the, the J- that the, uh, the ... Philodelphi sent, uh, uh, this, uh, England gave, uh, a gift to the state of Israel meat, and they needed kosher-

33:26 Speaker 3 England gave it or Ireland gave it?

33:27 Speaker 2 England. I'm almost that England gave it. I'm almost sure.

33:30 Speaker 3 I heard a different version.

33:31 Speaker 2 Could've been Ireland. I don't know exactly. I, I don't know.

33:33 Speaker 3 Yeah, yeah.

33:34 Speaker 2 And, uh, uh, but, uh, or the chief rabbi from, from, uh, what's his name? Herzog. The chief rabbi from England was the one that arranged it, or from Ethel Slow, he was arranged. He had ties to, I believe, to English. I don't know, again. And, uh, well, so they were, they were in, uh, they, they were in Ireland. I was born in Ireland.

33:55 Speaker 3 Because of that.

33:55 Speaker 2 Because of that.

33:56 Speaker 3 So you move into Mishpocha, everything.

33:57 Speaker 2 My, my father and mother were married, and, uh, uh-

34:00 Speaker 3 You're the oldest?

34:01 Speaker 2 I'm the oldest. And, uh, my father, uh, but yeah, my father was, uh, was a shaliach there. I think he was a shaliach maybe even before, before the Kasba, I'm not sure. But, uh, and then he lived there till 1954, he lived there. And I was born in 1953, so he lived there. I, I was born in-

34:17 Speaker 3 Born in Ireland.

34:18 Speaker 2 I was born in Ireland. Thank you, Ireland.

34:20 Speaker 3 Are you a citizen?

34:21 Speaker 2 No, I'm a h- I still travel on an Irish passport.

34:24 Speaker 3 Wow.

34:24 Speaker 2 And really during COVID, it was a tremendous help. Okay? As everybody, every, the whole world was on lockdown, and, uh, I have, uh, a lot of, uh, people that I have to see in the, in different s- sides of the world. And you don't, uh, with an Irish passport, you don't need visas, you don't need... It was a, a tremendous, tremendous, tremendous help. So yes, uh, thank you to the Irish government.

34:45 Speaker 3 So the Philadelphi, no, the Philadelphi sending your father to Ireland so he can do his travels.

34:50 Speaker 2 Me and my kids also all travel on, on, all have Irish passports.

34:54 Speaker 3 So the children are Irish.

34:55 Speaker 2 Yeah. And I, and I think my grandchildren also can, I think, also can have Irish passports, uh, because of me. I think it goes, it goes to the grandchildren too, and it's, uh, it's, it's a big asset now, especially with the EU, with everything else. So it's, uh, it's, it's a big help.

35:09 Speaker 3 Okay.

35:10 Speaker 2 But, uh, anyway, when, uh, uh, and then my father came over here, okay? We lived first in, uh, Brownsville for a few years. We lived for, uh, three years in Brownsville. When I was three years old in, in that's when we moved into 922 Eastern Parkway. Now, when we moved in, just to give you an example of my father-

35:28 Speaker 3 What's the address?

35:29 Speaker 2 922 Eastern Parkway.

35:30 Speaker 3 So that's between Albany and-

35:31 Speaker 2 Between Albany and Troy. Okay. But, um, the reason why I'm saying 922 Eastern Parkway, because the Rebbe actually was there in 922 Eastern Parkway, because downstairs from us, there lived the, uh, Twersky, Rabbi Twersky, who, uh, he was, uh, and, and he had a shul over there. And when my father w- uh, went to look for the apartment, so he told him that, uh, "I'm not, I'm not gonna bargain with you on the rent. Whatever rent you want, I will give you in full. But you have to remember that I don't plan to be counted in your minyan." They needed a minyan. There was-

36:03 Speaker 3 Your father told him.

36:05 Speaker 2 My father told him. He says, "I daven only in one place, in 770." Okay? So, so, uh, uh, uh, uh, "I daven o- o- o- only in one place, in 770." Because, uh, and therefore, so, uh, and, uh, my father, every single day that was, that he was alive was in 770. There wasn't one day that he didn't pass by that he didn't, that he wasn't in 770. 770 was his life. I mean, he, he worked, he had a business. But, uh, you know, that was his place. That was his passion. It was all around what's, what's going on in 770. Uh, just reminded myself, just my thought, because I, one of the things I make a joke about is that I daven only in 770. You know, there's a big sh- there's a shul, a major shul in Crown Heights, the Ganzfus Shul. I'm sure everybody knows about the Ganzfus Shul. And I say that the reason why it's called Ganzfus Shul is because the, they, the Ganzfu would never walk into that shul. That's the only shul he would never walk in.

37:02 Speaker 3 Yeah.

37:02 Speaker 2 Because by him, besides 770, there was no other shul. It didn't exist. Okay? So that's why I just remind myself of my Chochma that I always say so.

37:11 Speaker 3 That's the Ganzfus Shul.

37:12 Speaker 2 But that's why it's called Ganzfus Shul.

37:15 Speaker 3 Yeah.

37:16 Speaker 2 You know.

37:19 Speaker 3 This would be the show he wouldn't go to.

37:20 Speaker 2 Never. Not this. It was around, downstairs from his house. No, he lives down, actually upstairs.

37:25 Speaker 3 1414.

37:26 Speaker 2 He lived at 1414. 1418 he lived.

37:28 Speaker 3 So next, next to the-

37:29 Speaker 2 Next door, yeah, but it's part of, uh, part-

37:30 Speaker 3 It's next to the Rebbe's mother.

37:31 Speaker 2 Yeah, part of the... Yeah. Uh, yeah, but yeah, after, but after the Rebbe's mother passed away.

37:36 Speaker 3 Oh, he moved in then.

37:36 Speaker 2 Yeah.

37:38 Speaker 3 And your father also, a lot of this Chassidishe varumkayt and this kashrus that you're talking about, the zeides. Your father also had, uh, this type of-

37:46 Speaker 2 Well, it was, uh, he, he got the Rebbe, and, uh, you know, that was on his mind. The whole, uh, you know, uh, al-always, continuously, every single day, every single, you know, some chasidim wasn't by him, some chasidim once a year. By him some chasidim was every single day thinking, you know, "What's he gonna say, and how is he gonna say?" And, uh, you know, to, to, to, to, to make the Rebbe s-s-to bring, to bring a smile on the Rebbe's face, to make, to make the Rebbe happy to, uh, you know, to do something for the Rebbe.

38:13 Speaker 3 Yeah.

38:13 Speaker 2 In, in, in that way. Yes, he was very, very, uh, very, very passionate about it.

38:18 Speaker 3 He's in chasidim, uh, he'd make kiddush in front of the Rebbe. There was a whole situation.

38:22 Speaker 2 Make kiddush in front of him. It was a whole, a whole m- uh, major thing. The-

38:27 Speaker 3 He was chazan.

38:28 Speaker 2 He was chazan. After, after Mem Kimon he was chazan. To Mem Kimon, uh, Shlomo Kazinowski was, was the chazan. He had the other side. But, uh, after Mem Kimon, he chazan from Mem Kimon to Mem Tes. And then he, he passed away Mem Tes, and then, uh, I had the zechus nun and alef and nun beis to be, to be the chazan.

38:46 Speaker 3 By the Rebbe.

38:46 Speaker 2 Some chasidim, yeah.

38:47 Speaker 3 You also did the whole kiddush and everything?

38:49 Speaker 2 I did the kiddush. And the first ti- the first year that I made kiddush-

38:52 Speaker 3 Uh, so it's after Shacharis?

38:54 Speaker 2 After Shacharis, yeah.

38:54 Speaker 3 You make kiddush.

38:55 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah.

38:55 Speaker 3 The chazan make kiddush.

38:56 Speaker 2 And the first meal the Rebbe made, the, the first time that, that, that I made kiddush, after I made kiddush, the Rebbe went like this, you know? To take another one, a big one.

39:04 Speaker 3 The Rebbe told you?

39:05 Speaker 2 Yeah. And after, after, after two big cups, uh, uh, I

39:10 Speaker 3 We're not talking about wine here.

39:11 Speaker 2 It was a different... Uh, no, it was Crown Royal. It was a different experience. It was like this, and

39:17 Speaker 3 The Rebbe told you to do another one. Wow.

39:19 Speaker 2 So that's, uh, anyway, that, that's in chasidim.

39:23 Speaker 3 That's the only time I make kiddush on mashke. And we, I think I, I, I-

39:26 Speaker 2 Yeah

39:26 Speaker 3 ... I base it off this, that the Rebbe encouraged. I don't know if it's only for the chazan or whatever.

39:32 Speaker 2 And, uh, yeah. Baruch Hashem.

39:34 Speaker 3 Um, it's also be-

39:34 Speaker 2 But with-

39:35 Speaker 3 We once printed, uh, had a picture of your father sweeping before Lag BaOmer parade.

39:41 Speaker 2 Yeah.

39:42 Speaker 3 It's interesting seer, you know? Like, uh, he didn't give it to you-

39:45 Speaker 2 He was here. He was, yeah

39:46 Speaker 3 He didn't leave it for... No, 'cause he was doing it 'cause the Rebbe was coming, so he wanted to make sure it's clean. So-

39:50 Speaker 2 100%.

39:51 Speaker 3 Yeah, that's who he was.

39:52 Speaker 2 That, you know, that's the way it was, uh, very special.

39:56 Speaker 3 Yeah. And there's also, uh, HaRabbi Shlita, right? He's, he's, uh-

40:00 Speaker 2 HaRabbi Shlita and, uh-

40:01 Speaker 3 He's the one that, uh-

40:02 Speaker 2 Yeah

40:02 Speaker 3 ... institutionalized it. Uh, they have its choson. Okay. So now I think we, uh, made it to you.

40:10 Speaker 2 Well, that, that's my, that's my background. That's, that, uh-

40:12 Speaker 3 So based on all that background-

40:14 Speaker 2 That, that, that's a small part of my background.

40:15 Speaker 3 Yeah, there's much more. So you growing up in, y- you're born in Ireland, you move to Brownsville then to Crown Heights. So how, so how old are you when you, when you move to Crown Heights?

40:26 Speaker 2 I was, I was three years old.

40:27 Speaker 3 You were three years old.

40:28 Speaker 2 By my upsherens. My upsherens was on 923 Eastern Parkway.

40:31 Speaker 3 Wow. So your father's davening 770 every week.

40:35 Speaker 2 My father davened 770 every single-

40:37 Speaker 3 Every day. So how many kids were around those years in the Beis Hamikdash 770?

40:41 Speaker 2 Not, not too many. Not too many. But we lived in 770. That was, that was our life, you know? That's, that's where we were, you know? That's where we hung up. And-

40:49 Speaker 3 So can you tell me a little bit about like what, what was it like when, around the Rebbe as a kid when there's no one, you know, when all the kids are there?

40:54 Speaker 2 It was very nice. You know, we, listen, you know, the Rebbe had a special pl- pl- place for kids. After every farbrengen, uh, we would stand by the door. The Rebbe would come back, and the Rebbe would dance together with the kids.

41:03 Speaker 3 Dance?

41:04 Speaker 2 Dance. Oh, every farbrengen.

41:06 Speaker 3 Like clap?

41:07 Speaker 2 And clap and sing, and make rabbinic to the kids. As the Rebbe would be opening the door, as the Rebbe would be taking out his key, his key, the, all the kids would be standing around the Rebbe's door and then singing. And, uh, and, uh, and by the farbrengen, I'd be, I mean, we weren't there. You know, played outside. I don't know where we played. Played on the roof, rechok, probably. But, uh, did all kinds of mischievous things. But, uh, for that, he made sure to be by, uh, when the Rebbe came back, the, you know, when the Rebbe came, came upstairs, to be and see the Rebbe, you know, going into his room. That was very, very special. So-

41:37 Speaker 3 You ever said anything to the Rebbe as a kid?

41:41 Speaker 2 No.

41:42 Speaker 3 Your birthday? I know some people say l'chaim to the Rebbe.

41:44 Speaker 2 Oh, w- by my birthday I said l'chaim. I had, we had yechidus with the Rebbe.

41:48 Speaker 3 With Satmar Rebbe?

41:49 Speaker 2 Yeah. So, uh, when I was, uh, when I, when I was, uh, three years old, I had a yechidus with the Rebbe. And, uh, I don't remember that. But we had a very, very interesting yechidus because it was a crazy, crazy story. The yechidus was for me, for my upsherens. We went inside to the, uh, together with my, uh, together with my brother Yossi, and my mother went, and me, and my sister Chana, my brother Yossi. My brother Yossi was then, uh, probably five months old. My brother Yossi is born in Av. So, uh, so, uh, this is, uh, uh... He was, he was five years old. He was five months old. Uh, uh, four months old, five months old. And, but the Rebbe, even though the, my upsheren, the Rebbe asked me only vi chaiss, mamash one question, and then the Rebbe was looking at Yossi the whole time, and my mother was holding Yossi. And, uh, what's with Yossi, and, uh, his name, and, and, and brochos, and like in a, in, in, in a crazy, crazy way. My mother told me that she remembered even walking out of yechidus she said, you know, "Something doesn't add up over here." Okay? Like, uh, very, very, very, very, uh, concerned. Wasn't concerned, but, uh, but anyway, two months later, or a few weeks later, uh, he, Yossi was breathing terrible. He was very, very har- having a very, very hard time breathing And, uh, so my mother's, uh... w-we didn't have no money. We

43:15 Speaker 2 went to the, uh, to, to the, to the health center. It wasn't, uh, to the, uh, not, not to a doctor. We couldn't affor- she, she couldn't afford a private doctor. Then they went, it was a, uh, a main station, a health station that you went, you know, public, uh, uh, place.

43:28 Speaker 3 Like a hospital?

43:29 Speaker 2 And they went... It wasn't a hospital. It was like a... I don't think it was a hospital. Anyway, they came. They, "Nah, it's nothing. It's a cold." It's, uh, but anyways, breathing very... Still a couple of days, breathing terrible, terrible he-heavy. She went to the, to the doctor, was a private doctor by us on the block. His name was Dr. Marcus. And, uh, he said, uh, "I gotta rush him to the hospital right away." Uh, to the hospital. Anyway, took him to the hospital. They took an X-ray. He swallowed... In the olden days, today we have Pampers, Baruch Hashem, but in the olden days, I don't know if you remember, they used to be called bight-diapers. And diapers, in order to hold the diapers, you have to have... He had a safety pin. He had a safety pin that was open, that was in his windpipe. He swallowed a safety pin that was open, in the windpipe stuck. And that, that, that, the, uh, that, uh, very, very painful for breathing. Anyway, they, uh, the, they have, they... So they, they, uh, uh... Till they found my father. There was no telephone anyway. But anyway, uh, so, uh, they, they s-sent from the hospital, "He have two choices. One choice is that they make an operation, they operate, which is a very, very big sakana. Another choice is that with a magnet they should close it and take it out, but it's also a very, very big sakana." And, uh, so my parents said that,

44:46 Speaker 2 uh, you know, they can't answer. They only to ask the Rebbe. Anyway, my father called through Sholom Endel. Sholom Endel is the Rebbe. The Rebbe said that they should, uh, that they should, uh, go with the magnet, and they should try to see the doctor either before or after. That's what that, that's what the, uh, Rebbe said. Anyway, they went to the hospital, and, uh, but the doctor was a private doctor, but they didn't have it as private. The doctors, every doctor had to be surgeons, had to give a day to the hospital, but it wasn't your patient. It's a public patient of the public. So when my parents asked that they wanted to go see the doctor, they don't, they, they s- they, they said, "No, you can't. It's not your doctor." You know, "The doctor, the doctor is here from the hospital staff." That's why... Happened to be a very big doctor. So it happened to be. Anyway, my mother says she was walking around everybody. She felt that everybody's looking at her. This is the, uh, person that, that their baby is gone soon because it's a very, very big sakana, very, very dangerous operation. Anyway, the, uh, they took him in, and within 10 seconds, the guy came out, and, uh, and, uh, Baruch Hashem, the con- everything went through right away. And they asked the, the s- And the doctor said, "I must go see the lucky parents." He asked-

45:58 Speaker 3 Yes

45:58 Speaker 2 ..."I must go see the lucky parents." He walked over to my mother. He says, "But I wanna... I, I... My father," he says, "My father is an old-time surgeon. If he would tell me that he performed such a surgery, so then I would, uh, I, I wouldn't believe him that it's, that it was possible such a thing." So my mother says, "I'm sorry to break it to you. It wasn't you. It was the Rebbe that was standing and holding your hand." He says, "It could be." Because again, if my father would tell me that he performed such a surgery, it, uh, just the, the point I'm trying to make, points out this stuff, you know. That was the, the Rebbe's ruach.

46:31 Speaker 3 Yeah.

46:31 Speaker 2 The-

46:31 Speaker 3 From a few months before.

46:33 Speaker 2 Yeah, from, from a few weeks before. But, uh, Baruch Hashem. Yossi also had a very special place by the Rebbe. The Rebbe told my father once, "Canst du mir zogn?" My father asked for a bracha from him, so he said, "Canst du mir zogn that ich tracht vegen ihm mehr wie er tracht vegen mir." That's quite a heavy statement.

46:48 Speaker 3 I'm thinking about him more than he's thinking about-

46:50 Speaker 2 I'm thinking about him more than he thinks about me. It's the first time I've heard this.

46:53 Speaker 3 We had someone else on this, uh, podcast that was there in Dallas standing behind, and he, he heard that.

46:59 Speaker 2 It could be.

46:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

46:59 Speaker 2 But anyway, but that's the, uh, that's the, that's the, uh, the, that's, uh, Rabbi Yossi. But anyway, that's the, uh... So that's m- that's my, that's my coming back. That's coming back. So you're talking about the, uh, speaking to the Rebbe. No, but, uh, I remember very, very clear. Listen, my, uh, early days, I remember, uh, uh, I remember, uh, the parade. I remember the parade, the Taf Sh- Uh, I think I remember Taf Shin Yud Zion. I'm not sure. That's the way I think. You know, I've got the things that I remember. But, uh, Taf Shin Chaf I remember very, very clearly. And, uh, for me, the clearest thing is I remember the Rebbe coming to camp. Taf Shin Chaf, Rebbe was in camp, and I was a camper. I was in Bunk Bais. Benji Yuden was my counselor then, I remember.

47:39 Speaker 3 Who?

47:39 Speaker 2 Benji Yuden.

47:40 Speaker 3 Benji Yuden.

47:41 Speaker 2 Yeah, Benji Yuden. He's, uh, a rav now in Fair Lawn, New Jersey. Uh, respected rav. He was, he was my counselor. We were in, uh, uh, I remember which bunk in, in, in Park-- In, in Swan Lake. This is the old camp. It's not around. And, uh, I remember the Rebbe coming. I remember when we, we lined up. I remember the Rebbe coming, and the Rebbe standing on the, uh, on the trunk of the car, like, you know, to see, to see everybody.

48:04 Speaker 3 On the step.

48:04 Speaker 2 I remember the Rebbe... Yeah, on the step of the car. I remember, uh, uh, uh, uh, Moishe Azar. I remember Rav Emun. I remember, uh, uh, I remember the Rebbe in the shul. I remember the Rebbe gave us to each one a, a, uh, milchameidiv. The Rebbe gave kesher berachos. So, uh, you know, I remember that, uh-

48:23 Speaker 3 There's a whole fabrengen, basically.

48:24 Speaker 2 Huh?

48:24 Speaker 3 There's a whole-

48:24 Speaker 2 Fabrengen.

48:25 Speaker 3 Yeah.

48:25 Speaker 2 Fabrengen. Fabrengen that I remember. Okay, but, uh-

48:28 Speaker 3 Amazing

48:29 Speaker 2 ... I remember we were s- sitting. I remember the, the Milchameidiv I remember. I remember the kesher beracha. I remember the Rebbe coming. I remember the Rebbe, the bedside inspection. I remember the bedside inspection very, very clearly.

48:37 Speaker 3 So describe what happened.

48:38 Speaker 2 Every single kid stood by his bedside. The Rebbe went just like bedside inspection. Every single kid by his bed.

48:44 Speaker 3 Wow.

48:45 Speaker 2 Very clear. The Rebbe-

48:46 Speaker 3 Then walked into every bunk.

48:47 Speaker 2 The Rebbe walked into every single bunk, to every single kid, to every single room. Now, there are stories what happened. The stories I don't remember, but, you know, the canteen, I'm sure-

48:55 Speaker 3 So what was that like, the Rebbe coming to your bunk?

48:58 Speaker 2 What?

48:59 Speaker 3 What was that like? The

49:02 Speaker 2 A s- s- six-year-old kid, you know, イスラエル what, what was it like, you know? But, uh, that's the way it was.

49:09 Speaker 3 I can't imagine. Yeah.

49:10 Speaker 2 I can't imagine also. That's why I just- When you're six years old, it's not a problem.

49:14 Speaker 3 Right.

49:15 Speaker 2 Today, you can't imagine, but when you were six years old, it wasn't, it wasn't, it absolutely was not a problem. So it was, uh, uh, it was, uh, unbelievable.

49:24 Speaker 3 So where did you, where did you go to school? Bedford?

49:27 Speaker 2 I went to school Tog Atida.

49:28 Speaker 3 Tog Atida.

49:29 Speaker 2 Yeah. Then I went to Bedford.

49:30 Speaker 3 So you're part of the original group.

49:32 Speaker 2 I was, uh, the fourth or fifth kid in, in, in, in, in, in, in, uh, in, in Tog Atida. Then we also... I went before that. I went to preschool to, uh, uh, Bais Rivkah had a preschool program, 825 Eastern Parkway. It was then, that's where Bais Rivkah was then, across the street. So I was there. I remember some morahs, you know, vaguely, uh, that we had. But, uh, I went to Tog Atida, and, uh, I wasn't, uh, I was quite a tough, tough student. Very, very wild kid.

50:02 Speaker 3 Who was who taught you?

50:03 Speaker 2 Wasn't easier, easy way in Tog Atida.

50:05 Speaker 3 Yeah.

50:05 Speaker 2 I had all the, uh, old-time rabbeim, great rabbeim. I had Rabbeim Okorf was my rebbe for, for, for, for, for, for a little while. Uh, had Ayi Pelager was my rebbe. I had, uh, Rebbe Chaim, Rebbe Schlome'r, uh, Munitz, great, a great Jew, unbelievable Jew, Rebbe Schlome'r, I mean, uh, I remember I saw more as a older, as a older person that, uh, he was incredible, incredible yid. You know, to watch him, to watch him daven, to watch him, to watch his Kiddush was, was just, just, just incredible, you know, to see it. Uh, who else was my rebbe? You saw Ro- A- A- Yes, uh, Rosenfeld was the, was the principal then. Shlome Zevik was the driver, was, uh, Yossel Reititz was my rebbe, of course, in Sara Síde. Uh, Yossel Reititz, I mean, the uncle, not-

50:52 Speaker 3 The uncle, yeah

50:53 Speaker 2 ... yeah, yeah, that, that Reititz, okay. He used to drive us. And, uh, we used to have to run away, you know. There was, it wasn't today, it's, uh, I don't know how they get by with the English, but in those days, there was the English. It w- it wasn't a simple thing.

51:05 Speaker 3 Same difference.

51:05 Speaker 2 There was, yeah.

51:05 Speaker 3 It's like, it's like back to Russia, right?

51:07 Speaker 2 But this was like back to Russia days, right? You know, the inspector would come, so you have to run away that, that you're not there. That was in, uh, in, in, in, uh, in, in other town. And then I went, and then I went to Bedford. But, you know, I didn't do too well staying in one yeshiva at a time. So, so then I went to Bedford, and then from Bedford, oh, so I could... They, they, they could, they didn't do too well with me, so I went two years in Beis Hamed, and it was not a shi- yeshiva, and then I went back to, uh, to Bedford.

51:36 Speaker 3 Bedford.

51:36 Speaker 2 Yeah.

51:37 Speaker 3 So you remember the Yechidas for your bar mitzvah?

51:41 Speaker 2 Of course I remember the Yechidas bar mitzvah. Of course. I remember Yechidas even before my bar mitzvah. The family used to go in once a year. The family used to go into Yechidas. It was a very, very special day. My father would come home early, and we would all get dressed our Shabbos clothes, and we would go to, we'd go, my sisters and, and me. Of course, I remember my, my bar mitzvah Yechidas. Sure, I remember from-

51:59 Speaker 3 Is there anything you wanna share from those Yechidas then?

52:00 Speaker 2 Well, I don't think so. Yeah, I can tell you there was, uh, something, you know, uh, the, uh, uh, the, the, uh, th- the thing from, from Yechidas that the rebbe asked was, the rebbe asked my mother, "When is the bar mitzvah?" So she said that, uh, the bar mitzvah, my bar mitzvah was on Sunday. Uh, Chof Ches. My bar mitzvah was Chof Ches Adar. My bar mitzvah was on Sunday. The rebbe asked, uh, "When is the, when the seudah?" So my mother said, "Sunday night." The rebbe said, "Das ist doch für die weiber." But, uh, when is the, you know, that the rebbe said, "You should make a minyan shul machshura motzaei Shabbos or Sunday, BBY, before tzikir, and, uh, and, uh, and, and have the mitzvah. You should chazen the ma'amar." So that was the, uh-

52:39 Speaker 3 So the party's beza ndon, but you have to have something there.

52:42 Speaker 2 You have something on that day, right? That he spoke about the... But remember the party, das ist, das ist doch für die weiber, as Rebbe said. And, uh, you know.

52:52 Speaker 3 So-

52:52 Speaker 2 That, uh... Do I remember if we're going in as a 14-year-old, as a 15-year-old, a 16-year-old? I have many bar mitzvahs.

52:59 Speaker 3 A yemaledes.

52:59 Speaker 2 Yemaledes. Was, was a very, very special day. Yechidas was a very, very special day. And the rebbe was, uh, you know, full, full, full gun, full Beis Hamed. It's a very serious Yechidas, and, uh, we took it very, very serious. I'm just thinking about it. It's mind-boggling. Mind b- mind-boggling. Think about it, you know? Who, who, who, who works out a 14-year-old or a 15-year-old? You know, I couldn't, I wouldn't have patience for... And the rebbe with the, with the whole, with the whole thing, the whole, you know, three minutes. Of course, it was a long time, three minutes, four minutes, but, you know, it's unbelievable.

53:33 Speaker 3 So what would they say that you would, they, they would write-

53:35 Speaker 2 I'd write a tzafung, write a tzafung to the rebbe, then go and see, give the rebbe the tzafung. The rebbe would start giving, the rebbe would make marks, and the rebbe would give berachos. And, uh, by me, I mean, that's, uh-

53:45 Speaker 3 They weren't writing, like, questions or anything?

53:47 Speaker 2 I didn't have no questions. I didn't, uh, didn't, uh, basically I didn't, uh, not, not in those, not, not, not, not in those days.

53:54 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm. Where were you learning, in Bedford, uh, your 14-

53:57 Speaker 2 I was learning in Bedford.

53:58 Speaker 3 So you l- Rebbe Yael taught over there?

54:01 Speaker 2 Rebbe Ya- what?

54:02 Speaker 3 I, I, I heard that you're, that you, you, you're very connected to Rebbe Yael. When was that?

54:06 Speaker 2 Was, uh, Rebbe Yael was there. Rebbe Yael gave shiur.

54:09 Speaker 3 Bedford.

54:09 Speaker 2 And I was very connected, but that was in Ocean Parkway when I was older.

54:11 Speaker 3 Ah.

54:12 Speaker 2 But, but we, we had Rebbe Yael all the time. I mean, Beis Hamed, Rebbe Yael was there, uh, was, was also Rebbe Yael was also remarkable. I think about it. We were 14, 15 years old. Rebbe Yael used to come every single night. He used to give a Shiur Tanya. He used to give Bechiras Lev from Mesilas Yesharim. And, uh, for the Mesilas Yesharim, farbrengen with us. And, uh, every Shabbos we'd, uh, we'd meet across the street from 749, and Rebbe would teach us Negunum, and would teach us, uh, then the, and chazen the ma'amar. You know, it was, uh, also unbelievable. You know.

54:45 Speaker 3 So he-

54:45 Speaker 2 I mean, of course, I didn't understand then, you know, what Rebbe Yael was, but, uh, maybe-

54:49 Speaker 3 He gave you a lot, do you think?

54:50 Speaker 2 Rebbe Yael was, is, is, is, is, is, is incredible, remarkable. You know? Rebbe Yael was, uh, there's no words. Different, different light. Different, uh, you know... When m- m- when Rebbe Yael, we, we went to ma'amar before, and then when, you know, first time we, we heard shiurim, it was m- mind-boggling, mind-blowing. Just, just it's a different light. It's, it's from a different, totally different perspective, totally different, totally different picture. That was the, the unbelievable days in Ocean Parkway.

55:23 Speaker 3 Yeah.

55:23 Speaker 2 We had Rebbe Yael. Rebbe Yael was there every single, every single night he was there. He never missed. Almost never missed.

55:28 Speaker 3 Right.

55:29 Speaker 2 It's, uh, great, great, great years.

55:31 Speaker 3 It's interesting 'cause later he didn't deal with younger bachurim, but, uh, sounds like he had a lot... From all the people your age, sound like, that I hear-

55:37 Speaker 2 That's what I'm talking about. That's later. But when you were, but no, but when he was in Bedford, so we were in Bedford. Later years he didn't do it, y- younger bachurim, but when we were in Bedford-

55:43 Speaker 3 I'm hearing from people that were there, you know, your age, whatever bracket, and, uh, it's a big part of their life. The, the, the, the Rebbe Yael was, was in-

55:53 Speaker 2 Rebbe Yael farbrengen, excuse me, farbrengen with 15-year-old kids. You know, you farbrengen, you said l'chaim, and you drank l'chaim, and you, you know, and then, then talk, and then give em, and you give es us, you know? And, uh, was, uh, you know, full, full, full, full, uh, uh, glory that we understand. You know? We didn't understand then, but, uh, it was unbelievable.

56:12 Speaker 3 Yeah. Okay, so you learned in 7-

56:15 Speaker 2 And really, and really it was, was, was, was because of Baal HaTikkun.

56:18 Speaker 3 Yeah.

56:18 Speaker 2 I went '77. I came to '77 in Taf Shin, uh, Taf Shin Lamed Aleph. I came to 77.

56:24 Speaker 3 So you went on schlichas anywhere? That didn't exist yet? How did it work?

56:26 Speaker 2 No, I didn't go on schlichas. I went-- I was in, uh, chaf tes lamed. I was in Newark, and, uh, Taf Shin Lamed Aleph. I came to '77. I was not on schlichas.

56:35 Speaker 3 Okay, so you come to-

56:35 Speaker 2 Yeah

56:36 Speaker 3 ... '77, Taf Shin Lamed Aleph.

56:37 Speaker 2 Came to '77, Taf Shin Lamed Aleph, and then we had, uh, we got a special mashpia then, Shlomo Azarchi. That was the first year that he was, uh, that he was in, that, that he was mashpia.

56:46 Speaker 3 Yeah, the first-

56:47 Speaker 2 We, we, we made him. We, we trained him. We, we, we, we, uh, we crowned him. I forgot the, the word for it. It was also very, very special, you know, unbelievable. Day and night, you know. You know, he was young. Can I know how to, you know? Every single night, farbrengens almost every single night. Sat, we were in Samach Aleph. It was really, really special. Very, very special. Such yidom.

57:12 Speaker 3 What was happening Taf Shin Lamed Aleph? What was the... I mean, s- how, how many years were you in '77?

57:19 Speaker 2 I was in '77 from Lamed Aleph. That's when I came to '77.

57:21 Speaker 3 So when-

57:21 Speaker 2 But before, chaf tes lamed, we were also in touch with '77. Chaf tes, we were also in touch with '77.

57:26 Speaker 3 Yeah, because you knew it.

57:27 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. I mean, it was here. You know, I'm here my whole life, I was here.

57:30 Speaker 3 So what was the avira? What was happening with the Rebbe those years? What, what, what was the-

57:34 Speaker 2 What was the-

57:34 Speaker 3 What, what was the koch?

57:35 Speaker 2 It was like, the koch was very stark to make sure to love and learn with the Rebbe, and to love Ma'ayan with the Rebbe, and as much as he could be together with the Rebbe, under one roof with the Rebbe to, to be with the Rebbe. And also, it was a very big koch in farbrengens. Farbrengens and what the Rebbe said, and the mehadim, and the learnings from the Rebbe. That was, uh, in, in, you know, in those days. And also in fulfilling what the Rebbe wanted, you know. It was, it wasn't shayeach when we were in '77. It wasn't shayeach that the Rebbe should speak about something, that something shouldn't be done about it. If the Rebbe spoke about it, you know, something to happen, something, you know, should be some chazzah, uh, a kapo baal bachum keduch, you know, whether it was baal yesd, mefsoyim, Taf Shin Lamed Aleph. But before that even, you know, in, in every single thing that was shayeach.

58:19 Speaker 3 Right. You're saying lat- later, while you're in '77, the Rebbe starts the whole mefsoyim. So that changes everything.

58:24 Speaker 2 Yeah, that, that, yeah, that was a very big change, you know. Lamed Aleph was a very, very big change. But it was also-- But there was this avira that you, you know, uh, that we, uh, you know, that, uh...

58:38 Speaker 3 So you're saying the, the big focus by the bachum was what, what the Rebbe said by the farbrengens. That, that was a-

58:43 Speaker 2 To, to know the farbrengens, to what the Rebbe spoke about by the farbrengens. And a very big focus was peh mamash of what the Rebbe spoke about in Chabad Lubavitch, especially in the messages to the world, and especially the messages-

58:54 Speaker 3 So like give me examples. Like what, like what are you talking about?

58:56 Speaker 2 I can tell you zogen about mefsoyim. In those days, I don't remember whether it was, uh, uh, a meika shlichas or whether it was in, uh, in, in, in, in speaking about Miyuchadim that the Rebbe went, whether it was a Tisha B'Av to go out there to go out the mefsoyim or the mitzvah film, whether it was in, in, you know, just, uh, you know, just, just the feeling in every single thing is, you know, what, uh, what, what, you know, how, how are we bringing the Rebbe's message to the world?

59:22 Speaker 3 Hmm.

59:24 Speaker 2 And, and, and, and, and, and the point was how are we bringing the Rebbe-- the Rebbe's message to the world. That was the koch.

59:31 Speaker 3 Right.

59:31 Speaker 2 Not, not, not, not the message to the world, but the Rebbe's message to the world. At least from my perspective. You know, it's not, uh, you know.

59:42 Speaker 3 So let's move on a little bit, and we'll talk about the, the shlichas. So we're talking about... One second. What year, what year is the shlichas? Uh, Taf Shin Lamed-

59:57 Speaker 2 Taf Shin Lamed Vav

59:58 Speaker 3 ... Vav. So it's 50 years.

1:00:01 Speaker 2 Now it's 50 years.

1:00:01 Speaker 3 Fifty years of the shlichas.

1:00:03 Speaker 2 Mm-hmm.

1:00:03 Speaker 3 So before we get into your story, what i- what is the shlichas that you felt? What's going on? Like how does it start? Just t- take, take me through the whole experience the way you remember it.

1:00:14 Speaker 2 Yud Tes Kislev, by the end of the farbrengen, the Rebbe stood that-

1:00:18 Speaker 3 How old are you then, first of all?

1:00:19 Speaker 2 What?

1:00:19 Speaker 3 How old are you then-

1:00:20 Speaker 2 Well-

1:00:20 Speaker 3 ... on Vav?

1:00:22 Speaker 2 Yud Tes Kislev, Lamed Vav, I was, uh, 23 years old.

1:00:25 Speaker 3 Twenty-three years old.

1:00:26 Speaker 2 Yeah.

1:00:26 Speaker 3 So you're already a seasoned '77 bachur. You're there for a few years since, uh-

1:00:29 Speaker 2 I'm in '77. Why for two years? I'm in '77 for five years.

1:00:32 Speaker 3 Right. Okay. So, so Yud Tes Kislev, Lamed Vav.

1:00:35 Speaker 2 I came '77, I was, uh, I was 19 when I came to '77.

1:00:40 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm.

1:00:40 Speaker 2 And then we had two years Newark, which was also just not much like '77, just we happened to be there. So, uh, Taf Shin Lamed Vav by Yud Tes Kislev by the farbrengen, there was a, uh, uh, by the end of the farbrengen, the Rebbe started speaking like, uh, himudike berter, you know, that, uh, he wants to send a minyan, uh, Eidik Vaysh to Yerushalayim and to Tzfas, and, uh, for shlichos. And, uh, the, the Rebbe said so the next day, I mean, '77 went wild, went on wheels, you know, to go on shlichos from the Rebbe. But, uh, and, uh, people started writing in from shlichos.

1:01:18 Speaker 3 Eidik Vaysh means 10.

1:01:19 Speaker 2 Huh?

1:01:20 Speaker 3 It means 10.

1:01:20 Speaker 2 Eidik Vaysh means 10, yeah. And, uh-

1:01:22 Speaker 3 So everyone just knew that you're supposed to write in your name or write to the Rebbe that you wanna go?

1:01:25 Speaker 2 I don't remember exactly what, uh, h-uh, how it went, uh, you know. But me, me too, but when, when, when it, uh, when it was, when, when it was exactly, I don't know. You have to ask, uh, Cham Shaul. Cham Shaul will tell you exactly when it was. He'll give you all the, uh, the chronological details. I can tell you me it's one chant.

1:01:43 Speaker 3 Okay.

1:01:43 Speaker 2 Okay? Uh, but the, the, uh, the, uh, uh, it was, uh, first the Rebbe spoke about it, okay? And then it was like, uh, uh, unbelievable buzz, you know, uh, such a thing. Then the Rebbe came, and the Rebbe made, uh, I think it was the next Shabbos or Shabbos afterwards, I'm not sure if it was the next Shabbos or Shabbos afterwards, that the Rebbe made like a very clear, you know, that you have to this choyum, that you have to write in, that, uh, for y- uh, for a year, that, uh, that he, that, that he's not gonna get married for a year, the bachurim, or those that if you're two years married, at least, that you write that, that you should write very, write very strong choyum.

1:02:21 Speaker 3 So either you're a bachur or you have to be married for two years.

1:02:23 Speaker 2 Either you're a bachur, either you're a bachur that you don't plan to get married for another year, or you're in your marriage, that it's already after Shanah l'Shehnah, you're, you're, you're, you, you, you, you, uh, uh, that, that, that, that, that you, that you married already before, so you're, uh, uh, that, that's the, uh- And, uh, so of course, I, uh, gave him my name. I was very, very keen. This is the-- our whole life was that, uh, our whole dream was that we should be shluchim. That was, uh, that was, uh, that was the, the... Yes, what was the Avodah seven-seven? What was the Avodah seven-seven? Avodah seven-seven it was that you are in a, uh, in West Point to become shluchim. That's, that's, that's what seven-seven is. That's what, that's what we would sense. That's what seven-seven is about. Uh, so we, uh... I, of course, uh, uh, uh, v-volunteered and then tried, uh, hoping that maybe we'll be able to get. And sure enough, on the Friday, I don't remember which Friday it was, but, uh, Rabbi Klein walked over to me and told me that, uh, you know, the, uh, "You're one of the candidates. You have to ask your parents if your parents masalim." And, uh, and, uh, of course, I said yes. And, uh, Baruch Hashem, I mean, you know, I got out. I was able to be, uh, to be one of the shluchim.

1:03:38 Speaker 4 So what happened before you went?

1:03:41 Speaker 2 Before we went was, it was incredible. The Rebbe was, uh, the Rebbe made a fabrenger Yud Shvat. The Rebbe spoke about the shluchim, and then Yud Aleph Shvat, it was a yechidus that Rebbe, that, that, that we, uh, we had a yechidus chassidi.

1:03:53 Speaker 4 With the parents?

1:03:54 Speaker 2 With the parents. The Rebbe gave the-- With the parents, and then the Rebbe gave, uh, each one of us who got the sisos, and he gave us money for zdacha. He sent Rabbi Mantik along with us. He, the Rebbe came out to say goodbye to us. The Rebbe asked Eretz Yisroel that should be a tremendous b'kabas ponim. There was a b'kabas ponim. Came to Eretz Yisroel, was, was incredible. And Rosh Chodesh, Rosh Chodesh Bet that came to, uh, welcome us at the airport was an incredible, uh, an incredible sandek, an incredible, uh, uh, uh, c-connection to, uh, uh, you know, also, uh, a outpour of love to the Rebbe. What... It's not us, it's not, uh, not the shluchim, you know, uh, in-- uh, beyond.

1:04:37 Speaker 4 What was the shlichas that the Rebbe gave Rabbi Mantik?

1:04:39 Speaker 2 The shlich-- Well, the shlichas Rabbi Mantik g-gave, Rabbi Mantik I don't know, but, uh, but, uh, the shlichas that he gave was to push us to, to, to go to Eretz Yisroel.

1:04:47 Speaker 4 Was it something with the Rab-- with, with Rabin?

1:04:49 Speaker 2 Rabin's a different thing. Rabin was... We-- I tell the story. Rabin, the Rebbe gave him, ga-- the Rebbe sent to, to Rabin, the Rebbe sent ten thousand franks, the Rebbe sent to Rabin. It's very interesting with Rabin, by the way.

1:04:57 Speaker 4 The Rebbe sent ten thousand lira to-

1:05:00 Speaker 2 Seven thousand-- I think it was a check of seven thousand franks, I'm not sure.

1:05:02 Speaker 4 With you?

1:05:03 Speaker 2 Huh?

1:05:03 Speaker 4 With, with the group?

1:05:04 Speaker 2 Well, not-- With Rabbi Mantik, not with us.

1:05:06 Speaker 4 Rabbi Mantik, right.

1:05:07 Speaker 2 With Rabbi Mantik. Now, what happened with Rabin was just, just stam, stam. Rabbi Mantik, uh, uh, uh, Rabin was by the Rebbe. This is just a very fascinating thing that I was there three times, so it's just, uh, just beyond. Uh, uh, Rabin was by the Rebbe in, uh, 12 Shevat 12, 12 Adar. He was the one by... 12 Adar, N-Nisan 12 Shevat 12 was also crazy, incredible time. Talk about seven-seven, it was just, uh, j-just beyond.

1:05:33 Speaker 4 The Rebbe seven-

1:05:34 Speaker 2 What?

1:05:35 Speaker 4 The, the Sheva Stushim.

1:05:36 Speaker 2 Sheva Stushim was, was, was beyond. It was, was, was unbelievable. And also during the day, during the day, you had a lot of the dignitaries that came to the Rebbe that were able to go into the Rebbe. And Herman Wouk then came as a representative from, from, from Nixon, and, uh, Rabin came from Eretz Yisroel. He was the official ambassador to Washington. It's very interesting because usually I think the connection here was m-- with the council. But anyway, I don't know. I'm not, not sure about that. But Rabin came from Washington. Now, Rabin was also different than the, uh, most of the other, uh, Israelis that, uh... Because he was a, you know, a, a new guy. I don't think that he knew too much about the Rebbe. He was, you know, he was-

1:06:13 Speaker 4 He wasn't like, uh, Shlomo-

1:06:14 Speaker 2 He wasn't, he wasn't even a Shimon Peres.

1:06:15 Speaker 4 Shazar, Nachum Began.

1:06:15 Speaker 2 He wasn't Shazar. He wasn't Nachum Began.

1:06:17 Speaker 4 Yeah.

1:06:17 Speaker 2 He wasn't a Shimon Peres even. Shimon Peres also had, uh, some type of Polish, uh, upbringing. This is an Israeli that knows noth-- uh, doesn't know much about the Rebbe. And he came, and the Rebbe asked him, "How does it feel in Washington? Do you ever feel alienated?" And he says that he does. He feels a lot very, very alienated. So the Rebbe told him that, uh, "Yeah, hein am levada dishken ba'goyim le'izchashav," that's what the Rebbe told him.

1:06:39 Speaker 4 Am levada dishken.

1:06:40 Speaker 2 Huh? "Hein am levada dishken ba'goyim le'izchashav." That's so you feel, you, you... Yeah, you're gonna be alienated. You, you, you look at alienated as in a negative sense, but it's a positive sense. That's the, that's the, that's the way we are. That's the, uh, the, the, the thing. Anyway, he, he, uh... This is the 12 Shevat 12. 12 Shevat 12, we meet with Rabin. Rabin is then the prime minister, but, uh, we meet with Rabin in the Knesset. We didn't meet him in the, in the-

1:07:06 Speaker 4 He was the prime minister then?

1:07:07 Speaker 2 He was the prime minister then, and we w- we were welcomed by everybody. Again, this was, uh, made an incredible, incredible, uh, uh, m- uh, uh, had an incredible, uh, opkrank, uh, uh, in, in Eretz Yisroel, uh, by everybody. We were by the president, by Katzir, was Efraim Katzir was the president. We went to visit the, uh, uh, the mayor. We had, um... And we went to the Knesset. We met, uh, Rabin, we met with, with, uh, in, in, in the Knesset. And, uh, I remember him coming out. He came out with, with a shirt, short-sleeved shirt, without a tie. Uh, it was, uh, quite neat, and then he had a few rechayim, as he would call, was because that he likes to fabrenger a lot. He's a big fabrenger, uh, Rabin. And, uh, anyway, but Rabbi Mantik was in by him before that. He gave him the check, and he told him also that was the message from the Rebbe, that if, if he remembers what the Rebbe spoke about, the hein am levada dishken ba'goyim le'izchashav. That's the-

1:08:01 Speaker 4 That was the message that the Rebbe sent

1:08:02 Speaker 2 ... that was the message that the Rebbe sent him. What's very, very interesting is that by the, uh... When he had the thing with Carter, with Arafat, with Clinton, with Arafat-

1:08:11 Speaker 4 Oslo.

1:08:12 Speaker 2 Huh?

1:08:12 Speaker 4 Oslo.

1:08:13 Speaker 2 After Oslo, in, in, in the White House, they had a-

1:08:17 Speaker 4 Oh, the, the signing.

1:08:17 Speaker 2 When they were signing, and they, they all gave hands. And what, what the words that he said, "And now is not anymore hein am levada dishken."

1:08:27 Speaker 4 Oh.

1:08:27 Speaker 2 Like, "Those, those..." You know, "Now is not anymore."

1:08:30 Speaker 4 So he remembers the Rebbe's words, and he swore-

1:08:32 Speaker 2 He said it... It was in a different, in a different context, but, but that was, that was the, uh, the bug was there, you know?

1:08:38 Speaker 4 Right.

1:08:38 Speaker 2 Uh, the, he knows that the bug is there. Okay?

1:08:40 Speaker 4 He knows what the Rebbe says, but he's saying something different. Okay. Among Tsidim is brought to you by Chassidishe Der Her. We live in a chaotic world A world where for us Chassidim, as they say, nu lo ra'inu, we do not have the ability to hear and see the Rebbe on a daily basis. Yet we know that the Rebbe is very much with us, and Chabad is alive and thriving more than ever before. One needs to only tap into it. Chabad provides you and your family with the tools necessary to tap into all of this. Whether it's the monthly magazine, the way it all began, whether it's their books, their online content, and so much more. Men, women, and children throughout the world benefit and use these tools on a daily basis. Whether it's children enjoying the children's magazine that comes along with the regular Der Her or enjoying the children's podcast, whether it's bachurim in yeshivas receiving the Der Her, whether it's girls in high schools enjoying their Her Club in their local high school, people all over the world and from all walks of life enjoy and utilize these tools and take advantage of it. If you're not already subscribed to the Her monthly magazine, do so today at derher.org. That's D-E-R-H-E-R.org. Der Her is a dynamic organization which is committed to continue providing these tools, grow on a constant basis, and do all that we can to help this effort. Baruch Hashem, it takes a lot of resources and finances to make

1:10:33 Speaker 4 this all happen. You can be part of Der Her through your financial support as well through visiting our website, derher.org, or through contacting us to setting up a meeting. Thank you very much. Enjoy the rest of the podcast.

1:10:46 Speaker 2 You know, I travel a lot now, and I sometimes have trouble 'cause it's a slow and it's also very difficult to get there. I say it's ain't, ain't Amga Badanishke. You can't even get a flight there.

1:10:56 Speaker 4 Right.

1:10:56 Speaker 2 It's so difficult.

1:10:57 Speaker 4 Isolated.

1:10:58 Speaker 2 That's my, that's my new title, ain't Amga Badanishke.

1:11:01 Speaker 4 Can't even get there.

1:11:02 Speaker 2 Restoration, what? It's a disaster. So that's how, uh, anyway-

1:11:07 Speaker 4 So what do you got-- What do-- So you come-

1:11:09 Speaker 2 So Tim comes to Shlomo-

1:11:09 Speaker 4 You come to Eretz Yisrael, the whole Kabbalah spun, and what do you do there?

1:11:12 Speaker 2 We came to the-- We learned here. We accepted-

1:11:13 Speaker 4 Where?

1:11:14 Speaker 2 We, we, well, we lived in Samarkandek.

1:11:16 Speaker 4 In Yerushalayim.

1:11:16 Speaker 2 In, in Yerushalayim, yeshiva, and we lived in Samarkandek.

1:11:18 Speaker 4 The whole group lived in Samarkandek?

1:11:19 Speaker 2 The whole group, yeah. In Yerushalayim and it's fast.

1:11:21 Speaker 4 Two groups.

1:11:22 Speaker 2 Yeah, we, we-- two groups. We were in Yerushalayim. We learned in Yerushalayim in, in, in Samarkandek, and we slept in Tel Samos. We'd go to Samarkandek, we'd be there a whole day, and then go back to Yerushalayim. But we felt a respo-

1:11:33 Speaker 4 Tel Samos.

1:11:33 Speaker 2 Yeah, but we felt a responsibility to bring the Avira of Seven Seventy to Eretz Yisrael. We'd go to Fabling and, and again, you, you, you know, you know, now I get a little bit older than, than I didn't understand it, but, you know, you take a look the, the the, the, the, the, the, the, the welcoming from, from Yisraelis over there. I used to give a sharing for Chabad, okay? That, uh, seventy, a hundred people would come to a share every single, every single week, and, uh, well, since, since we give a share, I mean, come on, give me a break. But, you know, with the Rebbe Shliach, and that's why it's special to, to-- it's incredible just, uh, you know, the, the, the outpour. As we said before, the connection, the, the will to be connected to the Rebbe, that's, that was the point. You know, to, to have a connection, that was, uh, that's beyond.

1:12:18 Speaker 4 The Rebbe. Yeah.

1:12:20 Speaker 2 No question about it.

1:12:21 Speaker 4 Okay.

1:12:21 Speaker 2 And, uh, I think, you know, again, you know, Fabling a lot, and Shluchim would come always. They would give the Shliach the, an incredible, an incredible place up front, up, uh, versus, you know, all the Chassidim. I s- uh, you know, think, you know, versus Tuvia Bray just passed away. I remember coming to him, you know, we, we again, you know, had to make sure that, uh, that, that, uh, the, the Rebbe's letters wanted w- to be, uh, after Fabling and that it should be in the newspapers. I used to go with Berke Wolf to, to Tuvia, that he should, you know, make a report, uh, about a, uh, you know, a you know, think about a, a news release. It was unbelievable. You know, this tiny apartment that, uh, one and a half rooms, okay? But always made place. We were there. Mamish, uh, able to do it. There was no such thing, not day, not night, you know. You know, bachurim, there, there's no day, there's no night, you know. But we, you know, it's gotta be done.

1:13:15 Speaker 4 Yeah.

1:13:15 Speaker 2 And, uh, and, and, you know, Tuvia's much, much, much older. Tuvia's th- forty years older than me. I'm just thinking about it right now, and he would make himself available. You know, again, the Shliach, uh, Shliach of the Rebbe. It's, it's, it's, it's mind-boggling.

1:13:30 Speaker 4 Yeah.

1:13:30 Speaker 2 You know? Never thought about it, but it, it's, you think about it, it's, it's incredible. And all the young guys, Moshe Slonim, uh, Meir Freiman, uh, uh, uh, Friedman, oh, everybody, oh, every single place. Rabonim, Rabash Kenazi, Rab- uh, Rabash Sholom, uh, Yisrofsky. Everybody was, uh, incredible.

1:13:54 Speaker 4 How long... S- so how long were you there the first year?

1:13:57 Speaker 2 So anyway, so what-

1:13:58 Speaker 4 How long were you there the first year?

1:13:59 Speaker 2 So we went for, uh, it's, it's, uh, uh, uh, we were there, we were there from to . Uh, I was there from to the first time non-stop with, uh, .

1:14:09 Speaker 4 So .

1:14:11 Speaker 2 Yeah. I came back the first time here was for . I got engaged. I got, uh, I got, uh, I was engaged or became-

1:14:19 Speaker 4 So one second. Um, so I wanna hear about that. How'd, how'd your shidduch happen while you're on shlichus? How did that happen?

1:14:25 Speaker 2 My, uh, c- my cousin came to, to visit me in Eretz Yisrael.

1:14:29 Speaker 4 So the, the bachurim-

1:14:30 Speaker 2 She came for the story once

1:14:30 Speaker 4 ... the bachurim that were on shlichus were, were, were getting involved with shidduchim while they're on shlichus?

1:14:36 Speaker 2 Yeah. Yeah.

1:14:37 Speaker 4 So you guys th- you guys knew that it's gonna be for, for a long time, or you thought you didn't know anything?

1:14:42 Speaker 2 We didn't know anything.

1:14:43 Speaker 4 But the Rebbe told you, told some of you to be involved in shidduchim.

1:14:46 Speaker 2 No, I don't remember how it w- uh, how it went that we should become involved with shidduchim, but, uh, uh, I don't remember. I was the first one, actually, that did a shidduch. I asked the Rebbe, you know, if they could come. They asked the Rebbe, I asked the Rebbe. My father asked the Rebbe. I don't remember that I should ask the Rebbe. My parents asked the Rebbe, "Mustama," if, you know, they can-- they'll talk to me a shidduch from, from an American girl. And the Rebbe said, "Yeah, Mustama." I don't remember-

1:15:09 Speaker 4 So your wife had to go to, uh, to Israel to meet you?

1:15:11 Speaker 2 My wife went to Israel. She came to Israel, yeah.

1:15:14 Speaker 4 So while-- A-and she stayed there, and then while, while you're-

1:15:17 Speaker 2 While we were dating, yeah.

1:15:19 Speaker 4 Yeah.

1:15:19 Speaker 2 Dating for, you know, for, for, for a week and a half, two weeks. It wasn't-- It took us, took u- took, took me very, very fast. I, uh, I wrote to the Rebbe, "Dear Rebbe, Rebbe, you know, what do you think?" And the Rebbe said, "Yeah, we will make a match with this young man, and he will be your husband."

1:15:32 Speaker 4 So this is in the summer?

1:15:33 Speaker 2 This was, uh, uh, Yud Thei, uh, uh, Gimmel Zichros, or, or two days before Gimmel Zichros, uh, five shin chaf, uh, five shin, uh, lamed zayin.

1:15:43 Speaker 4 So you had a very long, uh, engagement.

1:15:45 Speaker 2 Hmm?

1:15:45 Speaker 4 You had a long engagement.

1:15:46 Speaker 2 I had a very long engagement, yes. My engagement was, I got married a little bit... Oh, that one's very interesting because, uh, I wrote to the Rebbe. So first I asked the Rebbe, uh, when we should, when we should get married, and the Rebbe answered me that, uh, I don't remember the exact w-wording right now, but the, the essence was that, uh, um, uh, that, uh, I'm going blank right now on this, but the essence was that, uh, because the dates are up to the bride-

1:16:17 Speaker 4 The dates of the wedding

1:16:17 Speaker 2 The dates of the wedding are up to the bride. So, uh, that's I remember. So that we-- After she can get from her a few dates, but then he should mark them in the book of his mind. That I remember the Rebbe said, but then he should mark them in the book of his mind.

1:16:31 Speaker 4 First get the information from the bride and then-

1:16:33 Speaker 2 But then he should mark them in the book of his mind. That's the way I remember it said, not, uh, not this. And I sat putting three dates, and the Rebbe picked the worst date. The worst date was a little bit before Passover, was the worst date. Very interesting. Usually, the Rebbe is usually the first date, but that's the way it was.

1:16:45 Speaker 4 Usually the Rebbe wants it to be shorter.

1:16:47 Speaker 2 And what happened was-

1:16:48 Speaker 4 Your bride was back home in America, and you're in Israel.

1:16:50 Speaker 2 In America. So, but, but what interesting was that the first two dates there was a snowstorm with such snow here that one of the dates was impossible to make a wedding.

1:17:02 Speaker 4 Uh-huh.

1:17:02 Speaker 2 It was partially not, not, not, not... The, uh, everything was catered in, in, in, in, in, in, in Jewish Center. He couldn't bring the stuff. It wasn't possible to bring the stuff from Young Israel to Jewish Center. It's a walk and a half.

1:17:15 Speaker 4 Young Israel, his kitchen was in Young Israel.

1:17:17 Speaker 2 His kitchen was in Young Israel, yeah. So after the snowstorm, there was a, uh... He was one of the caterers. There was only a few caterers, so, of that, of that day.

1:17:25 Speaker 4 Uh-huh. So-

1:17:26 Speaker 2 But that's, but that's, uh, you know, the fact.

1:17:29 Speaker 4 So you got married. You-

1:17:29 Speaker 2 I got married here

1:17:30 Speaker 4 ... Rebbe got married here.

1:17:31 Speaker 2 I got married here.

1:17:33 Speaker 4 So it's an interesting thing. Like you, you, you left the studies to get married, basically.

1:17:37 Speaker 2 I left the studies to get married. So I asked the Rebbe if I can come to get married. "Yes." I left the studies to get married. So when I came here, I came here for the week before Passover snowstorm. Now the week before, by, uh, uh, uh, I was here, and, uh, I don't remember the dates, you know, again, but, uh, probably right the day after, after the week before, we went to the, the private audience for, uh, for the wedding.

1:18:03 Speaker 4 Bride and groom.

1:18:03 Speaker 2 I went with my bride and groom and also the parents of the bride and groom, my parents went, and my, and, and my in-laws went. That's the way it, that's the way it, that's the way it went. But there was no private audience then. It wasn't the private audience hall. The Rebbe sat in his door. It was after the snowstorm. So the snowstorm private audience, the way it worked was that the Rebbe sat in his door. There was like a hospital table that the Rebbe sat by. And you came, you stood in front of the Rebbe, and it was like a private audience. It was like the private private audience. Something like, like, like the, uh, Gvirim, something like Machneh Erez, the same type, type of setup to a certain extent.

1:18:33 Speaker 4 So you're standing in the entrance hall.

1:18:34 Speaker 2 So we're standing the entrance hall, but we're standing ourselves. The Rebbe is sitting in the reception room. The Rebbe, there's a hospital table in between the Rebbe's, uh, table and us.

1:18:42 Speaker 4 And the door.

1:18:42 Speaker 2 Yeah. And I think there's a tallit on the table and a pushka, a Torah scroll pushka. The Rebbe always-- Like I have to give a commercial for a Torah scroll.

1:18:48 Speaker 4 We'll talk about that soon, yeah.

1:18:49 Speaker 2 No problem. If I have to give a pushka, if I have to give a commercial. Okay. So, uh, but there was a, uh, I'm almost sure there was a Torah scroll pushka. But anyway, the, uh, there's a, uh, uh, an, an... So you, you're going over, you're standing like in the corner, like where from Leibel Groner's office, you're standing over there in the corner. There's people that are talking to the Rebbe, and then when they walk away, you walk over. So it's like exactly something like Machneh Erez. If, if you remember Machneh Erez or I'm sure if you saw videos of Machneh Erez. I don't know if there's a video of that particular private audience. I don't think there is, but that, that, that was the setup to a certain extent. And we walk over, and the Rebbe says, "What did you do there?"

1:19:28 Speaker 4 What did you do there?

1:19:28 Speaker 2 Yeah. And I got petrified, you know, then because I like, you know, the truth, you know, I had issues. The Rebbe said, "You arranged this special private audience."

1:19:37 Speaker 4 Special.

1:19:38 Speaker 2 That's what he said. "You arranged it with Maskirit when..."

1:19:42 Speaker 4 You arranged it-

1:19:43 Speaker 2 I arranged it-

1:19:43 Speaker 4 It was decided that you're going to private audience by yourself.

1:19:45 Speaker 2 Yeah.

1:19:45 Speaker 4 You should go find out details with Maskirit.

1:19:46 Speaker 2 Now to do what you will do. I can't say what you will do, but a lot of times when the Rebbe would say something, the Rebbe wouldn't say. If the Rebbe would say something to surprise to a person, the Rebbe would say, "You arranged it." Like, uh, Yossel Gutnick, when the Rebbe gave him a second thing of matzah and everybody only got one, and the Rebbe gave him two. The Rebbe said, the Rebbe said, "You arranged it with Reuven Tschwei," something like that, you know. That was a, uh... I know of some other things that was, but that's the way, that, that, that's the way it was.

1:20:10 Speaker 4 So you don't know what's going on. You know that the Rebbe wants you in private audience.

1:20:13 Speaker 2 Yeah. I don't... That's right. Exactly so. I don't know what. Exactly so. So then a few days later, uh, then the Rebbe gives me blessings for the wedding, and that's it. And then, uh, I went to Newark. I was a bachelor. I went to Newark. I wasn't here. And then one of the times Rabbi Chadakov called me. Rabbi Chadakov says-

1:20:31 Speaker 4 Wait, you didn't go running to Maskirit the moment-

1:20:33 Speaker 2 I went to Maskirit, it's true, but they didn't know also. I don't remember.

1:20:36 Speaker 4 Okay.

1:20:36 Speaker 2 Those details I don't remember again.

1:20:37 Speaker 4 Okay.

1:20:38 Speaker 2 It's not, uh... I almost don't remember.

1:20:39 Speaker 4 So you get a call from Rabbi Chadakov.

1:20:41 Speaker 2 Rabbi Binyamin told me that to go to Rabbi Chadakov, and, uh, t-together with Rabbi Menachem Dov Pevzner. This was already together with Rabbi Menachem Dov Pevzner. And, uh, Rabbi-

1:20:50 Speaker 4 He wa- He, he was with you in the first group?

1:20:52 Speaker 2 No.

1:20:53 Speaker 4 No.

1:20:53 Speaker 2 No, he came for the week before Passover. Yeah, he went with me for the first group.

1:20:55 Speaker 4 I-

1:20:55 Speaker 2 Yeah, he-

1:20:56 Speaker 4 So everyone came for the week before Passover.

1:20:57 Speaker 2 Not everybody. He came.

1:20:58 Speaker 4 You guys came for the week before Passover.

1:20:58 Speaker 2 He came. He came.

1:20:59 Speaker 4 You came to get married. He came for the week before Passover.

1:21:01 Speaker 2 He came to mar- I ca- he ca- Yeah, then he was gonna go. He was there for the week before Passover.

1:21:03 Speaker 4 He was a bachelor?

1:21:04 Speaker 2 He was a bachelor. Both bachelors. He got married, uh, right after me, a few, uh, uh, a week after me. He got engaged also with a, uh, uh, with a, w-with an Israeli girl. He went back to Lubavitch, but he came over here. It's true, he had issues here, and other people had issues and to come here. Anyway, uh, and Rabbi Chadakov, uh, uh, says to me that the Rebbe view-- Uh, or maybe I went myself, I'm not sure. Then I went to Chabad ambadach a second time. It could be, I don't remember. I almost don't remember. Okay, but I know that Rabbi Chadakov said to me that the Rebbe wants to be martir or shlichas to do not the slog, and if you're ready to take it. So I said, "Of course, I'm ready to take it, you know, no question about that."

1:21:41 Speaker 4 But it's like before then, you thought your shlichas was over? You're getting married or whatever?

1:21:45 Speaker 2 No, I was gonna get married and go back to the store, but I was gonna find myself. I didn't know that the Rebbe was going to assign to me what to do.

1:21:51 Speaker 4 So it was like, uh, but the other people, the other Bachar and Yungolite that were there, they were already looking for anyone to do there, or they were still learning some Hasidic the whole time?

1:21:58 Speaker 2 I don't even remember-

1:21:59 Speaker 4 It was all developing then, basically

1:22:00 Speaker 2 ... I don't even remember what w- what-what-what-what I was thinking about. I was, you know, we didn't think about the, you know-

1:22:05 Speaker 4 So Chadakov-

1:22:06 Speaker 2 We started, I said I remember the-

1:22:07 Speaker 4 Got it. So Chadakov is asking you-

1:22:08 Speaker 2 The Rebbe sent some letter then. What-what-what-what... The Rebbe then sent some letter, what-what-what we can do that, we can, uh, get married and, uh, uh, what are the things. I'm almost sure that was Ramat Cha- uh, Ramat Chas, Mas Ramat Chas, I'm almost sure.

1:22:19 Speaker 4 So could be it was before then.

1:22:21 Speaker 2 The Shehech Sheva, the letter came to Shehech Sheva. That, that, that was the letter about the famous letter to the shluchim.

1:22:26 Speaker 4 To figure out their-- Okay, so, so basically everyone's figuring out what to do and, and you're getting a thing.

1:22:30 Speaker 2 I don't know if everybody was figuring it out. I don't know how it worked out. You know, I was thinking about getting married. I, you know, didn't think about, uh, figuring out

1:22:36 Speaker 4 But once the Rebbe writes it in the letter, the Rebbe writes it in the letter that people should get, uh-

1:22:40 Speaker 2 Uh, s- yeah, right. But I didn't-- I don't remember. I was thinking about the w-- I was thinking about other things. I was thinking, I was thinking about, uh, but in, in my own mind, maybe I'll do this, maybe I'll do that.

1:22:49 Speaker 4 Okay.

1:22:49 Speaker 2 Thinking about, about, about other things. Certainly, uh, uh, I did not-- certainly not Kehilat Chabad, and certainly nothing to do that even know what, what, what it was. You know, I had no, no connection to Chabad.

1:22:58 Speaker 4 Got it. Fine. So, so to say, so it's Chadakov, so Chadakov, Chadakov says, "Rebbe-"

1:23:02 Speaker 2 Rabbi Chadakov says the Rebbe wants to make a sh-shlichas now. He even spoke about it to me, about Shuvi Yeshiva. He didn't talk in, in clear words. It wasn't, it wasn't a clear, clear Russian what, what, uh, uh, uh, what he, uh, uh, uh, uh, what the job was. It wasn't clear. And, uh, so I said, "Of course, I'm ready." Anyway, so he says, "Yeah, but if you want to, you ha-- you have to ask your, your, uh, kallah if she's ready." So I said, "I know for sure she's ready." But Chadakov says, "No, you have to ask her, and you can't give me an answer before twenty-four hours."

1:23:32 Speaker 4 But your wife, Michal, knew what she was getting into. She came-

1:23:34 Speaker 2 Yes, she knows she's going to the store. She knows she's going-

1:23:35 Speaker 4 She came down to saw this, the, the, the, the meet you

1:23:38 Speaker 2 ... Well, and she knows, and she knows she's going to the store, but, but what we're gonna do in the store and what's gonna happen, that we didn't-

1:23:43 Speaker 4 She had to wait twenty-four hours, okay

1:23:44 Speaker 2 ... that we didn't know. Anyway, I came back. Anyway, uh, I don't remember when Milyaman told us, but Milyaman said that there's going to be Yechidut together with the Rebbe, and the Yechidut is going to be on Friday morning. I'm getting married on Sunday. Friday morning is Yechidut by the Rebbe, uh, Friday at eleven o'clock. But, uh, so we went to Gan Eydei Hatalchan. Me and Rab bimbal achsavnu, we're sitting in the Gan Eydei Hatalchan. You're able to hear, not words, but you're able to hear, mamish, the Rebbe's voice. Rabbi Chadakov is in by the Rebbe. You're able to hear the Rebbe's voice. I don't remember, didn't make... Anyway, at eleven twenty, approximately, the Rebbe came out. The Rebbe came out, was standing by the door. The Rebbe opened the door. The Rebbe came out. The Rebbe was-- First Rabbi Chadakov went, and then he, the Rebbe came out. The Rebbe was holding in his hand two Tanyas, the Rebbe was holding. I remember even some, during the Yechidut, the Rebbe would like flickered, you know, it was a soft cover Tanyas, you know, be'ezrat Hashem. Flick the pages. And the Rebbe spoke about, uh, uh, az abhi yefaratim tsatsrog. There was a whole Yechidut of fi-- uh, s-seven minutes approximately that the Rebbe spoke about that, uh, we sh-- uh, uh, az abhi yefaratim tsatsrog, and, uh, v'tzach aleihem m'di yeshivas. Then the yeshiva was gonna be on the k- uh, on the Kehilat Chabad. Later it changed that we-- that it was gonna

1:24:57 Speaker 2 go back to the Teldt Shamas, but it was at, at, at least at that moment. And the Rebbe said about opening it up in, uh, uh, Beis Chabad Yerushalayim, uh, HaAtika and, uh, Beis Chabad Yerushalayim HaChadasha. And, uh, uh, the Rebbe spoke about also that az abhi is at, uh, very strong, that, uh, b- everything should be bedikeh lehhem, bedikeh shogeg, not to be-- not any machogus. The whole, uh, perhaps some points written down, the whole Yechidut from the Rebbe. And, uh, then the Rebbe finished, and then the Rebbe says, uh, "Yet vashtanan." And it didn't look like we understood everything. So Rebbe says, "Az kukt zis az nishtalis." You know, like the Rebbe, Rebbe says, "Uh, kop anim tzich iber trachten, iber eiden, and tzometzech habim shaeles atzich, uh, atzich iberim," to Rabbi Chadakov. So that was the, uh... But that one we got, that one, uh... Oh, the Rebbe then said also, "Az, uh, uh, uh, az, uh, eyn elf nachetz ach fanem begashmius, eyn em itruchnius. Itz ach fanem m'lgius chsofim v- fun Kehilat Chabad."

1:25:55 Speaker 4 Raise, raise money.

1:25:56 Speaker 2 "Em itruchnius," raise money, right? To raise money.

1:25:58 Speaker 4 So, so the Rebbe's mentioning a bunch of things, and included in that is Kehilat Chabad.

1:26:03 Speaker 2 But yeah, but, uh, but under Kehilat Chabad, that was the whole thing was under Kehilat Chabad.

1:26:06 Speaker 4 The whole thing was about Kehilat Chabad, and the Rebbe was saying different things about the Chabad.

1:26:09 Speaker 2 Different things also, about Beis Chabad in Yeru- in Yerushalayim HaAtika, the Beis-- if you need it in the Beis Chabad in Yerushalayim HaChadashah. That's what the Rebbe definitely spoke about that, too. Yes.

1:26:17 Speaker 4 But that's not what you did.

1:26:20 Speaker 2 We, we did do it when we started. We w- we were gonna do a Beis Chabad. Beis Chabad, uh, we were gonna-- We were thinking about opening a Beis Chabad in, in, in, in, in Yeru Chadashah, but it didn't work out. We, we, you know, we started, we, we were thinking about it later. It's, uh, that was a, that's a separate, a separate story for itself.

1:26:37 Speaker 4 But you understood basically from that Yechidut that it was all about Kehilat Chabad.

1:26:44 Speaker 2 I didn't s- understand anything.

1:26:45 Speaker 4 Okay, so what happened?

1:26:47 Speaker 2 Okay. Very hard to say what was, what, what, what I understood, what I didn't understand, okay? Wasn't f- wasn't, uh, wasn't, wasn't clear to me. I mean, that we-- it was clear that we, that we work under Kehilat Chabad. It was clear that we go, we take care of the shluchim. That was we ca-- That was clear, okay? That we're in charge of the shluchim that went to Tsarsuslov, that third group of shluchim. That was clear. It was clear that we work for Kehilat Chabad, okay? It was clear that at half a day we were in the Kehilat Tzedek Tzadok. It was clear that anoth- other half a day we were under Kehilat Chabad, that we-- under Kehilat Chabad. But, and it was clear that we're gonna do Whatever work on the how it's gonna work out in terms of a and a that was clear.

1:27:33 Speaker 5 Did you, did you go to have a for clarification on all this or you didn't? You didn't remember?

1:27:42 Speaker 2 No. That's what I remember.

1:27:44 Speaker 5 So you got, so you got married and you went back down to Israel.

1:27:47 Speaker 2 I got married and went back to Tel Aviv. So-

1:27:50 Speaker 5 And yeah. What did-- You knew anything about before? Like, you, like...

1:27:56 Speaker 2 No.

1:27:58 Speaker 5 So how do you figure out what, what's going on? Like, how does that work?

1:28:01 Speaker 2 I didn't figure out. I went back Tel Aviv. I mean, I knew because I got money from for my . I knew the people there. I knew all the p- uh, all the players I knew. Okay? I knew the, the I knew. I knew, uh, . I knew, uh, . I started the, the, the, the, you know, the dabbling, you know. We started dabbling, you know. What the, what, what, what we can do this, we can do this. You know, we're doing, doing everything. And we're and, you know, the, the sky's the limit and, uh, and, uh, beyond the sky you shoot for the stars.

1:28:33 Speaker 5 So maybe you could tell me a little bit, a little bit about . What is it? What's, what is it supposed to do? Like, just, just give, give the, give me the

1:28:44 Speaker 2 was, uh, set up by the to be able to help here in Tel Aviv. That's what, that's what the fund was, and that was, uh, what-- That, that, uh, uh, uh, when we came Tel Aviv, uh, had a and, uh, gave money for helped out families, and before Pesach and before Rosh Hashanah, uh, helped out families. Helped out, uh, some helped out some, some Angelites. And, uh, they, uh, had also a an absorption that worked with with a lot of Russians that came, that they, uh, had program for them. They had clubs for them. They had, uh, uh, uh, kindergartens for them. That's what, that's what basically what what, what did. And they helped out, uh, with some organizations. They, that wrote to them to ask them for help, that they, that they helped them. Where did they have the money from? Some of the money was raised from the outside people that sent money, and then also from the, from the, uh, base. They had the cemetery that, uh, where, that, that people bought, uh, places, and that was like-

1:29:50 Speaker 5 In Yerushalayim.

1:29:50 Speaker 2 In Yerushalayim. And that was like a source of income for them at that time. That was, uh, that, that, that's as far as what was then. Okay?

1:30:02 Speaker 5 So when you come to Israel and you started doing stuff-

1:30:04 Speaker 2 So when we come to Israel, so first of all, so we started, uh, uh, uh, trying to, uh... So half a day we were in and half a day-- And we w-- I was giving a share in to the, to the in, in from show, and from the, the, the and the, and, uh, and I started, uh, uh, uh, organizing things, you know. So I sta- to build connections. We started maybe we'll do this, maybe we'll do that. We're thinking maybe we'll build a Maybe we'll build a b- uh, uh, uh, we wanted to do a b- a in the, the new city that, uh, uh, we were thinking to take an apartment and to, to, to, to rent a place where That was, uh, you know, different types of things that we're trying to do. Trying to, to, to organize. Trying to organize Halach, we should be able to do Whatever it was, and to do and to work.

1:30:57 Speaker 5 So, and you started raising money right away?

1:31:01 Speaker 2 And I started, I-- No. My, my, my, my first, uh, I, my first fundraising trip was, uh, a few months later.

1:31:11 Speaker 5 From Eretz Israel you went for a fundraising trip?

1:31:12 Speaker 2 From Eretz Israel. I went to, I went to Europe to raise money. I wanted to make, raise money. At first I wrote to the Rebbe doing, going to Australia, but the Rebbe was ill with, and then I went. But, uh, my, my first fundraising trip was I went on the way here, uh, I, uh, I started raising money there. I got, made some c-contacts with, with government officers to make money. So that's what I was working on, but not in terms of fundraising in the outside. My first, uh, uh, I organized also, I didn't organize a that I organized. We had friends of mine that were here, that they make there was a, there was a, there was a, uh, for That was the first, uh, but I was not here for that It was done remotely. And, uh, my first fundraising trip was in order of that I went to London and to Paris, and to b- uh, to London and to Paris.

1:32:11 Speaker 5 Okay. So-

1:32:12 Speaker 2 That's where I went m- that's where I went.

1:32:13 Speaker 5 So how-

1:32:13 Speaker 2 And I came here, and I came here for Pesach.

1:32:16 Speaker 5 You came here for Pesach?

1:32:18 Speaker 2 For Pesach Correct.

1:32:22 Speaker 5 So what happened afterwards?

1:32:22 Speaker 2 Okay. So now when I came here for Pesach we, uh, when I came here for Pesach we, we, uh, were here and, uh, Pesach was over on Wednesday. Pesach was over Thursday. Pesach was over Thursday, and I went to on Monday night. I went to Okay? And, uh, the Rebbe started that, uh, that uh, first of all, the Rebbe asked if I still, if, if, if, if, if, if we're going, if I'm, uh, if I was still learning, learning in for a half a day, and I said that, "Yes." Then the Rebbe started that, uh, uh, I wrote to the Rebbe, I was, uh, questioning if I should, uh, I wanted to do a fundraising trip over here to go to cities, to go to s- uh, Florida, Shom Lipskis, and then he would help me then. And the Rebbe started that, uh, uh, again, I wish I would, I would, should have looked at this before, that, uh- I was in Yechidus together with Feige and with Goldie. Goldie was born already by then.

1:33:42 Speaker 4 Your daughter?

1:33:43 Speaker 2 My daughter. The Rebbe, uh, was, uh, that, uh, he was hoping that he, uh, you know, that he was hoping with Kiruv Chabad that we were really gonna make, uh, progress, and was very, very disappointed. You know, b-b-but, but basically, there's, uh, k- other Kiruvim, Kiruv Shem v'Malchus. They have dinners, and they have banquets, and they do things. And this is amazing from the Alter Rebbe, that the Rebbe and, uh, all Rebbeim and, uh, nothing. There's, uh, uh, "In New York, there are two million Jews, a million nine hundred and ninety-two thousand" In New York, there's two million Jews, a million nine hundred and ninety thousand don't even know there's such a thing as a Kiruv Chabad. The whole, uh, you send, uh, the whole thing, the whole, uh, campaign is a couple of thousand letters that you send out that who knows if the addresses are even good. So he says, you know, he doesn't see to go to, uh, little cities to raise money. That, that he can do through committees, but, you know, you have to really build up. "I was hoping," the Rebbe said, "that I'm sent you and Persnet to Slon, and I was really hoping that, uh, you guys are gonna really, uh, build up this institution." And like, basically a very, very, uh, big disappointment. And the Rebbe was upset, but, uh, uh, hopefully that you, you still will. And if not, the Rebbe used very sharp words. Okay? But, uh, uh, and then the Rebbe said-

1:35:11 Speaker 4 But now what?

1:35:12 Speaker 2 Uh, "The previous Rebbe is perhaps showing us with laughter," the Rebbe said. But the Rebbe, yeah. But and then the, the, uh... And then the Rebbe said, uh, and then the Rebbe said, uh, that, uh, "But, uh, if, uh, uh, that..." Uh, uh, he asked me how long I'm staying. I said, "For another week." So he says, "So you have time to work, and Shabbos "If you have something special, I could, uh, speak about it "" The Rebbe said, "I'll speak about it ."

1:35:41 Speaker 4 You mean if you have something special?

1:35:43 Speaker 2 If, yeah, if you're gonna make an event or something-

1:35:45 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm

1:35:45 Speaker 2 ... that, you know. And, and, uh, and, uh... And the Rebbe said that "Every single thing is if it is your "if you work diligently, so then you're successful." So certainly an institution that the Alter Rebbe was established and that every single Rebbe was, was, was head of it. So, uh, with so, if you put in a little bit, uh, effort, you'll have incredible successes. You'll be incredible success. The Rebbe said, uh, uh, uh, uh, yeah. So, so, okay. There'll be s- tremendous successes. And, uh, that's what the Yechidus, that's what the Yechidus fi- that's what the Yechidus finished. Then the Rebbe gave, uh, then the Rebbe gave, uh, uh, my wife a dollar and, uh, and, uh, the baby a dollar. And then the Rebbe gave Rachmi, so he says, like, the You know, the, uh, the, uh, the or something like that. He'd say I remember the, something, something along those lines. Like, you know, to sue that you're the worst. So that was the, uh, that was that Yechidus, which took place on chav zeh nisn. Uh, of course, I went out and, uh-

1:37:03 Speaker 4 Chav zeh nisn?

1:37:04 Speaker 2 Chav zeh nisn.

1:37:05 Speaker 4 Nisn.

1:37:06 Speaker 2 Then, of course, I went out and, uh, again, like I thought it was a Monday night and, you know, started really, you know, uh, you know, was-

1:37:14 Speaker 4 I can imagine that that Yechidus, uh, lit a fire.

1:37:17 Speaker 2 You can't imagine. There's no way that you can imagine. I mean, you know, it was beyond anything. It was a very, very, uh, major shakeup. Major, uh, major, major, major shakeup. Uh, anyway, we, I tried and we went to, uh, we, we tried to br-br-bring some people, but the most important thing that, uh, I felt is if you wanna set up something, you know, whatever you're gonna set up, if you're not gonna have a person, that that person is going to run it. So then it's, uh, so as much as I pu-put together, and I put an ad in the paper and, uh, and, and put out some things, but the, I knew that if you're not gonna have a, a person that's gonna open an office here and is gonna spearhead the fundraising campaign, it's just not gonna work. So we have to find the person. Who's the person that we could find? So, uh, I wrote to the Rebbe. I got answers on, of course, I got answers on every single thing. There isn't one, one question that, almost no question that I didn't get an answer, but I didn't get an answer. There, there was no answer, but, uh, there was also there's no answer. Uh, so the Rebbe said also to be very, very careful to take a person that you can't "The Rebbe, Rabos, the only one that's only if a guy that approved himself after a year of a kolel" You know, don't, don't, you, you can't give away

1:38:37 Speaker 2 the institution. A very interesting thing also was, which was very, very interesting, when I wrote to the Rebbe on, uh, Friday, I gave the Rebbe a report of, uh, what went on and what are the things that we're, that, that we're doing or thinking about. And so, and so I wrote to the Rebbe. He didn't really deal that to the Rebbe what I'm did after the Yechidus. So the Rebbe wrote me, "What was done before the Yechidus?" The Rebbe asked me. "What was done on this before the Yechidus?" Which, uh-

1:39:10 Speaker 4 What does that mean? The Rebbe wants to know-

1:39:12 Speaker 2 Yeah. What, what, what did you do before?

1:39:14 Speaker 4 That's why you gave me a report.

1:39:15 Speaker 2 The report. You know, the Rebbe was, uh, wanted very much a report from before. I did not, uh, do much. Again, like I told you, that's what I told you before, that, uh, uh, uh, "after Pesach" was over on Thursday night. So basically, the, before the Yechidus was, uh, Friday and Shabbos and, and-

1:39:32 Speaker 4 So it meant immediately before.

1:39:34 Speaker 2 What?

1:39:34 Speaker 4 The Rebbe meant immediately before, like not, not-

1:39:36 Speaker 2 I know what the Rebbe meant. I know what k- I know what the Rebbe wrote. "What was done before the Yechidus?" And, uh, but I didn't, I ignored that. I didn't answer because I didn't, because I didn't do much, you know. So what am I gonna write? You know, just to make a joke. And, uh, the next time, I, before my next letter, the Rebbe wrote me, "Tell me until I wrote that I didn't do much or whatever I did, you know, a few guys that I did on Yom Tov, you know. So what, uh, but, uh, but that's the way it was. That's the way... That, that, that's the way... That, that's Anyway, we, uh, uh, uh, I had somebody that I had in mind that I asked, that I thought that maybe he would be very, very good, and the Rebbe was very, very... Got a very sharp answer from the Rebbe about it. Most of the answers I think are, are in the book, in Tav Shonah Matess, in, in, in, in, in L'ma'an L'ma'an, Neguel Schedule that came out.

1:40:32 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:40:32 Speaker 2 So I think, I can't say that all of them are there, but many of them are there, many of the answers. And, uh, I remember the Rebbe answered to this, uh, particularly we had a, I had a meeting with a few, uh, prominent Hasidich Chabad, and, uh, the Rebbe wrote me, I wrote to the Rebbe of a meeting that I had with a bunch of people. Could you imagine that? And the Rebbe writes that, "Take them all together or talk on telephone," that the, uh, focus or the goal of the Menahel is to reach out to those that are beyond Chabad and, uh, uh, uh, and to bring them in to support the Kiruv. So what was askonim anash that they thought, you know, with the view with, uh, with dugi-diligently, and they came to the conclusion that this person is, uh... Or the Rebbe asked me before, "What did he do before? What's his experience?" Uh-

1:42:06 Speaker 6 And def-- This person, this hatsah that you had, yeah.

1:42:08 Speaker 2 Yeah, that's the... But that's what I'm just telling you, just it wasn't here.

1:42:11 Speaker 6 The Rebbe's-

1:42:11 Speaker 2 The request, yes, and I'm giving you a, a, just a, just a, a, a, a, uh, you know, a-

1:42:16 Speaker 6 The Rebbe didn't really like this

1:42:16 Speaker 2 ... a framework of, of, of how, uh, you know-

1:42:19 Speaker 6 The Rebbe didn't like, uh, this hatsah, this person.

1:42:21 Speaker 2 The Rebbe didn't, of course, he didn't like my hatsah, but it's just interesting. He didn't write to him, "Have hatsah." Later, the Rebbe wrote no, but this is the way he gave me a very-- He wrote you what the Menahel is supposed to be. He and you know what, what kind of, what kind of person. Anyway, uh, I was, you know, hit a wall. So, uh, Rabbi Halberstam called me, and Rabbi Halberstam told me I was planning to go back to Lubavitcher Slon, that was, was my plan. I sent my things to Lubavitcher Slon, I sent the shipment, and, uh, he told me that he wants to be, he said he's, he wants to be my matir, uh, hatsah. That I should write to the Rebbe that he was matir, that I should stay here to run the office of Kiruv Lubavitch.

1:43:07 Speaker 6 You should be the Menahel yourself.

1:43:08 Speaker 2 I should be the Menahel of Kiruv Lubavitch myself, yes. That, that, that, that, that hatsah. I should propose. He said he's not giving me from the Rebbe. It's his hatsah to me that I should be matir to the Rebbe. He's matir me. Even though before that, when I spoke to him originally, I once threw such a hatsah to him that maybe it should be me, me, and he, like, uh, brushed it off and, uh, you know, in his way-

1:43:30 Speaker 6 I see. You tried this before.

1:43:31 Speaker 2 What?

1:43:32 Speaker 6 You thought of this before.

1:43:33 Speaker 2 I thought, I thought of it on my own, you know, when things were going in a tough way, and I suggested such a thing to him, not to the Rebbe, I mean, because I said maybe I should suggest myself.

1:43:40 Speaker 6 Uh, Halberstam, that's right.

1:43:40 Speaker 2 And he threw it... But anyway, but this, he told me that, he called me and he told me that he, I should write to the Rebbe. He's matir me if I'm, if I want to, you know, that, that, that's what I think that he should do it. Which obviously, of course, I did, and hatsah from Rabbi Halberstam was, was very, very important to me. And I wrote to the Rebbe, and the Rebbe wrote, answered, that, uh, uh, uh, that, uh, uh, his hatsah was for a year, not, not for always. So I should stay for a year.

1:44:14 Speaker 6 Say it, say it in English.

1:44:15 Speaker 2 If I will work with, uh, uh, b'mezids is, uh, with energetic or, or enthusiasm, I don't know, and yuzma is initiative, you know, so then, then I should stay for a year.

1:44:27 Speaker 6 There's something else.

1:44:28 Speaker 2 Initiative. I don't know what, what yuzma is, what initiative, but that's more, more, more... I never got to know-

1:44:34 Speaker 6 They never gave it to you on Google.

1:44:35 Speaker 2 We'll get And, uh, so that was the Tav Shonah Matess. And, uh, then I stayed here a year and, uh, worked on certain things. And then a year later, I wrote to the Rebbe, and I asked the Rebbe, uh, you know, but so the Rebbe, so the Rebbe wrote, but, uh, uh, uh, So then I should stay here.

1:45:07 Speaker 6 If they get new s-

1:45:08 Speaker 2 If, uh, but, but even if they didn't show till now, so I should stay. But, uh, so, uh-

1:45:13 Speaker 6 The Rebbe's giving you to, to do this.

1:45:15 Speaker 2 The Rebbe that, and then also that I, that I didn't, I didn't demonstrate the, the, the, the, the... It, it's not visible, the, uh, from that year, uh, uh, from the first year. But anyway, that's, uh, that, that's the way it came about.

1:45:32 Speaker 6 So, so, so that's how you stayed in New York.

1:45:36 Speaker 2 That's why I stayed in New York.

1:45:36 Speaker 6 So, so what, what happened? But Kiruv Chabad is giving services in Israel, so you have someone else there.

1:45:41 Speaker 2 In the beginning, Kiruv Chabad, we sent money only to New York. We didn't do... We didn't take care of anything, any services in Israel. It was just, uh, they did the service in Israel. Rabbi Barak was in, was in Israel.

1:45:51 Speaker 6 He was there, so he was doing stuff there.

1:45:53 Speaker 2 Yeah. Then they had a big problem over there and they formed the Bechaivas, and there was a issue-

1:45:59 Speaker 6 It was, it, it, it was running separately, basically?

1:46:02 Speaker 2 It wasn't running separately. I mean, I was involved. I was part of the First of all, like this, first of all, when the Rebbe gave us, uh, uh, uh, first of all, when the Rebbe g- uh, the was on But, um, uh, in uh, the Rabbi Zevin passed away. used to be the used to be the When he passed away, uh, B- Baruch Hashem, each one of the were all handpicked by the Rebbeim, all the way through, starting from, from, from So when the, uh, when, uh, passed away, the Rebbe wrote a letter that should-- was also was also part of Rebbe then made it, made, uh, uh, uh, separated. So when we came, was run by two of you, by, uh, uh, Zevin. But, uh, Zevin passed away, and then the Rebbe, they-- Th- th- then wrote to cover-- When he passed away, he passed away he passed away. And they wrote to the, to the Rebbe about, so the Rebbe wrote. There's a letter from the Rebbe to the Yekkes that, uh, me and Rebbe should go into So we were in I was in even though I was here. But, uh, I took a little part, you know, what should be done. But I basically-

1:47:29 Speaker 6 Raising money.

1:47:29 Speaker 2 Raising money also.

1:47:30 Speaker 6 What happened in ?

1:47:32 Speaker 2 there was a big problem because it wasn't possible to, uh, it wasn't possible to operate over there. So I took in, and I started doing projects in Eretz Israel from here. So, uh-

1:47:44 Speaker 6 The

1:47:44 Speaker 2 Under, under my, uh, well, the the Rebbe gave me. It was very, very, uh, very, very s- uh, strong words from the Rebbe about it, to make sure that everything goes through the proper way. And but, uh, but we did it. We have the Baruch Hashem.

1:48:01 Speaker 6 So you ran it to the Rebbe about, about this whole thing that-

1:48:03 Speaker 2 I didn't write to the Rebbe. I used to-- I never wrote to the Rebbe general things. I wrote to the Rebbe about the Okay? So, uh, I wrote to the Rebbe that we're going to give out, uh, we're going to help families for Pesach. Okay? And the Rebbe wrote me, "How do you know that you're setting up your..." The Rebbe didn't say that, but, "How do you know that you're gonna make sure that every single family is, uh, you know, that, you know, these are the families that need? Now, you know, how, how are you gonna make sure? And how are you gonna make sure that every dollar is gonna go to the right place?" Okay? And, uh, uh, okay. And, uh, th- the Rebbe, and, uh, very sharp. And the Rebbe s- sent me a message through one of the secretaries that, uh, you know, that, uh, every do- that I can do whatever I want, but, uh, I should know that I'm responsible, personally responsible, for every single dollar from that, that, that, for every single dollar of Okay? But I did it. I took responsibility, and I did it.

1:49:07 Speaker 6 Okay.

1:49:07 Speaker 2 And then I got a very, very warm response. The Rebbe asked, um, th- the, the next, uh, couple of days later, Rebbe asked, "What'd you do? Did you send the money? You didn't send the money." And I wrote that I sent the money. The Rebbe wrote me, uh, is asking because, uh, the Rebbe wanted you should take responsibility, uh, strong responsibility, very, very sharp responsibility. And, you know, I took responsibility, and, uh, and, and we did it.

1:49:34 Speaker 6 Okay. So, Amir, just to understand. So you started doing I guess like the office in New York is doing ?

1:49:41 Speaker 2 Yeah.

1:49:41 Speaker 6 And then after the whole whatever-

1:49:43 Speaker 2 Correct

1:49:43 Speaker 6 ... it became one thing.

1:49:44 Speaker 2 I'm, yes, I run the things from my, from, from, from, from New York.

1:49:47 Speaker 6 Okay.

1:49:47 Speaker 2 Whatever projects I do, I do my pro- I have my people I have my people that they, they run the people for me. I'm the boss.

1:49:55 Speaker 6 Interesting. I'm thinking it's a, it's a big thing to run an organization-

1:50:00 Speaker 2 It's a very big thing

1:50:01 Speaker 6 ... in Eretz Israel from New York.

1:50:01 Speaker 2 It's a very big thing, but that's the way, that's the way it is. That's the way so-- But you asked me about general, if I asked the Rebbe, I never asked... That's what I'm telling you. Do I have a clear-- I never-- So I, me call never ask the Rebbe general things. I always asked for a specific thing.

1:50:16 Speaker 6 Right.

1:50:16 Speaker 2 I didn't ask for, you know, something of action that's to this. Should I do it? I shouldn't do it. Should I open this project? I shouldn't open this project. And there's some projects that the Rebbe said to open and some projects the Rebbe said to not open.

1:50:30 Speaker 6 Okay. Um, what were s- what were things that the Rebbe said not to, that you remember? Do you remember any of them?

1:50:39 Speaker 2 The Rebbe said not to, so what?

1:50:41 Speaker 6 I'm interested. I'm, I'm, I'm not interested. It, people wanna know h- People wanna know how to do things according to the way the Rebbe wants. So it's, sometimes it helps them to know things that the Rebbe shoyrevel.

1:50:55 Speaker 2 We'll, we'll give a letter.

1:50:56 Speaker 6 Okay. So what were, what were some you got in the beginning? Like, uh, setting up an office, like, uh-

1:51:04 Speaker 2 I got from every single step and every single... But even again, a step, uh, uh, you know, what, what were in, in, in, I just gave you I have to make sure that every dollar that goes through is the right way, that, uh, yeah, personal responsibility, uh, for the monies. That's, uh, the, the basis. The Rebbe was, uh, very, very, uh... I got, I got once an answer from the Rebbe, uh, on, on these days. these days in the three weeks was tough shin. I remember Okay? Uh, So, uh, the Rebbe wrote me that, uh, we had something that I had to take care of in, in, in, in, in, uh, in, uh, in Toronto. Uh, uh, t-tactical things, and I had, uh, pushkas to take care of. And I asked Rabbi Ritzker to, to go to, uh, to, uh, Smorgonsker Who works with me all the years to, uh, go to Toronto, and he wrote to the Rebbe that he's going to Toronto. Uh, so he asked the Rebbe for a broche. So when the Rebbe came back from the AO, I think almost sure it was Cheshvan, Tammuz, and the Rebbe, uh, uh, so he got a phone call. Actually, he was in the country, got a phone call from Rabbi Halikov. Okay. The Rebbe sends out the notes that " Kibalti ze at ah, Pisco, meh, with im bakashas broche melav Shmuel Yechiel Rybsztyn, uh, bekesher im siyor b'Toronto." You know, is there a reason why I don't go? Why, why he's

1:52:46 Speaker 2 going, not, uh, you know, "Hayesh tam shuey nisye baatzmi?"

1:52:51 Speaker 6 Hmm.

1:52:51 Speaker 2 That's what the Rebbe asked. So I wrote to the Rebbe that it was a, uh, you know, whatever he-- the person that takes care of the technical things, and we're trying to build up a pushke program there, and he's the person that's taking care of it, and that's why he went. So the Rebbe wrote me back, "Mikubeh lishleach duch m'purg isov b'meshech cheshvan, Tammuz." Uh, so I sent him a duch, a full duch of, uh, of, uh, of my, of my purgos. And, uh, so then the Rebbe asked, uh, "Chaser kan a hnosoe ve'eitzor." This is already, this is already going into, uh, could be that it was-- it wasn't Elul Cheshvan, I'm sorry. Could be it was He- He- He van Hakhamov. I don't believe it was Elul Cheshvan. It was He van Hakhamov when the Rebbe came from the AO. That's what I'm thinking about.

1:53:39 Speaker 6 He van Hashmanca reports, financial reports.

1:53:41 Speaker 2 Yeah, financial report. So I sent the financial report of exactly what, you know, what was spent, the, uh, uh, basis. So, uh, the Rebbe sent the financial re-report, and, uh, this was already came into, uh, Tishri, Erev Tishri, and I'll never forget, that's right after Tishri, uh, right before Tishri, the middle, right before the fast from Mincha when I sent the report. So the Rebbe sends out the report every single, uh, you know, uh, uh, about, uh, the Rebbe, uh, uh, oh, the Rebbe asked for, uh, uh, uh, a, a, uh, so first I sent financial report, you know, financial statement, you know, expenses, salaries, this, that. I should write a, a, a... Then the Rebbe asked for a detail, detail on every single backup, on every single thing. What was, you know, salaries for who, uh, you know, and, uh, so I wrote in this one, he gets three hundred and fifty dollars a month, that's what their job is. This one, this one gets, uh, uh... And so the Rebbe, each person, you know, Rebbe went through line by line. How come? Do we need, do we really need this person? Like, you know, what does he do, and what does he do, and what does she do? And it's very, uh, mamash, uh, line by line, item by item. Very, very, uh, uh... One of the things that we had, we had, uh, the, uh, machne storehouse that we rented then, and, uh, we had-

1:55:01 Speaker 6 That was the office?

1:55:01 Speaker 2 ... five, five rooms. That was the office of the Chabad, and we spent, like, it was five hundred dollars rent for, uh, for, for, uh, for so, you know. What do we, what, what do, what is, what, what, what is a, uh, a, a mason do-doing in five rooms? How many rooms does B- uh, does Marcus have in Baslvke? You know, like very, uh, very basis. That was on, uh, on Elul Cheshvan, uh... That was on Elul Chesh-- That was on Elul Tish- on Erev Tishri, right before, uh, right before the fast. So I sat down, and I wrote a report, you know, of, uh, you know, what my vision of Kollel Chabad is and what, and just went through, you know, what the, what the purpose of every single thing was.

1:55:45 Speaker 6 So you didn't take it like, "Okay, fine, so we're canceling the five rooms, we're canceling the salaries, and kollel fakhet. Let me, let me explain to the Rebbe what this is."

1:55:51 Speaker 2 That... Uh, uh, I was an idiot. Yes, I did. That's exactly what I did. I ju- I ju- I think-

1:55:57 Speaker 6 Now you think you're an idiot for doing that?

1:55:58 Speaker 2 Do I think I was an idiot? I don't know. That, that, that's what I did. There's no question of... Do I... Cer- certainly, of course, I was an idiot. But, uh, to a certain, the question, certain, yes, to a certain way, uh, anyway, but, you know, uh, uh, uh, this is fact. This is, uh, water under the bridge. Would I do it today different? I would do it today different. But, uh, anyway, but I wrote in a, uh, uh, I s-sent in a, uh, uh, I, uh, I don't know if I have it, but a fifteen-page, very comprehensive, uh, vision and, uh, you know, what, uh, what... You have to understand also, we needed people, you know. There was... If you wanted to have the recording, I remember the things and have, you know, there was no computers. This is, everything had to be done by paper, by card.

1:56:42 Speaker 6 Yeah. Till today you need people, right?

1:56:43 Speaker 2 Oh, I think so. Of course so.

1:56:43 Speaker 6 That's how it works.

1:56:44 Speaker 2 Anyway, the, uh, and, uh, so I thought to myself, and I didn't get an answer. This is the crazy thing.

1:56:50 Speaker 6 That's the whole thing.

1:56:51 Speaker 2 I wrote, I didn't get an answer. This was two chol Hameir Sukkot. Okay. Chol Hameir Sukkot, I wrote, uh, I wanted to take somebody else to work the, on, on, on, open another division of the, of, of another part of Kollel Chabad, and the Rebbe wrote me , "It seems that you don't understand in general what I spoke to you, so therefore I have no choice but to tell you in great detail that you're wasting a lot of mo- mo-- that the, the, the expense of the Kollel is just, uh, uh, too much, uh, exuberant," you know, basis. "And you think that an organized, uh, institution is if every person has a, every part has an, a director, and this director has an office, and this office has a secretary, it has a telephone. And you think that's, that's, that's, that's organized. The organization's def-- Real organization is that you have much, much people, and they c- every one of them is filled up to his capacity. And therefore, right now, not only shouldn't you take another person, but you should, uh, take off ten percent of your staff and ," you know, something. I don't remember exactly what it's written here. I don't know, maybe it's not, uh, uh, in English, but, uh, but, uh, but, but anyway, it's, uh, uh, I, I, I, I... Many people I, I saw seem to wanna write, uh, basis. So it became a very big issue because, you know, I was at capacity. I didn't think that

1:58:21 Speaker 2 I could. So I, uh, wrote to the Rebbe, but Rebbe writes that I should let him know. We-- Uh, I don't remember exactly the Russian. He thinks we should say write the Russian. We should look up the Russian. So I wrote to the Rebbe that, uh, from now on, every single person in Kolko Chabad gets paid only by the hour. There is no salaries, there is no... If there's work, then Rebbe, yeah, took it.

1:58:47 Speaker 6 That exactly-

1:58:47 Speaker 2 "Skav b'vach," yeah. That's it. So I, I smuggled my way through, so I didn't have to make any cuts and, uh, and everything worked out. But it's interesting, right then, when the Rebbe wrote me about the rooms, yeah, uh, about a week or two later, okay, mamish a week or two later, came up eight o six that I was able to buy it from the fire and, and, and, and, and, and build, uh, uh, my, my vision was to build it within another fire. We bought it for seventeen thousand dollars. We bought the building. And my vision was to go to people of means and to get them to-- But there's no concept here of people having apartments here to build condos upstairs. And the people that are upstairs should pay for the whole building, for buying, for, for everything. I'll do the work. I'll fix up the place. And I went to Barrow White, and I went to Mandlu Gibski from South Africa. Not from South Africa, should have here. And, uh, I put it together, the deal, and I thought to myself, after the five room, "What am I gonna do?" You know, Basheka. Obviously it wasn't negotiated, it wasn't finalized, but it was almost, uh, almost finalized. But I wrote to the Rebbe, and I wrote to the Rebbe, and he demands work from me to do it. And the Rebbe t- I cut out the chat with everything I... Rebbe gave a, a big yes, and, and with the Rebbe he

1:59:57 Speaker 2 gonna do so together with the five. You know, it's, uh, it's one thing to rent five rooms, it's another thing to, you know-

2:00:03 Speaker 6 Yeah

2:00:03 Speaker 2 ... to do a building and-

2:00:04 Speaker 6 Buying a building

2:00:04 Speaker 2 ... do things the right way and, you know, and, and build it. So again, you know, you figure it out. You know, so I, I can't, you know.

2:00:12 Speaker 6 So what's the hitnah? The hitnah is that-

2:00:13 Speaker 2 The hitnah-

2:00:14 Speaker 6 They have, they have to, that they have to operate-

2:00:16 Speaker 2 The hitnah-

2:00:16 Speaker 6 The places

2:00:17 Speaker 2 ... the hitnah is that you, uh... I don't know what the hitnah is.

2:00:26 Speaker 6 No, 'cause today, if you wanna have a mosod and you want things to get done, people are not working for free, and every step needs to be hired, and you have to hire people. Like e- everything-

2:00:35 Speaker 2 Has nothing to do with... We also, the Rebbe, at the same time, when the Rebbe, when-- uh, very interesting is he brings that up, okay? The Rebbe don't see that people have to get paid and people have to be hired. And, uh, very interesting that, uh, uh, uh, the hitnah is that you have to watch, you have to be very, very careful when things are... That, that, that, that, that, uh, you know, of your, of your success. You have to-- W- when you're successful, you have to be more s- more, more, more careful than when things are going tough.

2:01:04 Speaker 6 So you're saying-

2:01:05 Speaker 2 Rebbe wanted to bring that up, bring, bring that out.

2:01:07 Speaker 6 Uh, so you're saying-

2:01:08 Speaker 2 Okay. I put in right before that, it, it wasn't that I was wild, okay? In nineteen eighty-one, okay, Cheshvan, this was in, in, in, in Tammuz, okay? I don't remember if it's a year before or eighteen months before, I can't tell you for sure, but I sent in a report to the Rebbe, financial report, and I have the report till now, okay? And the report was, we were-- It was probably, it was Mem Alef. We sent in a report, okay, of-- that we had our gross, uh, our gross receipts was two hundred and fifty thousand dollars, okay? Our expenses was a hundred thousand dollars, okay? Or, uh, and, and we sent a hundred and fifty thousand dollars to slow, okay? And, uh, okay, so it wasn't that, that I was in, in the minus.

2:01:58 Speaker 6 Right.

2:01:58 Speaker 2 Okay? This is after eighteen months. It's also building an infrastructure. This is building an office, building the infrastructure, all these things is tremendous, tremendous amount of investment, okay? Uh, I would do it today. If somebody would come to me today and say, "You know what? I'm gonna go open an office for you in, in, in, in, in, in, in, uh, in, in..." I don't wanna say a, a, a state because the minute I say a state, I'll get a husband to ventiler that.

2:02:21 Speaker 6 Yeah.

2:02:21 Speaker 2 So I don't wanna do that, but you know, in, in, in, in, in, uh, from, uh, in, in Mars, you know, because, uh, he could send me a ventiler, Elon Musk could send me-

2:02:28 Speaker 6 Yeah.

2:02:29 Speaker 2 ... a, could, could they be, be mazmen me, so. But, uh, so in Mars, if I wanna open up and the guy will tell me that after a, a year or eighteen months, he's gonna build me an office and infrastructure, and he'll bring me a hundred and fifty thousand dollars, even, even the money from the... Even the hundred and fifty thousand, I won't talk about dollars compared to the-

2:02:45 Speaker 6 Inflation

2:02:45 Speaker 2 ... I would say, to inflation, I would say do it.

2:02:48 Speaker 6 Right.

2:02:48 Speaker 2 So it's not that, that... But, but nevertheless, at the same time, the Rebbe wanted that you should know that Kolko Chabad is a holy mosod, and it's like the Rebbe, uh, uh, like the Rebbe spoke about many, many times. That's "Caspi Admor Hazaken."

2:02:59 Speaker 6 So be-

2:03:00 Speaker 2 Okay?

2:03:01 Speaker 6 ... because there was- ... quote-unquote, "success," therefore, the Rebbe is telling you to-

2:03:05 Speaker 2 A million percent. I have no question about that

2:03:07 Speaker 6 ... like don't, don't go, don't lose, don't lose focus.

2:03:08 Speaker 2 Don't, don't lose focus. A million percent. I think that's the, the hitnah. I can't-

2:03:11 Speaker 6 Was there ever a time that there was a "Hachnasat Hitza" problem?

2:03:15 Speaker 2 What do you mean Hachna? If we, if we ma- if we made less money than-

2:03:18 Speaker 6 Yeah

2:03:18 Speaker 2 ... if we, if we owed money. No, we, we didn't. Nobody didn't have... I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm a fundraising organization, you said that.

2:03:24 Speaker 6 Right.

2:03:24 Speaker 2 So of course I could watch that, but, uh, Baruch Hashem, not. You know, we're, we're-

2:03:29 Speaker 6 To put it in context, two hundred and fifty thousand dollars, that was the budget. I mean, that was the Hachnas. I'm sure today it's in the hundreds of millions of saying the-

2:03:38 Speaker 2 Today we have-

2:03:38 Speaker 6 Kolko Chabad

2:03:39 Speaker 2 ... Baruch Hashem, we get a lot of money from the government. We were able to s- we were able to pull off something that, uh, that very few people are able to pull off. Okay? That we got a partnership with the government and that we execute things for the government, Kolko Chabad.

2:03:52 Speaker 6 Right.

2:03:52 Speaker 2 We are their, their arm when it comes to food and, uh, and also we have an infrastructure that's second to none that we put into place. So even when the government wants to do certain things that they wanna give out money to their people, we have the contracts in place, and they can, they can, we, and they can move, and, uh, and you know, they don't have to do no tenders, they don't have to do because we have everything in place.

2:04:11 Speaker 6 Amazing.

2:04:11 Speaker 2 Okay? So, so we have a infrastructure that we s- that was set up, Baruch Hashem, that the government can take advantage of. During COVID, the government wants to give out or, or daddy got money. It was, uh, uh, got money that he wants to give out to poor people, and in fact, we, we gave an, a, a, an offer, but we c- we came in second, okay? Uh, w- uh, we came in second, okay? There was first, uh, there was someone that came in front of us first, and we came in second. But the, uh, the third was upset. They said that the first wasn't the proper way, and they went and they sued. And, uh, because of that, we-- but we're second, so we, we were a-- they, the third won. You understand?

2:04:49 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.