Ep. 27: A Long Distance Connection with Rabbi Pesach Schmerling

00:00 Speaker 1 But to poshet know what the Rebbe's views on all kinds of topics, everyone has to have a key is to learn the Rebbe's Igress. You have to know. You have to know.

00:11 Speaker 2 If you've been enjoying this podcast, please like and subscribe so that others can enjoy it as well. In addition, if you've benefited in any way from Among Chassidim podcast and would like to give something back, you can do so today at derher.org/donate. I'm Yossi Kamen. Welcome to Among Chassidim by Der Her, an ongoing farbrengen about life as a Chassid, our vibrant connection with the Rebbe, and inspired living shaped by the way he teaches us each and every day. This episode is dedicated to the nishmas of Rav Saadia ben Rav Mordechai alav hashalom Dahan and the refuah shleima for Chana bas Nechama Dina by Shaul and Shaindy Dahan. Inspire your friends to join their fellow Yidden all across the globe who are flocking to lettersfrommenachem.com and fulfilling the Rebbe's takanah for every single Yid to have an eis specific tairah. Share lettersfrommenachem.com to bring this important takanah of the Rebbe for achdus of the entire Klal Yisrael. This additional effort should be for aliyas haneshama of our tamim, Menachem Mendel ben HaRav Avraham Asher HaLevi Sheila, a young shliach who passed away tragically a short while ago at the age of seventeen. Encourage anyone who does not yet have a letter in the Sifrei Torah HaKlalim to visit lettersfrommenachem.com to bring more light and unity into the world as the Rebbe inspires and instructs. Shalom Aleichem, Rabbi Shmerling. How are you?

01:50 Speaker 1 Aleichem Shalom. Baruch Hashem. Hoda la'Hashem ki tov. Thank you for having me.

01:54 Speaker 2 Okay. Thank you for making the time to, to talk. And, um, it's not, uh, w- we're not strangers, but, uh, I don't know if our conversations were on the topic, on the topics that, uh, that I would like to cover, so, or that you would like to cover, so maybe this will be different. So my, my first question I wanna ask you is, I know you're from Switzerland. I know Shmerling, Switzerland, you know, that's connected. I know there's a big mishpacha, but I don't know much about it, you know, where they came from, how they ended up, how they ended up there, the chulu. So maybe you can start like that. How does that sound?

02:33 Speaker 1 Yeah. Sounds like a plan. So my elder zayde, my great-grandfather, Reb Levi Yitzchak Shmerling, who was born in Kalisk in Russia, so Lubavitcher mishpacha, Lubavitcher mishpacha going back, they is till the time of the Alter Rebbe, um, traveled, moved from Russia to Switzerland around Taf Resh Samech in the early 1900. Had a brocha from the Rebbe Rashab to move to Switzerland. We don't know much protim about it, but he moved to Switzerland, and he started a pan- panosa there. He had a, a little store, grocery store, sold different food, and he started to produce chalav yisrael cheese. So this, this early 1900s, there are ads of Shmerling cheese already from 1910, even before. So mamash in the early 1900s, he started to produce Shmerling cheese. That is, um, he kept a kesher with Beis HaRav even when he was in Switzerland. Uh, like I mentioned before, he came from a Lubavitcher mishpacha. Actually, uh, he writes in his siddur, in the back of his siddur, he wrote some family details, dates, yard sites, and different things. So he writes over there, we don't know the exact, uh, family tree all the way up, but he writes that we are descendants from Reb Yossele the Maggid, uh, Reb Yisroel Berka Bilnicker. Reb Yisroel Berka Bilnicker was a melamed of the Alter Rebbe. Later, he became a chossid of the Alter Rebbe. And his son, Reb Yosel, was a shadar of the Alter Rebbe, and he was an uncle of the Tzemach Tzedek. He married the sister

04:22 Speaker 1 of Reb Sholom Shabtai, Tzemach Tzedek's father. So he's called the, the Feter Yossele. He was Reb Yossele the Maggid. The Maggid on his f-- because his father was the Maggid of Lubavitch, Reb Yisroel Berka Bilnicker. So we are descendants from h- them. And he also writes that his father is Mimishpachas Admor De Kopust. Now, we don't know exactly h- how are we related to the Kopust Rebbe, but the Rebbe wrote to two Chassidim, to Reb Bentz Shemtov and to Reb Freilich Wolf in the 1950s, um, that, that they traveled to Zurich, to Switzerland, and the Rebbe writes them, "You're for sure gonna meet or you, you should meet up with my grandfather." That's already Reb Avraham Bendit, the son of Reb Levi Yitzchak, the, who was here a few times. He's also a mechutan in Mishpachas Beis HaRav. So there's a, a Mishpacha shayshe.

05:21 Speaker 2 So this is not the Shmerling from Eretz Yisrael that's, that's related-

05:24 Speaker 1 No

05:24 Speaker 2 ... to the Rebbe?

05:25 Speaker 1 The, the Shmerlings in Eretz Yisrael, like I's mentioned before, the Shmerling family goes back Chassidim of the Alter Rebbe already. One branch of the family went to Eretz Yisrael in the time of the Mitteler Rebbe. Actually, one of the einiklach of the Mitteler Rebbe married a Shmerling, so there are numerous tzemachim Shmerling in Eretz Yisrael, including Zalman Shmerling, who used to come to the Rebbe, say Tehillim, Mai Shana Rabbe, brought many bichlach to the Rebbe. Every Lubavitcher matzah has it. You open up, Bichl Lech Lecha Shmerling.

05:58 Speaker 2 Mm-hmm.

05:59 Speaker 1 So that's a mayim that was from one of these bichlach. So, so we might be distant relatives of That branch of the Schron. But these are the atifs, all these Schrons. We were from those that stayed back in Russia and were Hasidim of the Rebbeim, Ledere Seim in Russia, and my alter zeide moved to Switzerland.

06:18 Speaker 3 So when they-- And naturally, when it says that they're whatever the, the-

06:21 Speaker 1 Yeah

06:21 Speaker 3 ... related to Beis Rav, that's because of the Mitler Rebbe.

06:23 Speaker 1 Because they are Tetzim from the Alter Rebbe.

06:25 Speaker 3 Right.

06:26 Speaker 1 They are straight Tetzim. Our family apparently is not Tetzim, it's Medukim, the Rebbe's Loshen-

06:31 Speaker 3 Chut-chut

06:32 Speaker 1 ... Mechutonim in Mishpachas Beis Rav. So either because we are Eyniklekh of Rabbi Yosef the Maggid, who was an uncle of the Tzemach Tzedek, or because of the other, uh, thing that my alter zeide writes, that his father is Mi Mishpachas Admo the Kopos, but we don't know exactly what that means. How are we related to Admo the Kopos? I assume it's some type, uh, of marriage relationship. Somebody over there married into the Mishpachah of the Kopos, the Rebbes. We don't know the details, so if anybody out there is good at it, try to figure it out. Can't, uh, uh... But apparently, the Rebbe knew about this, uh, relationship, and his family knew better, but, uh, it was closer i-in years. Uh, we don't know the details. My alter zeide didn't write the details. That's why we don't know.

07:27 Speaker 3 So your elder zeide-

07:27 Speaker 1 Anyways, mm-hmm

07:28 Speaker 3 ... was the start of the cheese, which still exists. That's also the chocolates. That's the-

07:33 Speaker 1 No, he didn't start the chocolate. After he passed away, my zeide added on the chocolate, his son, Ber Bendit. Um, so he was in Switzerland, uh, alone Lubavitcher. Like, there weren't any other Anash that I know of in those years in Switzerland.

07:51 Speaker 3 There was always a Sh film Kehillah in Switzerland. That's why he went there?

07:53 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah. There was a, a Yekisha Kehillah and a Hasidisha Kehillah. My zeide davened in the Yekisha Kehillah. He, he was, he was a Hasid, but for, for him, it made no difference that the Peleh Shechasidim or the Yekisha Kehillah, neither is where he is at home, but he lived down the block from the Yekisha Shul. So-

08:17 Speaker 3 But he, he grew up-

08:18 Speaker 1 So he davened there

08:19 Speaker 3 ... he grew up in Switzerland.

08:21 Speaker 1 My zeide did.

08:21 Speaker 3 Yeah, your zeide.

08:22 Speaker 1 My alter zeide moved to Switzerland.

08:24 Speaker 3 Right.

08:24 Speaker 1 And he, his house was literally down the block from the Yekisha big shul. So he davened there. He also was a baal keri there. Um, but he kept up a kesher with Beis Rav. Um, my, uh, alter zeide's sister married a second cousin, and they lived in Riga. When my grandfather became a bachur, so my alter zeide wanted to send him really to Latvatsk or whatever, Varsha, where the yeshiva was then. And, uh, my alter babe, she came from a Litvishe Mishpachah. So she objected because who's gonna look after him, sending a little boy, a thirteen-year-old, lamechakim to Poland? Who's gonna look after him? She had relatives in Telz. "Let's send him to Telz." And she won. They sent my grandfather to Telz. But for Yom Tov, he went to Riga, so his uncle, who lived in Riga, took him to the Friediger Rebbe. So my grandfather saw the Friediger Rebbe still in Riga. And, uh, you know, even when he was in Telz, he, there, there were a few Lubavitcher bachurim in Telz. The Rosh Yeshiva actually-

09:40 Speaker 3 So now, so, uh, for sure now Latvatsk wasn't, uh... I mean, whatever the, the, the Temim Herim in Poland.

09:46 Speaker 1 Right.

09:47 Speaker 3 And Friediger Rebbe was in Riga. There was no Latvatsk.

09:49 Speaker 1 Right. There was no Latvatsk. Wherever the yeshiva was-

09:51 Speaker 3 But he started the yeshiva already. Yeah.

09:53 Speaker 1 Correct. Correct. Good. So I, I, I didn't think of the exact, uh, years. You are right. Um, he came to Telz. The Rosh Yeshiva over there learned Chassidus. The Rosh Yeshiva had an appreciation and told my grandfather, "It's coming up to Yutza's Kislev in a few days. There are the Reich brothers, who are also Lubavitchers. Go to their achsania." You know, the bachurim, there was no dormitory. The bachurim lived in different places. Uh, "Where they are staying, there for sure is gonna be some type of habrengan, and your father probably wants you to go to that habrengan."

10:29 Speaker 3 Yeah.

10:30 Speaker 1 You know, uh, Telz. Yeshiva Telz.

10:32 Speaker 3 Who, who was the Rosh Yeshiva?

10:33 Speaker 1 Rav Bloch.

10:34 Speaker 3 Bloch.

10:37 Speaker 1 Um, anyways, um, so even when he was learning in Telz, but he'd have now Nusach, Lubavitcher tefillin. He, he had... He knew the Shaiachas. I mean, a Lubavitch family did the same, but still, he didn't learn Temim Herim. He shaved his beard, and, uh, you know, all his years. He, he, he wasn't like a typical Lubavitcher, but he, he knew the Shaiachas, of course, connected to Lubavitch. The Friediger Rebbe came here to America and right away tried to save whoever he could from Europe. Everybody knows, of course, the gevaldiger work that the Friediger Rebbe put in to bring the Rebbe and the Rebbetzin here. But it wasn't only them. The Friediger Rebbe tried any, any Chassidim. So the Friediger Rebbe made a list of Chassidim and their families to try to arrange visas to bring them to America. We didn't know this, what I just said. What we knew in the family all the years was that my alter zeide and his family lived in Zurich, in Switzerland, and one day he gets a phone call from the American Embassy that the visas are ready. And what visas? He didn't apply for visas. Rabbi Schnerson sent visas for your family to go to America, okay? The, the problem was that my grandfather was drafted in the army. This is 1941, uh, the, the war. And while-

12:20 Speaker 3 Which army?

12:21 Speaker 1 The Swiss Army.

12:22 Speaker 3 I thought the Swiss were not involved.

12:23 Speaker 1 The Swiss weren't in the war, but they didn't know that in advance, you know?

12:28 Speaker 3 To the drafting.

12:29 Speaker 1 So they had the army ready-

12:31 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm

12:32 Speaker 1 ... just in case Hitler, Im Yirtze Hashem, will invade, we're ready. So my grandfather was a soldier. He was drafted. He couldn't leave Switzerland. My alter baba said she's not leaving, uh, leaving her son, uh, back, uh, going to America. She's-- doesn't wanna hear of it. My alter zeide said, "The Rebbe schickt visas. The Rebbe sent visas, he gotta go." So they made a, the pshat. They decided that him and his daughter, who was married to someone, Avram Schnall, not a, a Swiss citizen, and therefore he wasn't drafted to the army, they'll go. And then after the war, the rest of the family will join. Im Yirtze Hashem, they actually did that. They came to America, and the, um, so it's damn interesting. Now, I'll tell you in a moment the Fridd Rebbe's, uh, yachas, but he ended up passing away in Taf Shin Hey, 1945. So after the war, there was nothing for my alter baba and my zeide to move to America for anymore. My grandfather came for the first yahrtzeit in Taf Shin Vav, 1946, to the, to New York, yahrtzeit. He was by the Fridd Rebbe, along Yechidas, down for the Amid. But, um-

13:57 Speaker 3 So his son-in-law passed away?

14:00 Speaker 1 My grandfather's father, Reb Levi Yitzchok Schnall-

14:02 Speaker 3 Oh, oh, okay

14:03 Speaker 1 ... passed away here, here in America, not the son-in-law. No, he, son-in-law lived for many years.

14:07 Speaker 3 Oh, okay.

14:07 Speaker 1 Yeah. Um, so the Fridd Rebbe, there's the-- I heard the following from numerous chassidim. The f- the family knew about it, and, um, I heard this from Reb Yisroel Kozheminski, alav hashalom. I heard it from Reb Leibel Pozner, alav hashalom, passed away recently. That the Fridd Rebbe said when my grand-- alter zeide, my great-grandfather came, uh, to America, "Moshiach will come. We'll say l'chaim. We need Schmerling cheese, and make sure to have cheese ready for when Moshiach comes." In the sichas it's not printed. In recent years, Baruch Hashem, the Ribono shel Olam helps. There's tzedakas. Every family prints tzedakas for simchas. So one family printed a hanochah of the farbrengen of Yud Kislev Taf Shin Beis. And over there in the hanochah, it's a typed hanochah. It says, um, I guess between the sichas, somebody pointed out to the Fridd Rebbe, "There is Schmerling from Schweiz." And the Fridd Rebbe responded, "They should tell him," I guess he stood further away or something like that. The Fridd Rebbe was difficult to speak, but Fridd Rebbe said he, "They should tell him, midavim zogen, he should prepare a lot of shm- of kes because soon Moshiach will come, midavim vos zu farbeisen."

15:37 Speaker 3 Yeah.

15:38 Speaker 1 And it's printed. Now we have the exact... We don't-- We, now we know when it happened and-

15:43 Speaker 3 It's famous that the, that the Rebbe, that there was, that there was Schmerling chocolate by the Rebbe, but I never heard about the cheese by the Fridd Rebbe.

15:51 Speaker 1 Right.

15:51 Speaker 3 So that's a, a chiddush.

15:54 Speaker 1 Okay. Yeah. So my alter zeide started the cheese, and so, so we knew in the family the story with the visas and this and that. In recent le- years, Reb Shlomo Bell Levin printed the Tehillos Chabad, Poland, Litva, and Latvia. And over there in the back are copies of that reshima that the Fridd Rebbe made, whom to try to save. And in that reshima, my alter zeide, my alter babe, all the children's names. So, uh, obviously the majority of the people on the reshima weren't saved. And, um, but my alter zeide's family, they did get saved. That, that was the... My zeide started the chocolate. Um, but interesting you mentioned that you didn't know about the res- cheese. You knew about the chocolate. In Taf Shin Alef, my grandfather came almost every year for the yahrtzeit of his father. The yahrtzeit is tes year. So, and my alter zeide is buried here. Uh, you know, there's a famous picture of the Rebbe standing by the tziyen of the Fridd Rebbe before the Ohel was built-

17:11 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm

17:11 Speaker 1 ... right in the beginning in Taf Shin Yud. So there's three matzeivas visible, like, in the background. One of them is my alter zeide. He's buried two rows behind the Ohel. So my, my zeide came almost every year, always was in Yechidas, had a kshura with the Rebbe throughout all the years. In Taf Shin Alef, when he came, that was when I already learned here. I was an older talmid. I was bochor. I took care of my grandfather, my grandmother, took them around, helped them, helped my grandfather get a seat by the farbrengen. You know, I, I was, uh, his bodyguard a little bit. Uh, um, we went by by dollars, and first went my grandfather, who wished the Rebbe Mazel tov zum Tzadik Year. That, you now listen, the Rebbe entered Shnas HaTzadik. So my grandfather told the Rebbe Mazel tov zum Tzadik Year, which I didn't know at the time, my grandfather already had cancer at the time. He did- he didn't say a word to the Rebbe about that, didn't ask. He, all he said was Mazel tov, the Rebbe, zum Tzadik Year And the Rebbe gave him another dollar for the kez, not for the chocolate, for the kez. And then my grandmother went by, and the Rebbe gave her also a dollar for the kez. And I'm the next in line. And both my grandmother and Rebbe Leibele Groner both, like, points to me informing the Rebbe, "This is our Einikel". My grandmother, "This is unser Einikel". And Leibele said,

18:42 Speaker 1 "This is our Einikel". So in a split second, like many times when people went by, by dollars, the family, the business, and this, so the Rebbe would sometimes tell also the children, "You're also a part, you're also a part of it, you know, for you helping your grandparents." So two things. First of all, my father wasn't part of the business of the... He, he didn't join my grandfather's business. My uncle, Havashon, did, but my father did his own panasa. And, um, and also as a, a bacher I wasn't looking for a brocha for the kez.

19:19 Speaker 3 Right.

19:19 Speaker 1 Yeah. So the Rebbe gave me a dollar, then a chasideshe shomeim v'lam. So I'm, I'm, I'm still, uh, working on being mekayem that brocha, if I stay to then. It's a brocha for the chitzim yomim.

19:30 Speaker 3 Right.

19:30 Speaker 1 To be a chasid shomeim lam.

19:32 Speaker 3 You're definitely not, uh, doing the kez.

19:34 Speaker 1 Yeah. Definitely not doing the kez. But well you see that the Rebbe mentioned the kez, so, uh, everybody knows, and it's true, the Rebbe did eat the Schmerling chocolate. Uh, the Rebbe ate a bittersweet Noblesse, the one with the horse on it. That was the, the one that-

19:50 Speaker 3 Is it sugar-free?

19:51 Speaker 1 I don't know if sugar-free. They, I don't think it existed then sugar-free. Maybe in the later years they made it also sugar-free.

19:57 Speaker 3 Mm-hmm.

19:58 Speaker 1 But, but the bittersweet Noblesse chocolate, that's what the Rebbe ate. So the Rebbe could have told my grandparents for the chocolate. The Rebbe said for, for the kez. Uh, so Beshaitei in Tosh Nanalev, the, the, it was after Chof Ches Nissan. This was shortly after. This was, uh, Yud Dalet year, I believe was the date. Um, and as a Koch, Mashiach, the Rebbe was also there Yud Kislev Tosh Bes by the farbrengen when the Figger Rebbe said, "We'd have to shtellen-"

20:29 Speaker 3 Kez.

20:29 Speaker 1 "-kez as Mashiach would say, 'Kumpalz, zeyn af os zu farbeysn.'" So maybe because of that, I don't know. That was a Shem iteration.

20:37 Speaker 3 Right.

20:37 Speaker 1 But, uh-

20:41 Speaker 3 But, uh, I mean, it's a, it's a good heggesh, I'm saying. The Rebbe's, you know-

20:46 Speaker 1 Yeah

20:46 Speaker 3 ... attributing it to, to the Frierdiker Rebbe and now Mashiach.

20:50 Speaker 1 Yeah.

20:51 Speaker 3 Okay. So what about you yourself? So you grew-

20:54 Speaker 1 So I grew up... So, so to continue just that hemshucha here. So my grandfather, because he went to a Litvish yeshiva, still had a kshaichas, as Lubavitch had a kshaichas Rebbe. He always came yechidas every year, and he had interesting yechidas. Now, I don't know if I wanna get into saying all kinds of stories now. Uh, uh, maybe later if there's extra time. Um, but when his children grew up, he decided to send them to Litvish yeshivas too. You know, the preconceived notions. Chassidishe yeshivas learnt men shall say good. Hey, Dafke in Litvish yeshivas you learn. Okay. So he sent my uncle, my father to Litvish yeshivas in Eretz Yisroel, in Switzerland, in Lucerne, in Eretz Yisroel, and Hebron, Ponovezh, di- different yeshivas. And, but while they were in Eretz Yisroel, they learned Tanya by Rav Nachum Goldschmidt. They went to farbrengens, different farbrengens. There was a Yid in Bnei Brak called Leibele Zalmanov. It, these Chassidim had a huge hashpa'ah on both my uncle and my father to the extent that both of them, after the chasuna, grew a beard, put on a sirtuk and became full-fledged Lubavitchers. They sent their children already to Lubavitch yeshivas. So, so that was already back to the roots. Um-

22:17 Speaker 3 That's a lashon, uh-

22:19 Speaker 1 Hazoros hatarah l'eyshno.

22:20 Speaker 3 Yeah.

22:21 Speaker 1 Yeah.

22:21 Speaker 3 I, I was thinking of a different lashon, but yeah, that, that's good.

22:24 Speaker 1 It's like, uh-

22:25 Speaker 3 Chut ha'avoda. Whatever.

22:27 Speaker 1 It never went that far.

22:29 Speaker 3 Never.

22:29 Speaker 1 Like I said, there was a kesher all the years, and my gr- my grandfather came every year to yechidas. He, he wasn't a Chassid Chassid, so he would sit in yechidas and talk to the Rebbe, farbrengen, schmooze. Uh, uh, a story that I heard, acha, from my grandfather during that visit in Tosh Nanalev when he was here, he told me that he was in yechidas and the Rebbe told him, "Maybe add a new business to your business. Uh, you know, add another line, another..." So he asked, "Can I say a story in response?" The Rebbe said, "Sure. Yeah. Sure." So he said that there were two Jews who, uh, let's call them Reuven and Shimon. Reuven suggested to Shimon, "Become a shutaf. Let's do a business, be shutafs." And Shimon said, "You know what? Let's go to the Chofetz Chaim, and if he thinks it's a groy khazak, well, I'll mask him." They went to Chofetz Chaim. Chofetz Chaim asked, "Do you have a tzammen vad? You have like a, a kettle, uh, hot waters in a urn?" He's like, "Yeah." Like, "Where is this going?" "How many glasses of tea do you get out of that urn?" "Hmm, let's say 20." So the Chofetz Chaim said, "What do you think? You're gonna add another faucet to the urn, you're gonna get out more than 20 glasses of tea?" So basically, the message was, you're not gonna make more panos. Whatever is destined is destined, and, you know, you have your urn. You a- adding

24:10 Speaker 1 a shutaf is not gonna give you more glass of tea. It's nish kedai. So my grandfather answered this to the Rebbe as in response to the Rebbe's suggestion to open another line of business. But toych deedee dibu that he finished the story, the Rebbe responded, "I'm not talking about another faucet. I'm talking about another urn."

24:33 Speaker 3 Yeah.

24:34 Speaker 1 That nisht wegen noch a kran, ved dat wegen noch a tzammen vad. So taka he, he opened up other lines of business. I don't know exactly what was then. Uh, he started importing wine from Eretz Yisroel. He sp- started to import all kinds of kosher goods from America, Kedem crackers and all kinds of stuff to Europe. Uh, he did, he did other lines of business, and bistame, he made good panos from that.

24:59 Speaker 3 Yeah.

24:59 Speaker 1 Yesh loima. Um, so, you know, they always had, uh, they kept the kshaichas throughout the years. So, but my father, and also my uncle, they learned in Kollin in Eretz Yisrael, but then they moved to Switzerland. My uncle joined my, my grandfather's business, my father did his own business and but they were Hasidim. They started, you know, they c- started coming to the rebbe regularly. My father actually is a bachur. He worked for some time here in New York by Herschel Hitrik. So he already was by the rebbe in Yechidus 5726. He was a f-- he was here for, uh, a tekufah, fabrengen by the rebbe, so he already, uh, had a, uh, a sheitas like that, uh, mamash direct sheitas with the rebbe himself as well. But after the chasuna, they came to Switzerland. So while they were ba- chassidishe baal batim, business people, but they viewed themselves as, you know, not shluchim, but just every Hasid has to make a sevivah, has to, um, hafatzot hamayones, hafatzot hayadus.

26:12 Speaker 4 And there was no, there was no Lubavitcher presence-

26:15 Speaker 1 There was no shliach yet

26:16 Speaker 4 ...to, not yet

26:16 Speaker 1 There was no shliach yet. Rabbi Mendel Rosenfeld came to Switzerland in 5710, if I remember correctly. So in the lameds when they-

26:26 Speaker 4 Wow

26:26 Speaker 1 ... when my f- father and my uncle raised the families in, in Zurich, they were the Lubavitchers. There's also the Moshe Lazare Rapaport, another Lubavitcher. So they started a lot of things. So happens to be that, uh, my father was the address of Chabad Lubavitch, Switzerland, meaning on our mailbox, it said my father's name, it said his business name, and it also said Chabad Lubavitch, Schweiz. Um, and, and when Moshe and the Rebbe did Mivtza Kasherut, the Rebbe gave money for shluchim, uh, it was for shluchim for as a -- the Rebbe promised them that anyone who is ready to kasher the kitchen, we'll pay them part of the expenses. And symbolically, the Rebbe gave different people money for Mivtza Kasherut. The Rebbe gave my father a, a start of hundred Swiss francs. So, so-

27:26 Speaker 4 I have to check. There's, um, I saw this Jewish catalog, uh, I think it's called the Jewish catalog.

27:32 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

27:33 Speaker 4 It's like a book about Judaism. Uh, today there's like a series, uh, for dummies. Maybe it'll be like Luba- uh, Judaism for dummies, like, you know, that is a-

27:41 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm

27:42 Speaker 4 So there's like a few pages about Lubavitch, and there's pictures of the Rebbe, and it lists all of the Lubavitcher representatives in the world.

27:48 Speaker 1 Yeah.

27:49 Speaker 4 I was looking through the list. This is like in the early lameds. A lot of them are not shluchim.

27:54 Speaker 1 Right.

27:54 Speaker 4 They're Lubavitcher people. They're representatives of Lubavitch and they're-

27:57 Speaker 1 I'll tell you more than-

27:58 Speaker 4 So I have to check. I have to check

27:59 Speaker 1 I'll tell you more than that. In, uh, the tzaddiqs when the Chatamim came out. So today you have Chatamim printed all in one book. The original booklets in the back, there were ads. They're not printed in the books that we buy today in kollel. And also on the back cover, it had a list of representatives of Lubavitch, so to speak, where you can get Chatamim booklets in other countries.

28:28 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm.

28:29 Speaker 1 So in Switzerland, it was my, my alter zeyde-

28:31 Speaker 4 Yeah

28:31 Speaker 1 ... Lubavitcher shver. You know, it was his address. You know, that's where you get Chatamims in Switzerland. So I guess it was already in the family. Um, Yubey Psukim, Shnas HaChinuch. So my father printed like same booklet of Yubey Psukim, like here in New York with, you know, the drawings, uh-

28:51 Speaker 4 Yeah

28:51 Speaker 1 ... I think it was Muchnik, uh, drawings in it, and had like, like a paragraph written about each pasuk. So my father, maybe my mother together, they translated it into German. They printed it, and in the back, uh, every child who learns the Yubey Psukim baal pe should send in and contact them to get a p- uh, prize or something. Also, my parents' address. That, that was like-- But it wasn't only my father. It was my father and my uncle and also Moshe Lazare Rapaport. They did every Lag BaOmer. They did a huge parade for children. One year they did it on a ship. Uh, I fell into the water of the Zurich Lake.

29:29 Speaker 4 Nice.

29:29 Speaker 1 It was a whole farshekt. Before it started, we went in the morning early to set up, and my father had to go, and either while he dre- chodch gedreyt and I fell into the water.

29:41 Speaker 4 Fell in.

29:41 Speaker 1 I knew how to swim, but it was fun. Anyways, uh, so they, although they were pashut baal batim, and they kept on begging the Rebbe in Yechidus, both my father and my uncle, numerous times to send a shliach. He goes, "You know, we're, we're business light. Madaha have none official shliach." The Rebbe had his reasons why he didn't wanna send initially. Eventually, the Rebbe sent a shliach. Um, and they, they were chassidishe baal batim who were eysig in kol hamivtzoim, in shiurich chassidus, Yud Tes Kislev every time they made a big fabrengen. So growing up in, in such an environment, also us children always felt we represent Lubavitch. Like we went to a school. The Jewish school in Zurich was a school for alle kreizen. Chassidische, Litvishe, Vizhnitzer Chassidim, Gerer Chassidim, Alexander Chassidim, Belzer Chassidim. Like I had a melamed, a Belzer Chassid. A different year, I had a melamed, a Vizhnitzer Chassid. And I had a Litvisher melamed. Like over the years, we had all-- This is like achdus of Klal Yisrael over there. All the frum Yidden-

30:52 Speaker 4 There's only one?

30:53 Speaker 1 Huh? It's still so like today.

30:54 Speaker 4 There's only one school?

30:55 Speaker 1 One big school. Alle frum Yidden learn in that school. So being Lubavitcher Hasidim, and we always li- like similar to what ch- sh- shluchim's children feel- We represent. We're not just, you know, we happen to be the Lubavitch Hasidim. No, as Lubavitchers, you actually represent something, and you have to do hafotze. I remember when the Rebbe came out with, uh, Sefer Torali Al HaYisrael, my father sat me down Sunday, "You have to call all your classmates." Got all of them to sign up for a letter in Sefer Torah. Then we went big. All the children in the entire school, the boys school and the girls school, we signed up everyone to a Sefer Torah.

31:43 Speaker 4 Yeah.

31:44 Speaker 1 So, yeah, we weren't schluchem, but seisht, the Rebbe zak. That's, uh, the atmosphere I grew up in was a Hasidische atmosphere in, in that way. We also had numerous, uh, Hasidim that just came through our house. They stayed in our house, different Shadalim, Yidden who-

32:08 Speaker 4 To fundraise.

32:08 Speaker 1 Ah, fundraisers for mosdos. So, but these were Hasidische Yidden. And as a child, a child growing up reading the Yiddishe Heim and Schmusen mit Kinder, reading Heichka Debrasky's descriptions of fabrengs in Samarkand. So I had a very vivid, uh, imagination for these Hasidim, and they were takie Hasidische Yidden. A Yid like Reb Kushe Kalman son. From Brunoy, he came, stayed in our house, fundraised for the yeshiva, echvesos. But just to see him daven, to see him bench at our kitchen table, such dignity. He was such a-- He ha- He held himself with such a... He, he looked like a ish murameara, um, had, uh, the mashpia in Nachla, Reb Michoel Michulovin. He also came to our house. He stayed a couple of days, whatever. He was a, a, a Yid. Just to see his face can sheme vel nai reish shamayim. But to see the, the way he davened, the way he learned, it was just geschmack. And these Yidden interacted with us children. We were children, but they, they told us Hasidische maises and, and had a major impact on our growing up with the Hasidische outlook. Um, there was a Yid, Reb Shmuel Gorevich, Rebbe Yitchok of Massmit's son. He, my wife's uncle, Lazare Gorevich from Kaniz, is his son.

33:43 Speaker 4 Kaniz.

33:43 Speaker 1 Reb Shmuel lived in Lud, and he also went around to fundraise. So like, he came like every year through Switzerland. He stayed in our house. So I don't remember the story from then. I heard the story later on that he passed through, stayed in our house, and then he would go to other places in Europe, maybe England, whatever. Then he would come to the Rebbe, and then he would have yechidut, then he would go back to Eretz Yisrael. One year, he calls my father from New York if he can come again to stay in our house on the way back too. My father said, "Sure, Bekovid Godel." It, it was unusual because usually we're like, "What are you coming again? You're, he's not coming to fundraise again." "Okay," but he didn't ask questions. "You wanna come? Gesundheit, anytime." He comes back to Switzerland. He, and, and this is a Hasidische derher, mamish Hasidische derher. Why did he come back? He was in Yechidut by the Rebbe, and he gave the Rebbe report of his travels, you know, every- everything that happened. And the Rebbe reads in his report that he stayed by Akiva Schmerling in Zurich. The Rebbe asks him, "Vos macht rim parnassa?" My father was having a hard time, and my father had written to the Rebbe and, uh, I don't know what time before my father was in Yechidut, but he probably told the Rebbe that he's having a hard time. And the, so the Rebbe saw my father's name. He asked

35:21 Speaker 1 Reb Shmuel, "Vos macht rim parnassa? How is he doing financially?" So Reb Shmuel said, "S'kan zain besser. It could be better." The Rebbe gave a krechts, and then the Rebbe gave a bracha to my father, to Shmuel Gorevich in Yechidut. The Rebbe said, "Ongem parnassa, bekovit, bimnucha, bearchova." So Reb Shmuel could have called my father-

35:47 Speaker 4 Told him

35:47 Speaker 1 ... and told this to him on the phone. He felt that that would not be the right way to go about this. He changed his ticket to come through Switzerland to tell it to my father in person. Now, that's Hasidische derher.

36:00 Speaker 4 Yes.

36:02 Speaker 1 Aves Israel fun a chasid.

36:03 Speaker 4 Yeah.

36:06 Speaker 1 So that's the avir that I grew up.

36:08 Speaker 4 Right.

36:09 Speaker 1 I grew up seeing all kinds of schluchem that also came to our house. Reb Gershon Mendel Garelik.

36:14 Speaker 4 Why would, why would-

36:15 Speaker 1 Reb Eliyahu Barnstein from Bologna.

36:17 Speaker 4 Why would they come?

36:19 Speaker 1 Because, uh, Italy is neighboring Switzerland.

36:22 Speaker 4 Switzerland.

36:24 Speaker 1 And while you were able to get already kosher stuff in Italy, but in Switzerland was a bit more established. So definitely all the goods that you can get by Schmerlings in the warehouse, the chocolate and the cheese and all the imported stuff, that you can get better in Switzerland. Maybe they had other reasons why they came occasionally. I don't know.

36:47 Speaker 4 Yeah.

36:47 Speaker 1 To meet different people. I, I, I, you know, I was a child. So I, so but I remember-

36:53 Speaker 4 The stories of Gershon Mendel

36:54 Speaker 1 ... Reb Gershon Mendel was like a dmuss. I mean, the first Siyum HaRambam in, in Zurich, Reb Gershon Mendel was a s- guest speaker. It's a three-hour, uh, train ride. It's, uh, but he came, uh, with his son, Moishele.

37:07 Speaker 4 There's a famous story with, with Gershon Mendel

37:11 Speaker 1 Uh, with, with the Sri Daesh

37:12 Speaker 4 Sri Daesh

37:13 Speaker 1 Yeah

37:13 Speaker 4 That was in Switzerland. Yeah. He was speaking at an event

37:15 Speaker 1 That's before my time.

37:16 Speaker 4 I understand, but, uh-

37:17 Speaker 1 He passed away before I was born. I believe the Sri Daesh-

37:20 Speaker 4 I'm saying I understand there was a connection.

37:22 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah, yeah. So in the early years, Mamish, of course, my, my Zeyde used to send packages to Garelek in Italy. And, you know, there was a sheches. The Mishpochos had a sheches. But for me, as a kid, seeing these schluchem, I remember, uh, Barnstein brought me, uh, an Italian, uh, the, the... Chabad over there made a pen that had the timetables. You would turn the pen, and had the timetables. And then, was g- I knew my timetables and I learned maths in school, but it was cute. And it had-

37:54 Speaker 4 I don't know what you're talking about because, uh-

37:56 Speaker 1 It had, "We want Mashiach now" on it in Italian.

37:58 Speaker 4 I only know what a calculator is. I don't know what a-

38:01 Speaker 1 Yeah

38:01 Speaker 4 ... what a timetable is.

38:02 Speaker 1 It was very-- Seeing these Hasidim, it infused the home with this Hasidish geschmack. I'll tell you, David Nachsun passed through our house also numerous times. He also was fundraising for the tanking. Uh, so I, I remember the kid. I don't remember Lamed Heh when the Rebbe wasn't well. I was a little kid.

38:22 Speaker 4 How old were you? When were you born?

38:23 Speaker 1 I was born in Lamed Daled.

38:26 Speaker 4 Okay.

38:27 Speaker 1 Daled Kislev. And, um, so Lamed Heh, I was a four-year-old kid. I was... So I can't really remember. But I do vaguely remember that the Rebbe wasn't well, and the Simcha, the Rebbe, Baruch Hashem, is better. But a while later, I don't remember, it was Tav Shin Mem or Mem Alef, David Nachsun was in the house. And Bechalal, David Nachsun was a very good friend of my father's then, and he... I don't know. Now, too. But they're not, not loitzy. But, um, I don't think that they saw each other recently. But, you know, I, I saw the Hasidish, uh, Valenkay. Like, he came into the house. They hugged each other. I've never seen a Hasidish, uh, Kush before like that. It was David Nachsun where, where I saw that. And, you know, I said something. I don't remember what I said. I mentioned the Rebbe. The Rebbe. So David told me, "The Rebbe zal gezunt zayn". You mention the Rebbe's name, the Rebbe zal gezunt zayn. This was more mudgish as a... I mean, I'm sure the Hasidim said the Rebbe zal gezunt zayn al yam. But, uh-

39:37 Speaker 4 Especially that-

39:38 Speaker 1 It was after Lamed Heh, it was more mudgish. And to correct the child, to tell, "No, no, no, you gotta say the Rebbe zal gezunt zayn".

39:45 Speaker 4 Right.

39:45 Speaker 1 Yeah.

39:47 Speaker 4 Uh-huh. So that's, uh-

39:48 Speaker 1 So this was all before I ever came to the Rebbe. Yeah.

39:52 Speaker 4 But your father was going to the Rebbe then-

39:54 Speaker 1 My father was going. Actually, my father's business caused him to be in New York pretty frequently. In, in later years, it was, like, once a month, Mamish, like, all the time. Um, i-in my earlier years growing up, it wasn't that frequent, but still, i-it was a few times a year that he was here. And every time he came, of course, he didn't come just for the business. He always was by the Rebbe. He didn't usually stay for Shabbos, but if it was a weekday fabringen, and sometimes he stayed for Shabbos. So I remember he would come back, he would share something. I remember when he came back, and he gathered all of us kids at the kitchen table, that the Rebbe spoke about an important inyan, not to have too many animals. "So go to your rooms and go through all your toys and tchotchkes, and any non-kosher animals, bring it here and we're gonna get rid of them." So I remember that when, you know, and now you learn from Rebbe and aimr ve'eisa. Bechalal, my, my father had this big koch in the Rebbe Sichas. Um, Mamish, I... He would sit by the Shabbos table. For us kids, it was a little bit challenging, and I don't suggest everybody do that. But he would take out a Sichas Kodesh and read through an entire sicha. Like, a long sicha.

41:20 Speaker 4 Mm.

41:21 Speaker 1 And my father would do that, like, with the tune, the way the Rebbe said a sicha. The only other person I saw talking that way was Mullah Ziemov.

41:29 Speaker 4 Right.

41:29 Speaker 1 That he had a sicha with the tune like the Rebbe's saying the sicha. But he would sit, uh, after the soup, before the next course, Sichas Kodesh. We understood Yiddish well and, you know, we tried to understand and, you know. But the Also by the Shabbos table? No, no, that's not by the Shabbos table. That's Tamuzi. And, and, and that was... So we grew up with that koch and Rashi Sichas. I still have a koch in Rashi Sichas. Bechalal, bechalal Rebbe's table, but the Rashi Sichas especially, because that was also more shaye. He would ask us the questions and, like, like, teach us the Rashi by learning the Rashi like that. Before my bar mitzvah, um, a year before the bar mitzvah, in the summer, always in the summer, we would go to the Swiss mountains for a few weeks, and Vacationing. The Chag of one year, my father gets a letter. He would forward his mail from the city to the mountains. His business, whatever, he needs the, the mail to be forwarded. Uh, one day he gets a letter from the Rebbe. That was, uh, I mean, he got numerous let-letters from the Rebbe over the years, but I don't remember what it was, on what occasion. Um, but the Rebbe wrote on, on Nun Beis, . He's getting this in vacation time. Okay. I remember that. But, um, so a year before my bar mitzvah, he started teaching me the pilpul. He didn't tell me where this pilpul is from initially. The

44:06 Speaker 1 sicha from the Rebbe and this and that. He started teaching me and I had to learn all these Mekeires that this ba'al peh, that I should be able to say it word for word, the exact sources. And then, like, questions and answers, and the... And he told me it's a sicha from the Rebbe. "Give me the sicha now?" He didn't give me the sicha. He-- We learned this for a few months, going through the whole sicha as a-

44:35 Speaker 4 So basically your father-

44:36 Speaker 1 But

44:37 Speaker 4 Your father's a learner, sounds like.

44:38 Speaker 1 Uh,

44:42 Speaker 4 Okay.

44:43 Speaker 1 He likes learning. And so we went through the sicha, and only once I knew the whole back and forth then he gave me the sicha. It's because the sichas was about, uh, shall Yad before shall Reish, and the, the shall Reish, and then shall Yad. And he only gave me the sicha to learn how it's that you can learn already parshah from the Rebbe straight. Then I already learned the whole sicha from inside as well. But, but I knew that sicha as a A month before my bar mitzvah, he took me to Rav Breisch. Rav Breisch is a big posek, a world posek, and he, he was the Rav in the Polisher, in the Chassidishe Kehilla in, uh, Zurich. That's where we davened. We dav-didn't daven in the Yad Kashe. We lived closer to that shul. We davened in Beis Chabad on Shabbos. But, um, during the week and Friday night when Chabad has to begin Shabbos early, so we davened the late minyan with Rav Breisch. So Rav Breisch was like Rav in the Kehilla. So my father took me to invite the Rav to the bar mitzvah and to chazar the sicha. To, to chazar my pilpul to the Rav. Preview of the pilpul. People used to do it by the Rebbe.

46:13 Speaker 4 The Rebbe used to ask.

46:14 Speaker 1 The Rebbe used to ask, yeah. But it was, uh, . So, so I chazared the, the whole pilpul, but my father told him, "Without the . That, don't chazar by him. That he'll say by the bar mitzvah. He'll be by the bar mitzvah too. He'll hear it then. Now, only the nigleh part." So he, he was very impressed, and, uh, he asked a question, like, I don't remember exactly. Like, how can there be tefillin only a chefitz without a gavra? Uh, so I, I didn't know what to say. My father said, "If a Lubavitcher puts on tefillin with another Yid" He's a... Maybe it was like a, more like a, in a, in a joking manner. But then when he came to the bar mitzvah, so he I chazared it by the bar mitzvah for twenty minutes, the whole sicha, which before I started, my father used the whole bar mitzvah as another opportunity for . For example, to teach the elul, the halacha from the Rebbe not to be mafsik in middle of a-

47:21 Speaker 4 Pilpul

47:22 Speaker 1 ... pilpul. I prepared a long sicha to chazar, and everybody's gonna start singing after five minutes. So he says-

47:28 Speaker 4 Isn't there a story with, uh-

47:29 Speaker 1 With my shver

47:29 Speaker 4 ... your shver about that?

47:30 Speaker 1 Yeah. When my, when my brother-in-law, Levi, got married in

47:36 Speaker 4 The shver is Rabbi Binyamin Klein, the Rebbe's maskir-

47:38 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm

47:38 Speaker 4 ... for our listeners.

47:41 Speaker 1 Right.

47:41 Speaker 4 So back when Levi got married.

47:43 Speaker 1 When Levi got married, so the Rebbe asked my shver about, uh, if chazar chassidus, if they interrupted. And the Rebbe said-- So, so, and my shver was also surprised that the Rebbe said always not to interrupt. Uh, but the Rebbe said that, uh, they should-

47:58 Speaker 4 Say it again

47:59 Speaker 1 ... also do the minchah. So the way to do this is after you finish, you start over again, and then you can interrupt.

48:05 Speaker 4 That's, that's the macher for to do that?

48:07 Speaker 1 Yeah.

48:07 Speaker 4 It's that story?

48:08 Speaker 1 Yeah. Because the Rebbe told him to be mefasdemet. So he typed it up and put it all of a sudden suddenly.

48:13 Speaker 4 That's where it comes from.

48:14 Speaker 1 Yeah. That, that-

48:15 Speaker 4 So when you... No, not everyone knows about it.

48:17 Speaker 1 Yeah.

48:17 Speaker 4 When you finish the main mitzvah, start it again.

48:19 Speaker 1 Correct.

48:20 Speaker 4 Then interrupt.

48:21 Speaker 1 Yeah.

48:21 Speaker 4 And became the, the Minchas Yisroel.

48:23 Speaker 1 Correct.

48:23 Speaker 4 What's the idea? Is that, uh-

48:26 Speaker 1 The original-

48:27 Speaker 4 Yeah

48:27 Speaker 1 ... interrupting is because of that.

48:29 Speaker 4 Right.

48:29 Speaker 1 But what's the inyan to the That's it.

48:35 Speaker 4 So back to the bar mitzvah. So your father, uh-

48:37 Speaker 1 So he, he said this halacha from the Rebbe that not allowed to be mafsik, so yeah, there's no interrupting. So I said the whole thing, and I said the So the Rav, after the pilpul, turns to me and said, "You thought that I wouldn't understand the ?"

48:57 Speaker 4 Okay. So I guess that's a on how to make something niskabel by somebody, is, uh, hold, hold back, then they're gonna want it more.

49:05 Speaker 1 Yeah. But that was the avir, the koch in the Rebbe's sichas and the mivtzoim. That, that was the geschmack. Uh-

49:13 Speaker 4 That's also very interesting that, um, your father, I mean, s-since you, you weren't growing up around other Lubavitchers and all in that svivah, but, like, your father, y-you know, had the, the reasons to be in New York all the time, so he, he kept on bringing back the grussens. Very, it's very interesting.

49:32 Speaker 1 Yeah.

49:32 Speaker 4 So w-- And what other... Like, were there hookups already at that time? Like the-

49:37 Speaker 1 Oh, so the hookups was like this. Uh, it was very expensive to make a hookup, a phone call for a few hours. So not every farbrengen. We used to get from WLCC the tapes of the farbrengens in the mail, and my father used to listen to the whole, you know, farbrengen, and we would hear it in the middle of Elul or whatever.

49:58 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm.

49:58 Speaker 1 But we would always hear the farbrengens in the car and here, there. My siblings recently, we spoke about, uh, We were little kids. Uh, so they couldn't believe that I remember some things. So they said, "What do you mean?" We went up to the mountains. we heard the whole You bist tamas farbrengen in the car, and, uh, of course we-- I remember. You know, th- certain things were like-

50:22 Speaker 4 Right.

50:23 Speaker 1 Yeah.

50:24 Speaker 4 You remember where you were.

50:25 Speaker 1 Yeah. It, it, it stuck. Um, so but occasionally there was a hookup. From the hookup-- So we got the hookup from London, from Hackney in London. That, that was that how, that's how we got it. And the Anash would gather in our living room, but I wasn't allowed to stay up. It was-

50:50 Speaker 4 Middle of the-

50:50 Speaker 1 The farbrengen started when in Zurich was like, what, uh, three AM, three thirty AM.

50:57 Speaker 4 Yeah.

50:58 Speaker 1 It was, it wasn't, uh... I was a kid, I had to go to school the next day. But there was a commotion. People came into the house. The Rebbe would speak on a speaker in the dining room. I would wake up and like, you know, uh-

51:13 Speaker 4 You knew what was going on

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57:26 Speaker 1 The Rebbe held his siddur and the gartel in, in the hand. Only later did the Rebbe start coming into shul already with the gartel on him. Uh, in those years, the Rebbe still put the gartel on in the zal. And the Rebbe was giving out coins to all the children. Now, uh, nobody told me, my father didn't tell me that, you know, you gotta keep the coin, and a different coin goes into the pushke. I chaggadlich gewusst. I just knew the Rebbe gave me a coin, and I saw kids go to the pushke, put it in. So I got a coin from the Rebbe. I stood closer to Gan Eden Ha'tachton. I walked to the pushke, put it into the pushke like I saw kids going, putting. And then I just stood there near the pushke. The Rebbe continued giving out coins to the other kids. And when the Rebbe came to the pushke, the Rebbe looked at me very intently, "She bakumen a sent?" And I was so, like, awed, this yiras Hakovod, that, uh, I, I couldn't answer. I, I wanted to say, "Yeah." I, I understood. I, uh, Yiddish was, uh... I grew up with Yiddish, but I, I, I couldn't say. The Rebbe didn't give me another coin. I guess the Rebbe asked me, the Rebbe got the answer anyways. And, um, then the Rebbe put his-

58:40 Speaker 5 That was your, uh, welcome.

58:42 Speaker 1 Uh-huh. The Rebbe, the Rebbe put his coin into the-- his own coin into the pushke, and then the Rebbe went into the zal, and then the door closed. I, I, I didn't know the said rat voren. And I, I like, "Uh, I, I wanna go in and, and daven with the Rebbe." But later I knew that by Krias HaTorah the door used to stay open. But by Mincha, Maariv, after the Rebbe would go in, Chabad Chabad would close the-

59:06 Speaker 5 'Cause the Rebbe's facing the door

59:07 Speaker 1 ... yeah, because the Rebbe was standing right there and davening, so you can look at the Rebbe's face.

59:12 Speaker 5 Right. By Krias HaTorah, the Rebbe's facing the other way.

59:14 Speaker 1 Right. Yeah. And also it's not a tefillah. It's not Shemoneh Esreh.

59:18 Speaker 5 Right.

59:18 Speaker 1 It's, uh, talking, uh, of which in the later years by after farbrengens, the Rebbe used to daven near his place by farbrengen. I remember Rosh Hashanah Taf Shin Nun, the first day there was a farbrengen, which was unusual first day farbrengen, but because it was Shabbos-

59:35 Speaker 5 Shabbos

59:35 Speaker 1 ... the Rebbe spoke about it by farbrengen. But there were no mechayim. I didn't have a mokin kabbalah then by farbrengen anyways. But somehow I ended up standing by farbrengen, like, where the Rashag used to sit, like, the end of the table, like, in that area. So after the, the farbrengen, the Rebbe stood up and daven Mincha by the shtender facing the crowd. Now, right in front of the Rebbe, they made, like, space. Everybody moved aside. Nobody stood right in front of the Rebbe when the Rebbe davened. But L'maase, there was no wall in front of the Rebbe, uh, so-

1:00:10 Speaker 5 So if you're over there-

1:00:10 Speaker 1 So, so, so you were able to see the Rebbe. So during Shemoneh Esreh, everybody davens Shemoneh Esreh, I also davened. But the whole chazal shashats, and I say, "Mamish," were able to see the Rebbe, like... But that explains, you know, that helps to understand that, you know, of course, a regular day, Mincha, Maariv, the door had to be closed.

1:00:30 Speaker 5 Was shut.

1:00:30 Speaker 1 Yeah. Um.

1:00:36 Speaker 5 So, um, how old were you when, when you, when you came to the Rebbe the first time?

1:00:40 Speaker 1 Oh, so I, I was eight years old. My brother also came-

1:00:43 Speaker 5 So what year is this?

1:00:44 Speaker 1 ... and Sam. So Yutras Kises Mem Beis.

1:00:45 Speaker 5 Mem, Mem Beis.

1:00:46 Speaker 1 That was the first time we came to the Rebbe. And, uh-

1:00:49 Speaker 5 So there's no Yechidus.

1:00:50 Speaker 1 There was no Yechidus. We were by the farbrengen. My father made sure afternoon, Tuesday afternoon, we had to sleep, which wasn't so difficult because we were jet-lagged anyways. And the farbrengen was a five-hour farbrengen. It was like a long farbrengen. So I, I don't remember mamish teychn of the sichas. I remember that everybody stood up for the maimer. I didn't know what is going on. My father told me the Rebbe gave zogn a maimer. And I remember the Rebbe would clap. I, I, I saw briefly when I glanced through the Der Her that it talks about the strong clapping. I remember that because I remember my father lifted me up and lifted my brother up to watch the Rebbe clapping. 'Cause we stood at the end of the farbrengen bimeh, but we were short. We were kids. So it wasn't as packed over there, but still, you know, we stood on a bench, this, that. On the video of Yutras Kises Mem Beis, there's a video of the entire farbrengen. So only at the end of the farbrengen, at one point, does the camera go to that corner, and you can see my father and me and my brother singing the Alter Rebbe's Nigun, the, the Nigunim at the end of the farbrengen. Um, so I remember my father lifting me up, lifting my brother up to s- to watch the Rebbe clap vigorously of the shtark, shtark. So that is also one of the images that I remember from our first visit by the

1:02:11 Speaker 1 Rebbe. That, that, that was the, the first time by the Rebbe-

1:02:15 Speaker 4 And since-

1:02:16 Speaker 1 Yud Tes Kislev Mem Beis

1:02:16 Speaker 4 ... after that you came more often or not necessarily? That was a one-time thing.

1:02:21 Speaker 1 It was very expensive to come. It was very, very expensive. Uh, even my grandfather, uh, told my father like, "What are you taking little kids to the Rebbe? They'll grow up, they'll go." It was like, like who ever heard of that? He's taking little kids across the ocean. Eh, yeah, my father felt, "No, they have to come."

1:02:43 Speaker 4 Was, was there a-

1:02:43 Speaker 1 But the next time I came was Hanukkah Mem Hei

1:02:46 Speaker 4 Was there a reason why your father decided then, you know-

1:02:50 Speaker 1 I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

1:02:52 Speaker 4 Try to-

1:02:52 Speaker 1 My father was a Yud Tes Kislev digger. He used to come many years for Yud Tes Ki- not every year, but many years he used to come, and, um, I guess he decided to take his boys with.

1:03:07 Speaker 4 So the next time you were there-

1:03:09 Speaker 1 I'm, I'm trying to think now. You're asking the question, oh. My mother was expecting then her youngest child, maybe to ease the burden on her to take the two boys along, but it was meshuga expensive, so i-it wasn't a common thing to do. Yeah. Anyways, yeah.

1:03:31 Speaker 4 And the next time was, you said, uh-

1:03:32 Speaker 1 The next time was Hanukkah-

1:03:33 Speaker 4 Mem Hei

1:03:33 Speaker 1 ... Mem Hei. Hanukkah Mem Hei. So Hanukkah Mem Hei, I-- So we came for the whole Hanukkah, um, almost all Hanukkah, I don't remember exactly, but we were here. I remember the rally, I remember the, the sicha to the Skveranim, I remember the Shabbos farbrengen. And at that point, I was already a bit older and like when I was eight years old, my father didn't teach me look at the sichas mamesh, but when I was 11, I already learned a whole bunch of sichas. I remember the Sicha Rav and Shmuel, uh, about Melech Hodes. Uh, certain sichas I, I remember learning with my father. Um, so at that point I read and, and I y-knew Yiddish, so I didn't understand the whole farbrengen, but I, I stood the whole farbrengen trying to understand as much as I could. I had a good chassid, a melamed. He, he told my father he's only giving reshus for me to leave school, stam, the school. Uh, giving permission on condition that when I come back, I chazer from the farbrengen a sicha for Rebbe. So, yeah. So I remember the Rashi sicha and this, and my father helped me a bit and-

1:04:42 Speaker 4 Yeah

1:04:42 Speaker 1 ... I, I chozered afterwards the Rebbe sicha.

1:04:45 Speaker 4 It's amazing.

1:04:45 Speaker 1 Yeah. So, you know, it was, it was-- That was very geshmack. Hanukkah b'chal was always a very geshmacke yontef by the Rebbe.

1:04:56 Speaker 4 Why?

1:04:57 Speaker 1 It, it was weekday, it was smaller elul, it wasn't Tishrei. Um-

1:05:02 Speaker 4 But yet people came

1:05:02 Speaker 1 ... and, and people came, and the way the Rebbe stood, Hanerot Halalu, turned to the crowd, looking at the candles, looking at the crowd, looking in the siddur, it was a very intimate feeling with the Rebbe. That, that's how I felt maybe because I came Mem Hei. The next time I came was Hanukkah Mem Ches, way to Hanukkah. Yeah. So-

1:05:26 Speaker 4 And we see in the video something s-special about-

1:05:29 Speaker 1 Yeah

1:05:29 Speaker 4 ... the Hanerot Halalu.

1:05:31 Speaker 1 It's very-

1:05:31 Speaker 4 As the Rebbe has, like the Rebbe sings, like-

1:05:33 Speaker 1 Bam, bam, bam

1:05:33 Speaker 4 ... yeah, bam, bam always.

1:05:35 Speaker 1 Yeah. It, it was very-

1:05:36 Speaker 4 I even noticed even after Chavdei Noach-

1:05:37 Speaker 1 Yeah

1:05:38 Speaker 4 ... Hanukkah at the end of Gemur by bam, bam, the Rebbe starts making with his hands.

1:05:42 Speaker 1 Mem Hei was I, I have-- So M-Mem Beis, the first time I came, like I said, I remember seeing the Rebbe the first time as he walked out. I remember the Rebbe asked me a Shema Koheina scent and a few images of the farbrengen.

1:05:57 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm.

1:05:58 Speaker 1 The maimer, the clapping of the hands, the sichas as they in the background, but, you know, we were kids. After the farbrengen, we s- we were there for five hours for a long farbrengen and, you know, finished, I don't know, two thirty, quarter to three: farbrengen ended. We were hungry . But my father took us on Kingston Avenue. The pizza store was open . We had pizza at three AM . I don't know how many Crown Heights kids had that experience with how to stay up a whole farbrengen as they mitten the nacht at that age- ... eight-year-old boys, and then, then to go eat pizza on the Kingston Avenue .

1:06:31 Speaker 4 Uh, I have a family member that I think sh- there was a dilemma. Her kids associated going to the Rebbe with pizza. So-

1:06:40 Speaker 1 No, I didn't associate-

1:06:41 Speaker 4 So it was a big dilemma

1:06:41 Speaker 1 ... Oh, we were just hungry, and my father didn't know what we were gonna do with something, yeah.

1:06:44 Speaker 4 She w- it was bothering her that this is the association, but she was told it's okay, like that, uh, they know what the ikar and the tafel is.

1:06:54 Speaker 1 You remind me, Rabbi Sol Friedman, he was our rosh yeshiva in Altele, and so, uh, he, he farbrenged with us. On numerous occasion, he made that point.

1:07:04 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm

1:07:04 Speaker 1 "Megeit davening Mincha mit Rebbe. You go davening Mincha with the Rebbe, and you see the Rebbe, this is a gila ulekus. You come back and You know why that happens? Because from seven seventy two Altele, which was then on Troy Avenue, they get me now through Kingston Avenue. Uh, this guy, guy that buys a pizza, and this guy buys an ice cream, this guy, guy, guy buys a, a candy, and by the time you reach the zal, the reish of the gila ulekus is gone." So yeah.

1:07:41 Speaker 4 Um, so and you said the third time you came was Mem Ches.

1:07:45 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:07:45 Speaker 4 So you were already after bar mitzvah.

1:07:47 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:07:48 Speaker 4 Where were you learning-

1:07:48 Speaker 1 Short-

1:07:48 Speaker 4 ... in yeshiva? You were learn- You were how-

1:07:49 Speaker 1 So I learned still in Switzerland. My bar mitzvah was in Teshri Mem Zain. Uh, the plan was that after my bar mitzvah, my father's gonna send me to a yeshiva, a Lubavitcher Chen Chaimim yeshiva. No more elementary, no this. Even if it's the middle of the year, but the plan was at the end of the year. Brinwa wasn't an option, wasn't on the table at the time I don't know exactly why.

1:08:19 Speaker 4 For whatever reason.

1:08:19 Speaker 1 For whatever reason. And, um, although we knew a-as a little kid, I always dreamt I'm g-for sure gonna go to Brinwa because Reb Kushia Kalinson used to come to our house once a year, and of course, I'm gonna go to Reb Kushia's yeshiva. You know, I, I was a little kid. My fa-- I never discussed this with my father. Uh, that's what I thought. My father never thought that. My cousin went to learn in London, the mechinah in London, in yeshiva. My father sent me to Telles Emeth in Yerushalayim. Now, he would have sent me already in the beginning, um, uh, like, uh, middle of Mem Zain or something like that, or the end of Mem Zain. Health, the Reb Ishta, that, uh, two months after my bar mitzvah, I had a skiing accident. Growing up in Switzerland, everybody grows up on skis. Yeah, just mikatznus. So I, I went skiing from seven years old, eight years old. I, I was a good skier. I was able to ski, uh, but had a bad fall, and the way I fell was, uh, in a, in a way that I broke my hip.

1:09:26 Speaker 4 Wow.

1:09:27 Speaker 1 I ended up six weeks in the hospital, eight months on crutches, and then I needed physical therapy to learn how to walk normal again. So when that ordeal was over, I was finally ready to go to yeshiva. So... But beforehand, my father took me to the Rebbe. That was Chanukah Mem Ches. And after, I went Tevet Shvat, I went to, uh, so middle of the year. I joined the yeshiva middle of the year. Um, so Chanukah Mem Ches, I-- The Rebbe said a sicha every night.

1:10:04 Speaker 4 Right.

1:10:04 Speaker 1 That was a chiddush. And Shanos Hakel maybe, uh-

1:10:07 Speaker 4 And Pesach also the Rebbe said sicha every night.

1:10:09 Speaker 1 Pesach also. Could be that was, uh, because of Shanos Hakel. Because Shanos Hakel was a big koch. I remember Sukkos already in Switzerland, me and my brother, we made Kinuset Hakel in Zurich, uh, and, and we, we made, like, the cards for Hakel, Tefach Al Tefach. We got the Allgemeine. My grandfather was, uh, monui of the Allgemeine Journal. So in Allgemeine Journal, there was the ad for the Hakel-

1:10:36 Speaker 4 It was the time

1:10:37 Speaker 1 ...and the cards, so I took it from there, I copied it, typed up my own. We made cards for Hakel. We were kids. We were written up in the Kach Chabad magazine.

1:10:46 Speaker 4 Mm.

1:10:47 Speaker 1 Me and my brother made a Kinus Hakel for children in the Beth Chabad in Zurich. Go find the Gideon, the old Gideons in Kach Chabad. Um, it shows you that we were, like, into things. And, um, Chanukah Mem Ches, I came here to the Rebbe. The first, uh, night-

1:11:06 Speaker 4 It reminds me that, uh, that the Rebbe's written up in Ha'ach. When the Rebbe was a kid. No, the Rebbe was-

1:11:15 Speaker 1 Yeah

1:11:15 Speaker 4 ...was far away from, from that.

1:11:17 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah.

1:11:17 Speaker 4 But he...

1:11:20 Speaker 1 Yeah. Neila beElchiso, netzach salavoit.

1:11:23 Speaker 4 It's a good thing. It's a good thing, you know.

1:11:25 Speaker 1 Yeah, sure, sure. So, so Chanukah Mem Ches, the, the first, uh, sicha, after the sicha, the Rebbe came down. The Rebbe was giving out pecklach of dollars to the thankists. Uh, so I didn't view myself as a thankist or whatever, but, but I stood there for the sicha right by the edge of the Rebbe's bimah. So as soon as the Rebbe came down, everybody pushed forward, and I landed as a, right in front of the Rebbe, like, by the table. So the Rebbe is holding a peckle of dollars, and the Rebbe looks at me, "A thankist. This a thankist." So I nodded, "Yeah." Now, I, I'm not sure that I understood even what the Rebbe said, but, um, but later on, I chapzech, and I was like, "Am I a thankist? Am I gonna..." But then I remembered that on Sukkos, the Shliach made a sukkah mobile. Remember, the Rosenfeld made a sukkah mobile, and we were ver-we were very much involved. We went with the sukkah mobile. We did mitzvah lulav. We put up the signs on the sukkah and everything. So decided, "Okay." So I didn't lie. Ata ka thankist. And so that was an interaction that I had with the Rebbe then, Mem Ches. And Shabbos Fabregen was a long Fabregen. I remember that at the end of the Fabregen was like Mincha, Ma'ariv. I don't remember if it was Mem He, Mem Ches.

1:12:48 Speaker 4 Which one?

1:12:49 Speaker 1 Could be it was both of them. Mem Ches, I'm almost sure that it was-

1:12:52 Speaker 4 It's the middle of the winter. Yeah.

1:12:53 Speaker 1 Yes, in winter, and it's a Shabbos Chanukah. So the Rebbe spoke, uh, you know, the Zoya and the Rashi and Rambam already in M-in Mem Ches, and Mem He also was Ram. And, uh, yeah, the Fabregen was a long Fabregen, so that I remember that, you know, ending the Fabregen, there was Mincha, and then afterwards Ma'ariv, and it was the end of Shabbos, which again, for us, Mem He, Mem Ches, my father already had experienced that. I have never experienced that. So, so that like-

1:13:25 Speaker 4 Yeah

1:13:25 Speaker 1 ...as, as a unique, uh-

1:13:29 Speaker 4 So you ended up going to Telles Emes. There's other people there besides Israelis in Telles Emes in that age?

1:13:36 Speaker 1 The shirim, the shirim in Telles Emes then were not in Ivrit. They were in Yiddish.

1:13:41 Speaker 4 'Cause you're Yerushalayim.

1:13:42 Speaker 1 Yeah. And that's why my father sent us there, 'cause I didn't speak English. My cousin-

1:13:47 Speaker 4 Oh, but Aletele there also in Yiddish.

1:13:49 Speaker 1 He, uh-

1:13:50 Speaker 4 He didn't want to go to New York

1:13:50 Speaker 1 To send overseas that far wasn't on the table.

1:13:53 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm.

1:13:54 Speaker 1 It had to be around Europe. So my cousin went to England. He spoke English. In, in their home, they spoke English. Uh, w-I didn't speak English. So my father, and to Brinwa, he didn't wanna send us. At the time, Brinwa wasn't as it became in, in later years, much more popular. Then it was very quiet. So he sent us to Telles Emes where the shirim were in Yiddish. Okay? That's how Telles Emes was chosen.

1:14:22 Speaker 4 Mm-hmm.

1:14:22 Speaker 1 Now-

1:14:23 Speaker 4 And how long were you there?

1:14:25 Speaker 1 I was there Mem Ches, Mem Tes, Nun. Really, at the end of Mem Tes, I wanted... That was the end of Yeshiva Ktanah. I didn't wanna continue Yeshiva Gedola Telles Emes. I wanted to come to Aletele already. Um, but the yeshiva in Telles Emes had closed down the zal for a couple of years. That year, for Tov Shin Nun, they reopened the zal, and they begged us, the hanhalah begged us to stay. Meaning they, they begged the bochurim that, uh, not saying, uh, know, kids who grew up in Teresem as elementary, and then through Mesivta, Yeshivat Taner, they had enough. They, they wanted to move out, so they went to Chabad. So the majority of my class actually went to Chabad. A bunch of them stayed in Teresem. And I didn't want-- I wanted, I wanted to go to the Rebbe.

1:15:32 Speaker 6 They're all Israelis.

1:15:32 Speaker 1 I wanted to go to Huh?

1:15:33 Speaker 6 They're all Israelis here, this class.

1:15:36 Speaker 1 Yeah, most of them.

1:15:36 Speaker 6 Yeah.

1:15:36 Speaker 1 There were, there were, there were a few. There were, like, two guys from Montreal, Schmukler and, uh, Kazikuru. There, there, there were some Chutznikim.

1:15:47 Speaker 6 Majority.

1:15:48 Speaker 1 But the majority were Israeli guys. And, um, so I told my father, "I wanna go to New York. I, I wanna go to the Rebbe. I wanna learn near the Rebbe. Enough, you know?" My father was very nervous. Why? Because my father didn't know exactly what's going on here in New York. He didn't know about all the . He only knew seven seventy. Every time he come, came to seven seventy, he saw Bochum hanging out outside, smoking, schmoozing. It didn't-- He didn't have a good relation that this is episaa, a place to send a Bocher to learn.

1:16:27 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:16:27 Speaker 1 He was very, very nervous. Uh, but he didn't tell me that that's the reason. I didn't know that that's the reason. And I, "What do you mean? I wanna go learn near the Rebbe. I wanna be by the Rebbe." Tisha Mem Tes, I came for sukkahs. My father took me and my brother, uh, because I had my skiing accident the year before, so my father was nervous. Hakafos was pushing and this. So actually, my father, me and my brother, Mem Tes Hakafos, we stood in the hall where the Skanim stood.

1:16:57 Speaker 6 Oh.

1:16:57 Speaker 1 The Rebbe's fa-

1:16:58 Speaker 6 They, they let you in?

1:16:58 Speaker 1 -bime was, like, moved over.

1:17:01 Speaker 6 Yeah.

1:17:01 Speaker 1 And in the corner where the Rebbe's-

1:17:03 Speaker 6 Skanim

1:17:03 Speaker 1 ... bime usually stood were the Skanim. That's where I was by Hakafos.

1:17:07 Speaker 6 Who let you in? Who let-

1:17:09 Speaker 1 Vaad HaMesader. My father arranged it. Talking about Vaad HaMesader. Tov Shemem Hey came for the rally. Uh, every bench had designated Lubavitch Yeshiva. Two k-boys from Switzerland, where are they sitting? So my father sat us down on one of the benches. Uh, very soon, "Ah, you can't sit here. "" Kids, uh Came one of the Mes-Vaad HaMesader, came over, "What's going on?" My father told him, "Uh, two boys coming from across the street, uh, the, the sea to here, hear the Rebbe. You better let them sit." And they got, uh, all dust. We were the, the boys who actually listened from beginning to the end, to the Rebbe. I couldn't believe it. The Melamdim gave out, uh, uh, lollipops to the kids, so they should be qui-- Kids were playing, and, uh, Switzerland boys, forget about it. This is the Rebbe. We had, uh, assembly in school. The principal would speak to the entire school or, uh, Rabbonim that came to visit. I remember the Boston Rebbe. I remember the, um, Rav Frenkel from Tel Aviv. Rav Lave Shver came. So he spoke to the whole school. You couldn't hear a peeps. Whatever the fifteen minutes they gave a, a speech, a or whatever they spoke about. But the for a Rov, it's not a Rov. The Rebbe, pashut-

1:18:44 Speaker 6 You, you-

1:18:44 Speaker 1 I couldn't believe the scene.

1:18:46 Speaker 6 The cult-culture shock.

1:18:47 Speaker 1 Culture shock. I couldn't believe this concept.

1:18:49 Speaker 6 You didn't know what I was-

1:18:50 Speaker 1 Talking while the Rebbe is talking, it's playing under the tables and this. But say some, a-and even me as a kid, I thought to myself, "Uh, and they need to sit here a-and we had to fight for our seats?"

1:19:04 Speaker 6 Mm.

1:19:04 Speaker 1 But, uh, yeah, whatever.

1:19:06 Speaker 6 And after- Mem Ches, um, the Rebbe spoke very strongly to the kids that were, uh, making noise. The one time the Rebbe addressed it. So I heard that afterwards. There was, like, a whole campaign to, in, in the schools like-

1:19:20 Speaker 1 At, that time still.

1:19:21 Speaker 6 Yeah. Like, like, and an-an-

1:19:22 Speaker 1 You mentioned that sicha. My father, Chamish Sukkos, Mem Ches, he had to come to New York. Episa business, a dover oved.

1:19:33 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:19:33 Speaker 1 Chamish, he, he had to come. But he, he didn't, he-- The whole family was in Switzerland, and I was still on crutches. So he came here. He saw what's going on every night, Chamish Sukkos. This was Shnas Hakal. It was Shnas Tismach Tu Samach. The Rebbe was like fifteen years younger.

1:19:57 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:19:57 Speaker 1 It was... I wasn't here, but everybody talks about this. And my father saw it. He saw-- He, he, he chalished to stay. He, like, uh, he had mamish a hard time to leave back for Switzerland for Simchat Torah, but he did. Um, he had a flight that night. So he was by the rally.

1:20:17 Speaker 6 The rally.

1:20:18 Speaker 1 And, uh, he had to go catch a flight. And the Rebbe starting another sicha. And that was the sicha my father was on shpilkes. You know? Uh, he waited, waited. But he came back. I remember he, he was talking in the Chabad house to the Anash at the Leil Shmini Atzeres just of his experience of the last few days by the Rebbe. And he, he pashut had tears in his eyes because he's going to have to go, that, that he didn't stay for Simchat Torah. But he told, uh, right then, he told my mother that night, "Next year, Hakafos, we're by the Rebbe." Meaning him and the boys. The year after Tov Shin Nun He took the girls also. He took the whole family for Tisha to the-

1:21:04 Speaker 6 So Mem Tes Hakah you were there?

1:21:05 Speaker 1 So Mem Tes, we came on Chol Hamoed Sukkot. First day Chol Hamoed, we flew to New York. We were here till after Simchat Torah. So the first Hakafot that I was zoche to see by the Rebbe was Taf Shin Mem Tes, and I had a good spot right there. So the, the first and second Hakafot I wasn't able to see because everybody stood up, and, uh, you know, we, we climbed up onto the Rebbe's bimah but-

1:21:27 Speaker 6 You know, in the middle of the Shul.

1:21:28 Speaker 1 Yeah, but i-it was hard to see. But the-- all the Hakafot, pashut, this was agil ulekus. I, I never saw the Rebbe like that, dancing, clapping, the moir panim, looking around to everybody and making like this, the, the v-Shlofman. The Rebbe greeted people like this, like the Rebbe motioned to people like, "Asham Aleichem." Uh, all these kind of tnuot and, and the whole, the idudim had Rebbe, uh, th-this pashut was out of this world. That's, that's-- I already saw the Rebbe a few times by then, but still that, that was Hakafot. And then, uh, I was zoche Taf Shin Nun, Nun Alef, Nun Beis, Hakafot as well.

1:22:15 Speaker 6 So yeah, I, I think we got into this 'cause you're in the middle of-

1:22:18 Speaker 1 Oh, good. Thank you

1:22:18 Speaker 6 ... saying how you're, um, so you wanted to go to New York.

1:22:24 Speaker 1 Yeah, I wanted to go Talit Tehillah. So, so my father said, "You know, the Rebbe always says, "'Duch lemidan holer.' Go speak with..." I said, "What do you mean? Dan Holer of course is gonna say that I need to stay. They are begging us to stay. I don't wanna talk to Dan Holer."

1:22:37 Speaker 6 I love how nothing changed, by the way.

1:22:39 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:22:39 Speaker 6 I'm thinking my, about my experiences in yeshivas that similar things-

1:22:42 Speaker 1 So my father told me, "Go speak to Reb Yossel Segal." Reb Yossel Segal, he was a Rosh Kehillah of Temach Tzedek, but he had, you know, Temach Tzedek is connected to Toras Emes, and my father had a shaiiches with Reb Yossel Segal. Why?

1:22:59 Speaker 6 Would he come to Switzerland too?

1:23:00 Speaker 1 Because when I-- Yeah, but, but that was already when I was in yeshiva, not when I grew up.

1:23:04 Speaker 6 Like a Bochur, he travels around.

1:23:05 Speaker 1 It was because of my father and because of the Rebbe.

1:23:08 Speaker 6 Okay.

1:23:09 Speaker 1 What happened was my fa-- when, when we learned in Toras Emes, so my parents came occasionally to Eretz Yisrael to visit us. So I don't remember what farbrengen it was. There was a Yom DePag, la, you know, you Beis Tammuz, you Tes Kislev, something like that, a Yut Zvat maybe, in Shichon Chabad in Yerushalayim, and Reb Yossel Segal farbrenged. And my father was there, and he heard the, he watched the farbrengen, and my father said to himself first, "That type is perfect for the Olam in Europe, Antwerp, and Zurich." He said, "The Chassidishe Olam, they would love this style of farbrengen." So my father told Reb Shie Yuzewich the next day, "I, I heard the farbrengen of Yossel Segal. I think that you should send him to fundraise for Toras Emes." He never did, did fundraising. That wasn't his, uh, thing. But Shie wrote this to the Rebbe. Reb Shie Yuzewich wrote to the Rebbe that, uh, "Schmeling from Switzerland, uh, is matzia as Yossel Segal." The Rebbe answered and circled my father's name, uh, Schmeling Omer or whatever he wrote, "Vechein yaseh o yaseh katzosi." That was it.

1:24:37 Speaker 6 So he-

1:24:38 Speaker 1 So then he came to Switzerland. So I wasn't there when he was in Switzerland.

1:24:41 Speaker 6 So his whole career is-

1:24:42 Speaker 1 He came after that every year, Yossel Segal came to Switzerland.

1:24:44 Speaker 6 I, I, I've, I've seen him in various places that I've been in yeshiva, whatever he came, and yeah.

1:24:48 Speaker 1 Right.

1:24:48 Speaker 6 It's all because of that.

1:24:49 Speaker 1 It's all because of that. That started it. So my father told me, "Go speak to Yossel Segal. You know, discuss with him." Yossel Segal convinced me to stay another year in Toras Emes. It was a good year. We learned well, and, uh, I feel bad that I could have had another year by the Rebbe, but l'maaseh-

1:25:12 Speaker 6 This is Taf Shin Nun

1:25:12 Speaker 1 ... it was a geshmake year.

1:25:14 Speaker 6 Taf Shin Nun?

1:25:15 Speaker 1 This was Taf Shin Nun.

1:25:16 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:25:16 Speaker 1 And now there was a group of shluchim.

1:25:20 Speaker 6 I was about to ask that. This Habad group.

1:25:22 Speaker 1 This were the group of shluchim came in Tes. These were chevrah, heavy duty shluchim. Avrahamel Sternberg, Zalman Wolowik, Mendel Azimov, Shloime Huminer, Berel Levertov, Yesse Vogel, Ariel Sasson. You know this Ariel?

1:25:43 Speaker 6 No.

1:25:44 Speaker 1 Okay. I missed out somebody, I think, but okay, so the-these were shluchim, zey hobn ibek kat Yerushalayim. They, as much as this kashrus that I had me before, they, they almost . So, like, before Tisha B-- "But I vant to learn on Tisha." So I, I said, "I don't have where to stay if I can't go for Rosh Hashanah to New York. Where will I stay?" So Mendel Chen-- Oh, him I didn't mention, . Mendel Chen said-

1:26:16 Speaker 6 Mendel Chen

1:26:16 Speaker 1 ... "You'll stay in my parents' house." Me and my brother. So I told my parents we wanna go for Tisha to New York. So my mother was a little bit upset with it. "Agansi, are you in yeshiva? Yom Tov, you gotta come home." But basically told her, "Listen-

1:26:35 Speaker 6 You gotta grow up

1:26:36 Speaker 1 ... Tisha is mit dem Rebbe." At that point, I wasn't a little boy anymore.

1:26:39 Speaker 6 You already grew up, right.

1:26:40 Speaker 1 I, I didn't have money, so I still needed my father to pay for the tickets. Aber... So, so my father decided-

1:26:47 Speaker 6 The bochurim, the shluchim didn't teach you how to bring a suitcase of electronics? That was a, that was a mechanism, huh?

1:26:52 Speaker 1 No, that, that was not the table. No. And, and my, my father decided then, "Okay, so let them go for Rosh Hashanah already and Yom Kippur," and him and my mother and the girls will join for Sukkot.

1:27:08 Speaker 6 Sukkot.

1:27:08 Speaker 1 They stayed in the Plaza Hotel in- Uh, Crown Plaza-

1:27:12 Speaker 6 On C-Crown Plaza

1:27:13 Speaker 1 ... on Grand Street. Yeah. But me and my brother, we take a stay by Motel Chen, and, uh, I'm thankful for th- to them, ad hayom hazeh, because first of all, I had a place in the basement where to sleep, but also it's a Chassidishe shtub. The aver in the shtub, Motal was a Chassidishe yir, his rebbetzin, rebbal baal habayis, chaim v'chaim. The, the whole aver was a geschmacke aver. The whole bunch of boys, Chassidishe bachurim, uh, gelaften tzum rebbe. They showed me the ropes. They told me, "Wu me darf zein, ven me," you know.

1:27:46 Speaker 6 That was your first time-

1:27:46 Speaker 1 I didn't... It was first time that I was a whole Tisha by the Rebbe.

1:27:49 Speaker 6 Right.

1:27:50 Speaker 1 So, you know, everything they, Mendelchen, Moishechen, they all, they, they helped us out in telling us where to be when, and the march, and the, the kapores, and the broches that we had to... I knew about these things, but they helped us and got us in. It was very, very good. We, we had a geschmacke time that Tisha in their home. Actually, one of the, the Chens got engaged. They had a l'chaim on Chol Hamoed Sukkot that year. I remember, uh, my, my parents came to the l'chaim. They thanked them, they, hosting us you know. It was, uh, it was a geschmacke Tisha. But these chevra, so the whole Tov Shin Nun, you know, they, they farbrenged with the bachurim.

1:28:38 Speaker 6 You got a lot of-

1:28:38 Speaker 1 The aver, I gained that year in 770.

1:28:41 Speaker 6 Exposure.

1:28:41 Speaker 1 It, it was very good. But at the end of the year, I said, "Okay, Abe, that's it. It was nice one year, uh, zal in 770. I gotta go to the Rebbe." My father, here already my father told me wh- why he's hesitant. "Bachurim, they're learning ish. I go, I come, I, I see you hanging out. So nisht kayn aver fun lernen." That's when I chaptsikh what his hesitation is. So I, I already knew. I told him, "I'm not going to 770. I'm going to Ole Teyte." He said, "What is Ole Teyte?" He didn't know. So I told him, "Next time you're in New York..." At that point, he came almost monthly to New York for business. "Next time you're in New York, g- g- mach a bazucha. Be grem is this." Ole Teyte's zal was then-

1:29:30 Speaker 6 Troy

1:29:30 Speaker 1 ... on Troy. And the doors, there were, like, two flapping doors, and they had, like-

1:29:38 Speaker 6 A window

1:29:38 Speaker 1 ... cut, cut out windows.

1:29:39 Speaker 6 The Magen David, I think, yeah.

1:29:41 Speaker 1 Not Magen David.

1:29:41 Speaker 6 No, it's a window.

1:29:42 Speaker 1 Uh, just a square, like a, it was like a diamond shape, are they? And my father came im mitn tog. Baruch Hashem, there was no farbrengen the night before, was a full zal. It was like 200 bachurim sitting, hakel teyte ad hashamayim. My father was blown away. He said, "A Ponovezh in Lubavitch?" He was joking. But I said, "Mezitzte mer lernt?" He said, "Yeah." I said, "Tu tzuch. Ei va zein. You're going to Ole Teyte, you can go." And that's when I came.

1:30:15 Speaker 6 I think ad hayom hazeh, when people bring people to Crown Heights, and as walking around, they wanna show a b- a Bes Medrash-

1:30:23 Speaker 1 A mock Ole Teyte.

1:30:25 Speaker 6 You can bring them to Ole Teyte's zal.

1:30:26 Speaker 1 Okay.

1:30:26 Speaker 6 That's the way it works.

1:30:27 Speaker 1 Okay. So I came. Now, when I was here by the Rebbe as a kid, so my father took us with him as a guest. They let him stand, you know, near my future shver, Moshe Kotlarski, Vyám Klein. Like, in that corner, there always were, like, guests standing there. Um, so I stood there. But when I came, let's, let's say Tisha Tov Shin Nun, I was on my own. So every farbrengen ba-- I just squeezed in somewhere, and I didn't hear not one farbrengen.

1:30:59 Speaker 6 'Cause you're not-

1:31:00 Speaker 1 Tisha Tov Shin Nun. I didn't have a place.

1:31:01 Speaker 6 Yeah, no place.

1:31:01 Speaker 1 Yeah. So I, I tried to ask chaverim in, in Ole Teyte, like, "How do you get a place where you can actually always have your place?" And, "Oh, you can't get. You have to be Yiddishe from a, a..." Kitzo, came the first Shabbos, it was Elul Tov Shin Nun. I went to the area where my future shver stood, Moshe Kotlarski. I was a shtikel bimbes by Moshe Kotlarski. I, I ate there a lot on Shabbosim. And-

1:31:31 Speaker 6 He was with-

1:31:32 Speaker 1 Moshe Kotlarski also used to come to us.

1:31:34 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:31:35 Speaker 1 Yeah, Moshe was a guest in our house many times. I remember him in our childhood. He didn't stay in our, in our house like, uh, some of the other guests. He usually stayed in a hotel, but he used to come eat by us and farbrengen with my father. So, yeah. So, you know, I wasn't scared to go right there and try to squeeze my in, my way in there somewhere. So I came there. So there were some other people, like behind the Rebbe, the, the bench. There were, like, the Aftsins, Lipskers. There was a, a, a, a few families who, who stood there in that corner. Reb Itche Springer stood there. And, and I just, like, s- squeezed in into the corner over there. Like, behind the Rebbe, there's, like, the pole, and, like, in that corner, I just squeezed myself. Everybody started to protest.

1:32:26 Speaker 6 Like by the-

1:32:26 Speaker 1 "Who are you? What is this?"

1:32:27 Speaker 6 You come, like, by the, the, the air conditioning vent situation.

1:32:30 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah. Where now there's a door to go-

1:32:32 Speaker 6 Yeah

1:32:32 Speaker 1 ... into the ezras noshim. Yeah. So I, I, I-- Everybody started, like, berching, like, "Who is this bochur? What does he think he's doing? Uh, who are you? What are..." So I said, "I'm standing in my father's place." You need a bit... If, without some chutzpah, you, you, you wouldn't make it.

1:32:50 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:32:51 Speaker 1 So they said, "Alef, ein Yerushalmacher. Beis, your father doesn't have a place here. When he comes, amol, amol, losz mit dem shtern. Rebbe, there's a place. He has a place." So I, I turned to each one over there. "One second. Am I disturbing you?" I made it personal. The, the next guy, "Eh, me standing here bothers you? Like-" Bothering you? There was no pushing in that corner. It was, there was room. Yeah, when there were a lot of guests, resembling a Tische, the, over there it got very packed because all of those people, like my father or my uncle, they all got to squeeze in there. But Stama Shabbos, it was pretty comfortable standing there. So I like, like, "Am I disturbing? What does it bother you resembling a 770? Let me stand." So everybody felt uncomfortable. "Yes, bothers me that you're... No, you gotta get out." The-the-nobody said that.

1:33:46 Speaker 6 That became your place?

1:33:47 Speaker 1 That became my place. Next Shabbos, right-

1:33:48 Speaker 6 You were able to see?

1:33:50 Speaker 1 Elul 57, the end of that, uh, uh, Elul 5711, my brother and my cousin came to Alef Teitel. However, I was already resembling Me'vye Reiah.

1:34:03 Speaker 6 Mm.

1:34:03 Speaker 1 They stood with me. At that point I needed, uh, can't just bring them, uh, uh... So I made a contraption. I took a few, um, milk crates, and I made like a whole contraption over there, a few steps, which actually the people there appreciated. So now became a stickle matzav over there, where it was more comfortable. But bes chuzzeh, I had my brother and my cousin standing-

1:34:27 Speaker 6 What, what do you mean? You made the milk crates for what? For, for the other people?

1:34:31 Speaker 1 For, for them and, and for us. So like that, it didn't disturb so much because it was in the corner, but it was a-

1:34:38 Speaker 6 Higher

1:34:38 Speaker 1 ... raised platform made a whole-

1:34:41 Speaker 6 So every Fabregen you bring this from-

1:34:42 Speaker 1 Every fa... Yeah, I had it with a chain tied up in the chutz of 770 by the Tashlach, with a number lock. Before Fabregen, schlep in the boxes. Every Fabregen, Baruch Hashem, Nun Alef, Nun Beis, was able to hear every single Fabregen, see the Rebbe from close-

1:34:58 Speaker 6 You could, you could see

1:34:59 Speaker 1 ... from the side.

1:35:01 Speaker 6 Yeah, yeah, from the backside.

1:35:03 Speaker 1 Backside, but not much the back. It was pretty much the side. Yeah.

1:35:07 Speaker 6 And you were higher than everyone else.

1:35:08 Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah. So I had a good place, Baruch Hashem. Was able to hear everything. Now, the Eibeshte, uh, chein el adam daas, gave me a chush that I was able to do Chazzara. So between the sichas, I would-

1:35:21 Speaker 6 To write right away?

1:35:22 Speaker 1 Right away. I would say Chazzara.

1:35:24 Speaker 6 To who?

1:35:25 Speaker 1 To the Eilem around. And, and-

1:35:27 Speaker 6 To the ol-older people than you?

1:35:28 Speaker 1 Uh, yeah. People who didn't hear so well, people who couldn't follow the whole time. So, so everybody started appreciating-

1:35:36 Speaker 6 I, I, I-

1:35:36 Speaker 1 ... that I'm standing there.

1:35:37 Speaker 6 Uh.

1:35:37 Speaker 1 That between the sichas you get like a recap of what the Rebbe spoke.

1:35:41 Speaker 6 I have a question for you.

1:35:42 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

1:35:42 Speaker 6 You already knew the Rebbe Sig nen, like from hookups?

1:35:46 Speaker 1 From childhood.

1:35:47 Speaker 6 From childhood.

1:35:47 Speaker 1 Like I said, I, I, I heard the Rebbe in my house on the tapes, the WLCC tapes that came. Uh, it was playing all the time. So the Sig nen was mamish, and I had no problem.

1:35:59 Speaker 6 So you showed up Tosh Nun, Elul Tosh Nun, and you started doing this, this Chazzara, whatever, for the people. Was that a common thing that in different corners there's 770 people doing Chazzara?

1:36:08 Speaker 1 I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. I'll tell you, talking about Chazzara. First night of Sukkos, the Rebbe would say a sicha downstairs in the shul, and then the Rebbe would say a sicha in the sukkah to greet the Orchem.

1:36:23 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:36:23 Speaker 1 Now, usually, uh, like, like Chazal say, "Whoever sees this, doesn't see that." It couldn't be. But Tosh Nun, I decided resembling Beit. So I heard the sicha downstairs, and then I-

1:36:36 Speaker 6 Tosh Nun, this is before this?

1:36:38 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:36:38 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:36:39 Speaker 1 Tishrei Tosh Nun. Um, I think it was Tishrei. Maybe it was Nun Alef. I have to look up the sicha. And I ran right after the Rebbe finished the sicha. Before the Rebbe left the shul, I started already pushing. It was a huge pushing crowd to hear the sicha in the front. But I pushed through the crowd, and I went to the back to the steps that go to the chutz in the corner of 770. In the meantime, the Rebbe had already gone upstairs, gone out the front door, gone into the sukkah. Now, I didn't know where in the sukkah the Rebbe is saying the sicha. I had no idea. I came from the back of the sukkah, like from the union side, and there were, there were like tables blocking the entrance to the sukkah. So I klich under the table, and I hear the Rebbe's voice, and I come up from under the table, and I see Rav Kadakov. So I right away went right under the table again. But the Rebbe stood on that table. That was like the stage. So I was able to hear the whole sicha. It was a short sicha.

1:37:47 Speaker 6 So Rebbe stood by union?

1:37:48 Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah.

1:37:49 Speaker 6 Rebbe walked all the way to there.

1:37:50 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:37:52 Speaker 6 There are steps for the Rebbe to go up.

1:37:53 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm. Yeah.

1:37:55 Speaker 6 So-

1:37:55 Speaker 1 Not always, and, uh, they tried one year to do it in the front. I, I don't know. I... But that was the only time the Rebbe-

1:38:00 Speaker 6 So you're about to pop up right in front of the Rebbe, basically.

1:38:02 Speaker 1 No, the Rebbe stood a little bit further to the left, but right next to Kadakov. So I, I don't know, "Oh, the Rebbe is here." So I right away ducked back under the table, but I was able to hear the whole sicha. And then I went to Kotlansky's house for Sugas Yom Tov in the sukkah. So, Ramaysha, uh, asked me if, uh, if I can chazar Rebbe from the sicha. Everybody tried to... Who heard the sicha? Who heard? So I, I chazared the sicha from the shul. And, and then I said, "And then the Rebbe said in the, in the sukkah." Everybody's looking at me like, "How do you know what the Rebbe said in the sukkah?" Like, like That, that was a funny experience. Yeah.

1:38:42 Speaker 6 Um, was the Chazzara, was this stuff ever formalized? Did you ever do anything-

1:38:48 Speaker 1 No

1:38:48 Speaker 6 ... with Chazzara? Like, Hanoch, he wrote stuff like that?

1:38:50 Speaker 1 Yeah. That, that was for Tkuf eight weeks. There's a shliach in Florida, Reb Shmuel Mann. So, Rabbi Ephraim Demkhovsky wrote the RAD, the Rosh HaDvarim.

1:39:04 Speaker 6 You're talking about when? Nun Alef?

1:39:05 Speaker 1 Nun Alef, Nun Beis. And he wrote a good, the, the RAD was excellent. But the RAD was in resembling Kodesh. So some Bachrim in Alef Teitel felt... Rebbe Ephraim Demkhovsky also was a Bach in Alef Teitel. He was in Shir Dalet, I was in Shir Beis. But, uh, in Nun Beis I was in Shir Gimel. He already... He left then. I don't remember. Um, but we felt the, the geschmacke eysies in Yiddish, sometimes resembling Adav, we wanna preserve that. So it was Shmuel, Shmuel Kiman and Eliyahu Zaklikowski and Rav Bruin from Crown Heights and myself. We would get together Mottai Shabbos. So the choizrim was, uh, Rav Bruin and me, and, uh, Eliyahu Zaklikowski also remembered eysies. Reb Shmuel Mann was more the Ruach HaChaya resembling Fanon, to type it and print it and copies and sell the copies to the Bachrim. Hanoch Protis built imuge. For eight weeks we did that.

1:40:13 Speaker 6 Who, who was writing it?

1:40:16 Speaker 1 Uh, Rav Berin.

1:40:16 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:40:17 Speaker 1 Yeah. Would write it, and I would make my hagos, and Eliyahu Zaklakovski threw in some hagos.

1:40:23 Speaker 6 It's very-

1:40:24 Speaker 1 And, and, uh, till it became a Davor Shalom, we knew that he became s- an official Zach when Pasha's body, the Rebbe spoke about Saddam Hussein, and then the Rebbe said to take it out of the Hanoch, not to print it.

1:40:39 Speaker 6 Because the Rebbe said that Saddam-

1:40:41 Speaker 1 So Leibel Groner was working on tracking down those few bochrim, all the toyer bochrim. He needed to tell them also, "Don't write it up." We had written it up, a peyo, but we didn't type it, we didn't publish it. Only in later years it was found and typed up and, and discovered.

1:41:01 Speaker 6 You wanna say, you wanna say what-

1:41:03 Speaker 1 Huh?

1:41:03 Speaker 6 You wanna say it?

1:41:04 Speaker 1 Nah, just sh- sh- what am you doing? You'll find it on the different, uh, websites that have all these, uh, Hanochs and there's a... You can find it over there. Um, and it was those Shabbosim were grad, a good Shabbosim to do that, 'cause there was a certain individual who was Mekatrik on Am Yisroel in that winter of Nun Alef, so the Rebbe-

1:41:28 Speaker 6 During the, during the Gulf War

1:41:29 Speaker 1 ... sharp eisius on a sort of a tavis. But then for the next three Shabbosim, Wei Chi, Schmoys, Voero, the Rebbe had gefeiert. And, you know, the, the Rebbe's tzav on the kitruk was immense. And from the point, from the place where I stood by farbrengen, actually, we were able to see how the Rebbe's hands were moving during the sicha. Bechalal, the Rebbe sat usually-- There are exceptions that I wasn't there, but I heard different times during the Pascha Sforim and other times the Rebbe put his hands on top of the table. But usually it was under the table. But throughout the sicha, the entire sicha, the Rebbe had his hands on his legs close to his knees, and the Rebbe had, like, this rhythm that he would bang his legs. The entire sicha.

1:42:26 Speaker 6 You could see this?

1:42:27 Speaker 1 You could-- I could see that the whole time as a... I don't know if this is visible on the camera. The Rebbe-

1:42:33 Speaker 6 You see sometimes the tablecloth moving.

1:42:35 Speaker 1 Yeah. Yeah, right. Because the Rebbe would do that.

1:42:38 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm.

1:42:38 Speaker 1 Yeah. But sometimes the Rebbe made other tnuas. One time was during that sicha, I don't remember now which, which of the three Shabbosim this was. The Rebbe said, "Rahmano liitzlan, a boss over Adam, zoktem Eibeshem vasutan. What the Eibeshe does, macht shidduchim." I, I, I think it was Voero, maybe it was Boye, I, I don't, I don't remember. Um, but when the Rebbe said these words, "Rahmano liitzlan, a boss over Adam, zok- zoktem Eibeshem vasutan." So the Rebbe under the table, "Rahmano liitzlan, a boss over Adam, zoktem Eibeshe-" You're able to see that from anybody who stood behind and from the side, you were able to see that. Another thing that the Rebbe, the entire farbrengen, the Rebbe would not sit leaning on the back of the chair. By tefillas, yeah, and also after farbrengen in the summer, Pirkei Avos, after Mincha, the Rebbe would sit down, the Rebbe would lean back more on the chair. But farbrengen, the Rebbe would sit on mamash the edge of the chair. Now, you try to sit like that for a little while. It's not so easy, especially a whole farbrengen, and at the Rebbe's age in those years, Nun Alef, Nun Bet. So under the table, there was a footrest. But on the footrest, the Rebbe's knees and shins were resting because the Rebbe sat forward on the edge of the tab- on, of the chair, so his legs were, like, resting against that footrest. One Shabbos, I don't remember now which Shabbos it is, the Rebbe

1:44:16 Speaker 1 mentioned in the sicha, "Hashamayim kisah v'aretz hadem raglay." Toych kedei, the Rebbe's saying that. The Rebbe's lifting up one leg, putting it on the footrest. "Aretz hadem raglay." It's the-- These are things that you were able to see from that vantage point. It's so interesting. And now I, I'm talking, talking. Um, Shabbos Bereishit, Nun Alef. It was Shemini Atzeret Simchat Torah was Thursday, Friday, and then Shabbos, Shabbos Bereishit. It was two farbrengens. At the second farbrengen, I think after the first sicha, I don't know, maybe after the second sicha, the Rebbe took out his glasses from the pocket and opened up the siddur, and the Rebbe put on his glasses. I right away saw the Rebbe's opening up to Bnei HaChalah, and I thought, "Because I'm a Bnei HaChalah take it." Yeah. Talking about that Shabbos, all the geschmakis ikar. Two days, Shemini Atzeret Simchat Torah, by the Rebbe, Hakafes. Friday, day Hakafes. It's a... The next morning, Shabbos Bereishit, it's Shas Mon Bocho. Dach zogen Tehillim. You know, at that point, how many people were still- The Rebbe, of course, ach dreysik Tehillim. The Rebbe walked into the shul. If there were two hundred and fifty people in the shul, that's a lot. It was empty. The shul was empty. The whole back of the shul was empty. Everybody stood in front near the Aron Kodesh, crowding around there, waiting for the Rebbe to enter. I s- happened to stand near the, um, n- near the Bima of Krias Hatorah. I stood over there.

1:46:02 Speaker 1 The Rebbe came in, the whole back of the shul is empty. The Goyim were so busy cleaning up, so they turned over be- uh, benches and whatever they were cleaning up. On the side, now they broke through there. There used to be bathrooms downstairs.

1:46:16 Speaker 7 Under the

1:46:17 Speaker 1 Yeah, under the . And in front of the bathrooms, there was like a hall, and there were like doors. So in front of those doors, there was a bench, and there was a big thing with coffee and an open box or two open boxes of mazes that Vatsu the Schlemi used to put out. The Rebbe walked in. It was quiet in the shul. Yeah, in the front, a few guys started singing, but it was, everybody was . Be, be, you know, be happy you made it, eight-thirty Tellem. Everybody was so exhausted after two days of . So the singing was like very-

1:46:55 Speaker 7 Subdued

1:46:56 Speaker 1 ... subdued. And the Rebbe walked in. The Rebbe wasn't . The Rebbe was looking around, looking at the Goyim cleaning. Then the Rebbe looked at the coffee and the mazes as he was walking away into the shul, checking out the s- the scene. And the Rebbe kept on walking, and even he came to the front. He wasn't . The Rebbe went up the stairs, put down his Tellem, and then the Rebbe turned around, and the Rebbe was like just a few times, but basically waking up the whole Tellem. Yeah. I, I felt that Rebbe gave up a s- a for all those that actually made it to Tellem on time -

1:47:36 Speaker 7 They got something

1:47:37 Speaker 1 ... you know, got something special. A special, uh... That was a beautiful experience. Another thing that I remember, uh, tnuis under the table was, uh, it was Shabbos . The Rebbe finished one of the sickers with, "How are you? like, like in Kippur." And Rebbe was counting with his fingers under the table, like closing one thing-

1:48:01 Speaker 7 Counting

1:48:02 Speaker 1 ... another, counting like the, the way Rebbe would count. And, uh, oh, but again, uh, under the table, the majority of Tellem didn't see that. That's just another anecdote.

1:48:12 Speaker 7 Rebbe said, uh, like, "Unhavaya," no? "Unhavaya?"

1:48:16 Speaker 1 Unhavaya. Not e- every time, yeah.

1:48:18 Speaker 7 Uh, sometimes, yeah. Some of the times, I think.

1:48:20 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:48:21 Speaker 7 Um, I have a question about the, the sickers. Um, so you come El Tof Shenun. So I guess that's when you're there and listening to all the sickers, you know, live.

1:48:32 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

1:48:33 Speaker 7 The signing changed a lot those years.

1:48:36 Speaker 1 Right.

1:48:36 Speaker 7 Like, I mean, I mean, I know myself that I can watch and listen to farbrengens. It's a lot more challenging to follow the sickers now than the days you, you maybe could-

1:48:50 Speaker 1 Sure

1:48:50 Speaker 7 ... a lot, maybe explain that a little bit and also-

1:48:52 Speaker 1 So first of all, the seder that existed before Mem Chez with every farbrengen had a Rashi sikher, a Pikaveh sikher, a Rambam sikher, Ha'ores, Natan Sa'ores. That whole seder stopped before I came already. I mean, I remember that from my childhood visits by the Rebbe, but Tof Shenun, that was already not the case for a few y- for a while. Um, the Shabbos farbrengens were a little bit more, how should I say? A weekday sikher someti- because y- you can only listen to a weekday sikher. You can't listen to a Shabbos sikher, right? There was no more, uh, I meant a farbrengen sikher. There were no more fa- weekday farbrengens after Chabeishvat Mem Chez. And, um, so by farbrengen, it wasn't exactly like the weekday sikhers. It have a bit more structure, but it was similar, at least at times, where the Rebbe would... My father called it the Rebbe speaking in telegram style. Like, "Avot, Avot," and you need to be able to connect to get the... And the Rebbe would repeat in the sikher tons of times, "Kimdu bakam apam, kimdu basadas hakidemas." And indeed, if you look back in sikhers from all the years, you understood better what the Rebbe's points are. The Rebbe is building on top of Kol Teyre Hasiddis and all his farbrengens from the years before. But it was a bit challenging to follow those sikhers. It, it was difficult to, like, get a whole sikher.

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1:52:24 Speaker 6 Um, I saw that, um, uh, I learned all the Hanachos.

1:52:28 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

1:52:29 Speaker 6 Now from the base, like, uh, the facts of Sicha, the, the Mechavski. So I can't compare the Shabbosim, but I've seen the weekday. What they'll do is they'll add like a line, "Vapiza yuvan," like just like-

1:52:44 Speaker 1 Right, connecting words

1:52:45 Speaker 6 ... just, yeah, just adding a li- a three word-

1:52:46 Speaker 1 To give it, to lend it some more structure.

1:52:48 Speaker 6 Right, just a, just a, so you understand what the Rebbe is trying to do with the flow.

1:52:52 Speaker 1 Right. Right.

1:52:52 Speaker 6 Yeah, basically.

1:52:53 Speaker 1 Right. So Shabbos Fabrengen, you also had to do it, but a little bit less. The Rebbe's, because the Rebbe sat down for a Fabrengen, and the Rebbe sp-spoke longer, uh, a weekday Sicha sometimes was 10 minute, 15 minute, 20 minute. Uh, a Fabrengen was a half an hour. Sometimes it was short Sichas on Shabbos also, but the Rebbe spoke a little bit more Oisgeret, but still it was challenging to halt, cup, and remember everything. Um, and oftentimes, Taker also to push to understand. Um, sometimes, you know, I was able to repeat what the Rebbe said. Not necessarily did I go, "Okay, so what's the connection? What's, uh..." Later in the week when, when the Mugdei HaSicha came out, so okay. So that gave it more, of course, it was Mugde, it was, uh, more structure to the Sicha. But there were exceptions. There were exceptions. Um, I remember Chamishas B'Shvat, Tav Shenun Beis, that was a weekday Sicha, and the Rebbe spoke like years before, the Rebbe explained each one, the Sheva Saminim, the Pratiis, and Aveida. So that was like, and also the last Fabrengen.

1:54:04 Speaker 6 Vayakel.

1:54:04 Speaker 1 Vayakel, the first Sicha was over an hour, and the Rebbe spoke, "Mamesh, built up, Mesuda." Now, there's a built-in Mugde HaNocha, of course, of that Sicha, and the Rebbe Taker spoke that way. It, it was like-

1:54:20 Speaker 6 When you read the Hanacha-

1:54:21 Speaker 1 ... very unusual-

1:54:22 Speaker 6 Yeah

1:54:23 Speaker 1 ... to suddenly hear a Sicha, a Fabrengen. It was an amazing experience to, to be by such a Fabrengen. Um, you know, as, as the Mekablem, you know, would have loved if all the Sichas were that way. But yeah, the Teyre, the Rebbe gives Teyre, that's the Shechinim D'Abeis M'Tehikeh Leinei, and that's it, you know. That's how it, how it is.

1:54:47 Speaker 6 On the other hand, all of a sudden, in those years, there's certain Inyanim that the Rebbe spoke, like, very clear. It's flat like the Inyanim Mashiach, like the Rebbe spoke, like, very, very to the point, very, very-

1:55:02 Speaker 1 Right

1:55:02 Speaker 6 ... like very strong Asius at the-

1:55:05 Speaker 1 Yeah

1:55:05 Speaker 6 ... at the sa- at the same time. I see usually in the, those Hanachos, those-

1:55:08 Speaker 1 Yeah, the Rebbe didn't speak up as-

1:55:10 Speaker 6 No, but so like, no, sometimes the Rebbe could start explaining an Inyan Chassidis, and it's like without the whole Herchava.

1:55:19 Speaker 1 Right.

1:55:20 Speaker 6 I mean, that, that, that if you don't know the Chassidis-

1:55:22 Speaker 1 Right

1:55:22 Speaker 6 ... it's ha- it's hard to just-

1:55:23 Speaker 1 Like Rosh Chodesh Kislev, coming to Rosh Chodesh Kislev, uh, Nun Beis. It was a weekday Sicha, and Rebbe spoke Tifeh Inyanim Chassidis, you know. At, at the time, until I heard Reb Yael explain what the Rebbe, you know, it was hard to, to understand. Tifeh Inyanim, that the Rebbe was Megalleh Dafke in Tav Shenun Beis.

1:55:43 Speaker 6 Right. And then all of a sudden when it comes to the Inyanim-

1:55:44 Speaker 1 Hayet of the Nesius.

1:55:45 Speaker 6 Right, and Inyanim Mashiach are very clear. I mean, I don't know, take, uh, the most famous example, Chaf Ches Nissan, Tav Shenun Alef.

1:55:52 Speaker 1 Yeah.

1:55:53 Speaker 6 Every child can understand what the Rebbe's saying, right? Like-

1:55:56 Speaker 1 Sure, yeah.

1:55:57 Speaker 6 So.

1:55:58 Speaker 1 You're saying Chaf Ches Nissan. Also Chaf Ches Sivan, the Rebbe spoke about, "Dos ken zich neside reinu v'inshin," that Beit Hamikdash should come down and be Mislabesh here, and from here going to Eretz Yisroel. These are Asius. Later, that became the bosses of the Kuntres Beit HaBeit Hamikdash above all. But I remember hearing the words from the Rebbe that Neside Reinu, I don't remember the exact words now, but that Neside Reinu Yisroel meg, uh, ken zich v'inshin and a peyot and a fier teys, as Beit Hamikdash Hashlishit should first come down here and be Mislabesh in 770, and from here go to, uh, Eretz HaKodesh. I mean, this, you would think a, a Chassid by a Fabrengen Shpet Banacht, uh, drik tzeches epes, to hear the Rebbe say azaltchet Asius, that, that was amazing. That was indeed very, very unique.

1:56:54 Speaker 6 I can imagine that after the Fabrengens, what most of the Olam picked up was those type of Asius that the Rebbe was using, and that was like the Kaf. Am I wrong? Am I right?

1:57:06 Speaker 1 No, most of the Olam first had to be chal hear what the Rebbe speak. Because the majority of the Olam in 770 couldn't hear the Rebbe.

1:57:15 Speaker 6 Nun Beis.

1:57:16 Speaker 1 Nun Beis, even Nun Alef. The, those that sat right in front of the Rebbe, a little bit to the side, and, and that was it. The whole side and the bleachers and, uh, they weren't able to hear the Rebbe. Sometimes the Rebbe raised his voice a bit, so they heard, or they heard words, they heard, uh, the end of a Sicha. They couldn't follow a Sicha at all on Shabbos. And, you know, Baruch Hashem, I didn't have the challenge, uh, to stand like that Fabrengen after Fabrengen. Uh, you know, of course, a Chassid, the Neshama held, and just looking at the Rebbe for those two hours, three hours. You know, of course, you stood by Fabrengen, Chassidische Bachurim, but I'm sure that this, this, this wasn't, uh, a pashut, uh, thing to come week after week, the Rebbe Fabrengen every single Shabbos, and not be able to hear.

1:58:10 Speaker 6 I heard from others your age that they started creating new places Then like under the tables and here.

1:58:17 Speaker 1 Right. Yeah.

1:58:17 Speaker 6 And one of them was telling me that the place that he created, he was only able to hear.

1:58:22 Speaker 1 Right.

1:58:22 Speaker 6 But that was, that was the decision.

1:58:23 Speaker 1 Right.

1:58:23 Speaker 6 Like, "I'm not going to see, but at least I could hear everything."

1:58:26 Speaker 1 Right.

1:58:27 Speaker 6 Then-

1:58:27 Speaker 1 "I'll see the Rebbe by davening. I'll see the Rebbe, you know, at other times, but the farbrengen, I wanna hear what the Rebbe is saying."

1:58:34 Speaker 6 So the Rebbe, because all the years when the Rebbe speaking on Shabbos, Rebbe projected-

1:58:40 Speaker 1 Stronger

1:58:40 Speaker 6 ... stronger. So the Rebbe didn't even do that bechaval.

1:58:43 Speaker 1 Yeah. Was, the Gashmius was, uh, more difficult. That's, that's the-

1:58:50 Speaker 6 But did Rebbe speak a little louder than, than, than a weekday or not necessarily?

1:58:55 Speaker 1 I, I can't know because in weekday there was a mic. Um, Tishrei, the Rebbe raised his voice more by the sichas that were Shabbos, Yom Tov farbrengens. The Rebbe made an effort because I remember there was bechaval more rash in overall 770 because there were more people. So automatically, there's like this, this hum over the crowd, so it didn't get as quiet as a stama Shabbos in Midnyar. Um, but I was still able to hear every word from the Rebbe. And, and, and the Rebbe, you were able to tell that the Rebbe is raising his voice, which reminds me, uh, Tosh Nan Baz, the Rebbe used to say the sichas such is in the front of the shul. So they wanted the Rebbe should sit, so they created a bridge from the front-

1:59:55 Speaker 6 That was the reason?

1:59:56 Speaker 1 To the middle.

1:59:56 Speaker 6 Or they wanted to be able to hear?

1:59:59 Speaker 1 That they wanted to hear is what they told the Rebbe.

2:00:02 Speaker 6 Mm-hmm. The kavannah was-

2:00:04 Speaker 1 Their, their chashuv was-- I mean, maybe the chashuv was both. The, uh, if the Rebbe stands in middle of the shul, then of course more people would hear. If the Rebbe standing in the corner, everybody's pushing towards the corner, but how many can hear? Um, if the Rebbe stands by his farbrengen place, so then-- But also the kavannah was that the Rebbe should maybe sit. So the Rebbe had then something by his foot and which I, I didn't know exactly what's going on. Later, I heard and found out things but, so they wanted the Rebbe should sit. So they created with, with plywood, a bridge from the front of the shul to the farbrengen bima. After the davening, the Rebbe walked across, and the Rebbe came to his place, and there was a chair there . So the Rebbe asked, "Where is the shtender?" The Rebbe didn't wanna sit down like a farbrengen. It wasn't farbrengen. It's a sicha. So the Rebbe ended up saying the sicha with supporting himself, holding his fist, yad of hakdeshim on the table, which actually made it difficult for the Rebbe. The, the, the Rebbe's knuckles turned white. You were able to see this was a strain. I, I, I stood mamash near the Rebbe, uh, like three, four people. Everybody stood close to them. Not, not like by farbrengen where there was more space. Everybody stood. You can see there's a, there's a video-

2:01:37 Speaker 6 Matzoh, matzoh-

2:01:37 Speaker 1 Matzoh Shabbos, matzoh Yom Tov. Everybody stood close. I, I stood very close, and I heard those sichas also, but I was able to see the whole time how the effect on the Rebbe's hands and that, that was, uh... The, the next night, they just brought, brought the shtender there, so the Rebbe said it already by a shtender. Um, yeah.

2:01:58 Speaker 6 Meanwhile, the next day, the Rebbe stood for hours watching everyone shake-

2:02:01 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:02:01 Speaker 6 The lulav and esrog.

2:02:02 Speaker 1 That was incredible. Bechaval, it came Sukkos in the morning, the Rebbe would come out, I don't remember exactly what time, 8:00, 8:15, 8:30, to shake lulav in the Sukkah. Then the Rebbe would give out, uh, ma'alot minim. So if you wanted to be there early so that you can be ten o'clock in the shul with the Rebbe, already shook the Rebbe's lulav. So, so there was a system with, with numbers. You, you got tickets. As, uh-

2:02:31 Speaker 6 Someone just sent me a picture of the-

2:02:32 Speaker 1 Of a number of a ticket.

2:02:34 Speaker 6 Of a ticket.

2:02:34 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:02:34 Speaker 6 And he sent me. It was, uh-

2:02:36 Speaker 1 So I, I stood online.

2:02:37 Speaker 6 It was a paper and a number that he had.

2:02:37 Speaker 1 I, I, I was from the first, uh-

2:02:39 Speaker 6 It was the-

2:02:39 Speaker 1 Hundred fifty, two hundred guys. So, so, so we stood, like, already in line, like by the Tashlich area, and then shushking is going around, "The Rebbe is there. The Rebbe is there." Nobody understood. "What do you mean the Rebbe is there?" We couldn't see. We were outside the Sukkah. "The Rebbe is there." And slowly, people, like, heard, "The Rebbe is standing there while people are going through." It was like, you know, Meanwhile, the next day, the Rebbe stood for hours watching everyone shake- Yeah.

2:04:06 Speaker 6 The lulav and esrog.

2:04:08 Speaker 1 That was incredible. Bechaval, it came Sukkos in the morning, the Rebbe would come out, I don't remember exactly what time, 8:00, 8:15, 8:30, to shake lulav in the Sukkah. Then the Rebbe would give out, uh, ma'alot minim. So if you wanted to be there early so that you can be ten o'clock in the shul with the Rebbe, already shook the Rebbe's lulav. So, so there was a system with, with numbers. You, you got tickets. As, uh-

2:04:16 Speaker 6 Someone just sent me a picture of the-

2:04:16 Speaker 1 Of a number of a ticket.

2:04:16 Speaker 6 Of a ticket.

2:04:16 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:04:16 Speaker 6 And he sent me. It was, uh-

2:04:16 Speaker 1 So I, I stood online.

2:04:16 Speaker 6 It was a paper and a number that he had.

2:04:27 Speaker 1 I, I, I was from the first, uh-

2:04:28 Speaker 6 It was the-

2:04:28 Speaker 1 Hundred fifty, two hundred guys. So, so, so we stood, like, already in line, like by the Tashlich area, and then shushking is going around, "The Rebbe is there. The Rebbe is there." Nobody understood. for Mincha. The Rebbe'd have Mincha with the hat- Tallis ... with the tallis. Very, the Rebbe writes, uh, there's a Yigras, uh, from the Rebbe about it, uh, Pi Kabbalah, Pi Ze'ir. The Rebbe'd have Mincha with the tallis. By the time it was over, it was like, like close to six o'clock. We-- everybody ran to make Kiddish and, uh, Chabad. Soon you had to come back already for Ma'ariv, second night of Yom Tov. That, that was a... So all those Chevre that came and shook the lulav at eleven, at twelve, at one, uh, yeah, I was done. Yeah, I was out to shook lulav at nine o'clock. Had a whole day. Yeah, sat in the sukkah and learned Cheitas and Rambam and Tamim and Hasicha. You didn't know when is this going to end? When is the Rebbe gonna go down? To, to start davening before the Rebbe wasn't- What was the Rebbe saying then? No, n- Nothing. It was just- It was a fact. A fact, that's it. Because people, in hindsight, people, uh- Hindsight ... say- But at the time, nobody. People started saying, you know, that in the earlier years, that was actually- The Seder ... the Seder. Pe- so, so, so that I heard some of the older Chassidim talk about that, that he used to

2:06:30 Speaker 1 go into the Rebbe's sukkah and shook lulav. Okay, fine, but, uh, but that's not the Seder for years. Now, what happened now? Even then, it wasn't like this. It wasn't like that the Rebbe stood and watched everybody. The Rebbe stood and, and, and learned Tamim. The Rebbe did other things. The Rebbe didn't watch the Chassidim shake lulav. But while those years, now from the base, when you look and when you watch the videos and you... There seems to be like a, a, an urgency by the Rebbe. Uh, uh, but were you able-- Is that the way you were feeling then? Or this was an, uh, we all know in hindsight, we can see- No, not only in hindsight. Uh, look, many people didn't pay attention to certain things. Uh, anybody who had a little bit sechel, anybody who had a little bit of halakhish felt uneasy. It's not like, not like worried, but the, there were some things that were unusual. L'mashal, the Rebbe, Shmini Atzeres, said a sicha after Ma'ariv. L'il Shmini Atzeres. The Rebbe said, the tei shnas, irev, bracha, like Erev Yom Kippur, Shmini Atzeres. And the Rebbe said, "Shnas by peh, shnas peh, dibur be peh." Like shnas peh, like, like that, that wasn't usual. The peh stood for shnas pedus, right? Uh, well, shnas peh, dibur be peh. Like, now, of course, that we didn't understand at the time. That only chazal know the, when the dibur was affected, we chapped then about that. But already at the time was

2:08:16 Speaker 1 like, "What does that mean?" Like, "What is that?" That was... Now, I didn't hear the sicha because I stood at my hakafot's place already, which was closer to the center of the shul, to see the first and second hakafot. But afterwards, chazal, I, I heard what the Rebbe said, and I'm like, "Eh, not sure what it is." Eh, shnas peh. Nobody knew exactly how to explain it, but that's what the Rebbe said. Then later, Gimmel Shevat, the Rebbe said the sicha about the dibur from the sidureinu, medaf mashlim zein. So the Rebbe was dragging his foot a bit, uh, schlepping, uh, a full Siyum, the תקופה. So the Rebbe's talking about the gezunt of... The Rebbe, maybe that's what, uh, what it is. People right away said that? So, so yeah, yeah. Bochurim in all the Teddy, we, uh, Levi Hazima, and, uh, Tamula, and Chaza and the Rebbe's my modern baal peh. We got an answer from the Rebbe for it. There was a, there was a, a, a eis eiderus, mot kedez- Wasn't there also a thing about, uh, about duchas of, uh, Psus Teves then? I think. I don't remember exactly what, um- Mm-hmm. Yeah. But, um, the whole winter of Nun Bais, starting already from Shabbos Meyach. Shabbos Meyach, the Rebbe spoke about the hidur in Kiddush Levanah. And one of the inyanim of Kiddush Levanah that the Rebbe stressed is that it says, "Gule fa gezunt." And the Rebbe started using the term, "Hanshome bria be guf bari bli hefsek

2:09:59 Speaker 1 ben timen." Now, the Rebbe started saying that one farbrengen, another farbrengen, a third, like, what is this? Every farbrengen, the Rebbe's, the Rebbe Poshut started talking about neshama bria be guf bari bli hefsek ben timen again and again. You know, i-if somebody just didn't think and didn't listen, he didn't realize, but Chassidim started being concerned about that. There was a concern. And then came the sicha of Gimmel Shevat, so that just raised the antenna. And then came Cheder Shadar. The Rebbe started speaking almost every single night, Kip- Poshut, Kipshuti. And what was the Rebbe saying? Every night, the Rebbe spoke about shishim yom, mevatlim daron bilter tzumim, neshama bria be guf bari bli hefsek ben timen. At that point, uh, you had to be mamesh dull not to realize that there is epes, that there's daron bilter tzumim that need to be nisbatel. Now- Nobody expected Chavzain Odar to happen. No, bechal, everybody was living with the shturem, Otot Kum Mashiach. Yeah, the whole, yeah, at the same time the Rebbe's speaking with Mashiach like this. So, so, so we, we didn't think that chas v'shalom something's gonna happen to the Rebbe and, and this and that, uh, because, you know, Mashiach kommt. But le'idach gise, bis to der krechme, till Mashiach comes bepeyo, vais dais that there are some menis ve'kuvim. Now, we were aware that the Rebbe's gezunt is not perfect. We have the foot and this and that. So, you know, the Rebbe would come into shul, and sometimes the Rebbe would,

2:11:42 Speaker 1 like, sway a little bit as he was walking. Uh, so it was visible. You were able to see certain things. So, okay. So the Rebbe is talking about, uh, our goofbody. Nobody expected the, what happened in Chavzain Odar, but, but that there was an unease and that something is in the air, yeah, Chassidim picked up, picked up on that at the time. So, at mangamachtah shturem, kiddush lavanah, mangamachtah shturem, the Rebbe's teyre, and chazun de mei morim. So there was a, a, a big shturem. Um, Chavzain Odar happened, so, so that's when we realized, okay, that, that's- You were here that whole tzukufah after Chavzain Odar? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So- I, I went on shlichas to Brinois in Tov Shenon Beis, Cheshvenon Beis. Uh, we actually got dollars from the Rebbe. Rabbi Yudel Krinsky asked the Rebbe that the kvutza is going on shlichas to Brinois. He came out, he gave us dollars for each of us. We, we went on shlichas the night when the Rebbe came out the last time on the porch. So that, that's when we flew to Brinois. That- So Nun Dalet. Nun Dalet. Chesh- Beginning of Nun Dalet. Nun Dalet, yeah. So what do you wanna say about that, uh, tzukufah? The Yadzus say what he say, and we have a Rebbe. No, I'm saying- There isn't much, uh... Which tzukufah? When we went on shlichas? No, after, no, after Chavzain Odar. After Chavzain Odar. After Chavzain Odar, magazok tilim, um, mat gelantem Rebbe's teyre with a special, you

2:13:37 Speaker 1 know, chalukis, uh, uh, teyras rabenu. Uh, all the yeshivas together, we made a magaloi lomi, and, yeah, all kinds of things like that. Matzich gekocht in Rebbe's yoni, miftzoim, yiralef nissen, Tishim Shana was- With- So, so from beforehand was already building up Tishim Shana. So, so it still happened. There was a big parade, uh, tanks, uh, and, uh, we made, uh... Personally, I worked, uh, together with, uh, Eli Nassen Silverberg on the kevetz, uh, Oloteile. So it was a nice sefer that, uh, came out. I remember we worked through the night to have it ready for yiralef nissen. Also the years before, we made, uh, sefarim. But, you know, these were the things that mat gelept, uh, and it added a special shturem, uh, because far lem's gezunt. Everything is done far lem's gezunt. I, I don't know how controversial I should go, but, uh, uh, da fled in, in, in gute zachen, in toychndige yoniym. Yeah. What, what was the Rebbe's expectation of, of a Chasid, of a bochur in Temchetimim? I remember in the, in the tzukufah that winter of Nun Beis, starting already from Chavzain, from Chavches Nissan in Nun Alef, and the shturem of Mashiach started, as they say. So there, there were a lot of, uh, you know, ideas in yoniym, uh, and Kabbalas HaMalchus that you have to write into the Rebbe, that you're accepting the Rebbe as a melech, Melech HaMashiach. So, Oloteile was also getting into that. There was a whole tamule made that one night all

2:15:38 Speaker 1 the bochurim should come with Bigdei Shabbos, and, uh, there's gonna be drashes from different mashpiyim, and everybody's gonna together sign a Kabbalas HaMalchus. I remember beshaite that there was Rabbi Sorrel Friedman and also Rabbi Galitsky, Hagashed, Langiel, uh, they were uncomfortable with that. It's like a mashmalon. A fremder mensch writes to the Rebbe, a stammer person wants to write he's Mekabel the Chasid. Of course, you're a Chasid. What, you Mekabel the Rebbe's mashech, and, and yesterday you, you weren't? He wasn't your melech. Like- Like what changed that we- Like what changed? That we need to do this? It's, it's, he felt that not only that this is not something appropriate, it's, it's like bad, it's a chutzpah to write to the Rebbe. What are you writing to the Rebbe such a thing? You Mekabel him as a melech. Gut moribim. Uh, it, it was like, uh, as young bochurim, uh, ah, what do they understand? What do they? But, um, lemaysa, there was this big tamule, and everybody was all excited, and mat geshibn, and gechazmed, and Kabbalas HaMalchus. And then nothing. They were, they were looking and waiting. Is the Rebbe gonna be Mashiach? They wrote to the Rebbe, "Duch mot geshiben, mot-" the holy yeshiva got together, and there was a big fabrengen, the Mot Geret wegen dem teichner inyen, and then this, and everybody that... No answer. Eh, Rebbe Nachman went every day to Leibel's office. "Nu, sh'doft san anfer?" No answer. No, no answer. And there was no answer. There was

2:17:31 Speaker 1 no Mashiach from the Rebbe today. You look in how the Rebbe spoke with the whole shtum of Mashiach, darkach Sidas don't change. W- what's motzek from a Chosid? What's motzek from a bocher in Temimim? Right after Chofzei- Chofches Nissan, already the Rebbe answer, I think was to Chaim Goodnick. The, the, "I spoke clear by fabrengen." This was even before the Rebbe said to learn in Yan Gul Mashiach. Well, Torah and mitzvahs. There's, this is no, a new Torah and mitzvahs. Met latakis eitzes. What's, what were you gonna do to bring Mashiach? It doesn't mean to, the, we need to come up with one more gimmick, and that's gonna bring Mashiach. I remember Yashver once spoke- Yeah ... when I was in Yeshivat Mariston, and they had questions and answers. And it was a whole community there, so there was men and women, obviously- Yeah ... the, the nishrit. Yeah. But they were, they were sending, there were questions being sent in. Yeah. So one of the women sent in a question that the Rebbe said a sicha, Chofches Nissan, "Do all you can to bring Mashiach." So what, uh, s- and what, what else is left? And she's ask- Mm-hmm. So your, your shver said, "Torah and mitzvahs." Yeah. So- Borshe kivanti. But, but where did I see that strong? So I, I, I was close to Rav Galitsky, zal zei gezunt un stark. Uh, I was working on Ha'Otos Ha'Biyurim, um, which reminds me a cute thing. At one fabrengen, the Rebbe mentioned about

2:19:04 Speaker 1 Gal Yisroel that w- we don't say Amen because that's the mismach gulale tefillah. So, and the best way how to accomplish that is if you conclude Gal Yisroel, if the chazan concludes it quietly, so then there's no answering Amen. So somebody wrote in Ha'Otos Ha'Biyurim, "If that means that we need to change our minhag," the Rebbe said this by fabrengen Shabbos, about minhag Chabad is that the chazan- Says ... says it loud- Say it with the chazan ... just nobody answers Amen, we start Shmoneh Esrei. We say it with the chazan, huh? Say it with the chazan, yeah. So I remember I, I was a chaver haMoreches, so I wrote Ha'Otos Ha'Moreches, that what the Rebbe said, uh, uh, I'm thinking about it now, uh, ha chuchak ha'bocher. The, the Rebbe is good chance gonna see this because the Rebbe would read the Ha'Otos. Ich ge schreiben in Ha'Otos what the Rebbe meant. But, yeah, I, I, I was young and I didn't have so much, uh... So I wrote, uh, it had to pass Rav Galitsky's, uh, approval. So I wrote that, that what the Rebbe said by fabrengen doesn't mean that the minhag changes because of that. The Rebbe was talking in concept. So this inyen, the best way how to accomplish it is it's not our minhag. But, but bayal, if the chazan says it quietly, then you, you cannot- Facts, you say ... answer Amen. Yeah. That's just, you know, it's, it's an inyen gerert. So I remember Rav Galitsky is

2:20:41 Speaker 1 looking at, "Yeah, okay." Yeah, he let it go, and it was printed that way in Ha'Otos. There was no isias from the Rebbe or anything, but just I'm thinking back to that today, you know. On the other hand, though, the Rebbe did say, let's say, Chay Sara Numbays. The Rebbe said that it must be that there's something different that we need to do- Oh, so, so- ... that we didn't do till now ... so, so, so gal nimit in takidis nekude. So the, the Rebbe spoke to bochurim, exclusively to bochurim. When? Yechi Dus Latmimim, after Tishrei. You would think, you would expect that whole summer, the Rebbe, Shabbos after Shabbos, shtum vegen Mashiach, and into Numbays as well. And now he's talking to the bochurim. Now, you would expect that for the bochurim also he's gonna talk, uh, so boch- Mashiach for bochurim. What was the Rebbe talking to the bochurim about? For half an hour, long yechi dus. Torah. Unusual. A half an hour the Rebbe's talking about Limud HaTorah, nigleh mit pilpul de-dereisa to the extent as mecholem chidushei Torah. What is the Rebbe want from a bocher in Tov Shenun Beis? Nothing else than what he wanted from the bocher in Tov Shen Yun and Yud Aleph and Yud Beis and Tov Shen Chof in our yon. What's, what is Mashiach? What is Mashiach? Some people have the, all kinds of images, childish images. They, that's what they imagine. Mashiach is gilul hakus. Mashiach is w- what does that mean? That's- Lehima

2:22:17 Speaker 1 da'ateira- Limud haTorah ... lehima da'ateira. Lehima savacha chami. Exactly. Uh, so from a bocher, bocher has no excuses. For him, straight Mashiach. Limud HaTorah dayem va-layla, im it nacht cholem tich Mashiach. Right. Even, even the Chay Sara Numbays, the Rebbe said that all of the inyanim- Oh ... should be permeated with the nekuda Mashiach. Exactly. But which inyanim? The- All, all of them. Exactly. Those- What did the Rebbe say about that fabrengen? The Rebbe's talking to shluchim. What? Mesaim lain the Chassidishe parshah every year. Torah, Likutei Torah. See, that's outdated. Lubavitcher Rebbe, what are you talking about? What are we, back in the chaf suddenly? There's no, Chassidus beitzach nish. There's the same Chassidus. If you want, you can see it in another inyen as well. The Rebbe in Nun Aleph Numbays, those who were here in those years, ha- have something That the Chassidim that were by the Rebbe in all the other years don't have. And that is a, a bookshelf of Kontreisim and Sfarim they got from the Rebbe. The Rebbe gave out a whole- Library ... library, Tanyas, Kitzurim V'orais, Mayim Arim of all the Rebbeim came out. Now, a Tanya, okay, Tanya But the Rebbe gave out his Kontreisim. The Rebbe said, "Kun tzeh tzeichaim." The Rebbe spoke Shabbas fabrengen that this is not meant to ju- just all liegen. Lil mid, how Menaslah says, yeah, Daf Led, what is Kun tzeh tzeichaim? Yichude Tato and Yichude Eloh, and, and, and how to implement that in our lives. And then

2:24:00 Speaker 1 some of the Mayim Arim, the Rebbe gave a Kontreis Mayim Arim Taf Resh Peh Beis. Three Mayim Arim of the Fridege Rebbe of Taf Resh Peh Beis, Tishrei Taf Shin, uh, Shoshana, Shabbos Shuva. These are deep Mayim Arim. Baruch Sha'asón Nissim Samech Daled, a Mayim from Rebbe Nishmat Zevin. That deep haskal dig Mayim Arim, even from the Rebbe's own Mayim Arim. You know, Ata Tetzaveh, that's, that's a Mayim Arim everyone can learn. Yeah. Chaf Ches Van Nun Beis, the Rebbe gave out Kontreis Chaf Ches. That's a Mayim from Taf Shin Lamed, Vayichay Esarah. This is a deep haskal dig Mayim Arim. This is a heavy-duty Mayim Arim. The Rebbe is giving this to Am Nosim, Nosim Vetaf. Chassidim anu bame. A Chassid learned Chassidus. There is no, there's no new Chassidus. There is no other Chassidus, and that is Mashiach. You learn the Rebbe's Torah, you learn that... Now, of course, I'm not saying that's, like they said about the Ketz in Taf Resh Ches, it's what's ... Of course, the Rebbe wanted Mashiach bepeil in Elemaz Al Atach, Lematmas Otfachim. But for a Chassid, that doesn't mean gimmicks. It means- You're saying, you're saying to bring Mashiach. Yeah, to bring Mashiach. This is how you bring Mashiach bepeil. So of course, you have to learn it yourself and live with it- The Rebbe did give- With Emes, with the giluy Elokut that you get from learning Chassidus. The Rebbe gave different, different, quote-unquote, eitzas- Yeah ... to hesem, hesem Mashiach, but they're all in

2:25:26 Speaker 1 Yanim. They weren't new. They were like, whatever, the Kochin Kidesh Havana, and d-different Yanim- Yeah, yeah. There is no new Torah. There's no new mitzvot. It's not a, not a new, it's not a- There is no ... map of Torah with, uh, Torah of Onodizin, right? Yeah. So obviously, learning in Yanim Gol Mashiach, we had a major Kochin that, and we sh- still do. You learn the Rebbe's Torah, the Rebbe gave out, this four sichas- The Malchus ... of Mashiach, the Malchus, which that in itself also the Rebbe is handing out the Dvar Malchus to everyone, which, uh, which obviously was also a big, uh... And, uh, and, but, but even those sichas, those sichas are tifa sichas. Yeah. And, and, and this is how we mekushé to the Rebbe. We have to learn the Rebbe's Torah, learn the Rebbe's sichas. And when you learn them correctly, you understand why we need Mashiach. So then when you meet another Yid, the Mashiach that you bring to another Yid is the Rebbe's Mashiach, not some fantasy Mashiach. Mashiach is giluy Elokut. Hey, the Mashiach is gonna come, oh, there's gonna be stuff growing on the trees. Yeah. The Rebbe talks about this in the sichas too, of course. But that, that's what, when it's Abu, like you quoted before, when it's Abu, El Aliyis P'num Yechatel, you have to be able to share that with another Yid. So the, first of all, you have to live that way yourself. Nafsham Ikah V'gufam Tafal. There, there's no

2:26:51 Speaker 1 shortcuts. The same Chassidus that existed for all the years from the Ba'al Shem Tov, from the Alter Rebbe, throughout all the generations of Nasi Hama, that same Chassidus is, and, and that is what the Rebbe expects from Bacharim, that's what the Rebbe expects from Anash. Leben Mitten Rebbe. So let me ask you, you, you were talking specifically to Bacharim or about Bacharim, but I know that you're also very involved with the Yungleit, 'cause you're, uh, you teach Hasanim- Mm-hmm ... and answer shailas. I myself learned, uh, in Yana Bayum. So what, what's like a, what's a message for Yungleit, those that are establishing families or, or, or have, raising- ... raising young families, Chulu? Same thing. Same message. You gotta live with the Rebbe. Mm. And there's another mekude, which I think is also very, very important, the Arum, the Arum of Chassidus. You know, knowing the Rebbe's Tildes Chayav. Baruch Hashem, today, you don't have to go digging. Everything's available. Gem, also the Her made available a lot of Pashet, the, the, the Our Days and, and the monthly magazine filled with, you know, Pashet, the Lach Luchis. The Lach Luchis, the Chassidus that had the Arum of Chassidus. But that a, a bocher or a yungerman should not be bochy in, in the early years. The, the book that Gem produced, which I hope they'll, they'll do a Chelek Sheini from the Chasam, uh, at least till Taf Shin Yud. Medav Ham, the, the Hamsach of the early years. But, you know, all

2:28:40 Speaker 1 this information that we didn't know. When, when I was a bocher, Yemei Melech came out. Yemei Melech, you know, was a lot of things. Some of it was based on something, some of it was just hearsay. It's hard to tell always. But, but, but of course, there's a lot of information there. It's started already. Rav Nissim Gordon interviewed Rav Tzion Chana and published in the Yiddish Heim, uh, the Lubavitcher Rebbe about the Rebbe's childhood and so on, that a Chassid davka wissen. Rav Nissim Memonov, um, he had all kinds of bocherim, Sephardische bocherim or Kanar bocherim that came to Brinwa. They, they, they didn't speak Yiddish. They didn't know, uh, Darka Chassidus. So he made a point that they all have to l- read through Likutei Diburim. You have to be bochy in Likutei Diburim. He said, he said, "Imagine an army. When they've taken soldiers, you need to know the history of the country you're fighting for. You have to, so you have to know the history." So that, so that you have to know Likutei Diburim. Other than that, every Chassid, a Chassid should not know the details of the Rebbe's life and, uh, in the, in the years of the Nasiyas for sure, but even before Nasiyas. I said, "Se dein tatte, the Rebbe. Y- y- you don't know where he was, wh- wh- where he was born, where he traveled, what years, what were his activities in his bocherishe jaren after the chasanah? H-how can you not know these things? This,

2:30:18 Speaker 1 this is your Rebbe. So I think that these things are very, very important, and especially that today you don't have to go looking for it. It's all available, nicely packaged, easily available. That, that is very important, besides for learning the Rebbe's teachings.

2:30:33 Speaker 8 Yeah, I would say also that, um, there's obviously learning the Rebbe's teaching that, that goes without a question. If you're a you know Rebbe.

2:30:42 Speaker 1 Mm-hmm.

2:30:43 Speaker 8 Um, but there's another part to this. There's the, the and, you know, just the basic facts which that taket the her and jem and other places that you can have access to it. But another thing which is similar is also like what the Rebbe has to say about certain topics. And so I-

2:31:02 Speaker 1 Yeah. Knowing the Rebbe's Hashkafes.

2:31:03 Speaker 8 Yeah, Hashkafes. I, I know you-- Something that we worked together with you on was when we wrote an article, um, about family planning.

2:31:12 Speaker 1 Correct.

2:31:12 Speaker 8 Or lack of family planning, about having large Mishpachas.

2:31:15 Speaker 1 Yeah, the Rebbe's view. Um

2:31:16 Speaker 8 The Rebbe's view on it, yeah.

2:31:17 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:31:18 Speaker 8 And I remember, I remember when we were creating it, I remember, I remember even for myself, which I'm, I'm the one that's, you know-

2:31:27 Speaker 1 Doing the dirt

2:31:28 Speaker 8 Doing, doing it. But like, I'm like, it helped me have a be-better understanding. And I watched the before and I knew about it. Yeah, but you have it packaged and fresh and the whole thing from beginning to end is like it, it, it-

2:31:38 Speaker 1 I remember at the time-

2:31:40 Speaker 8 Mm-hmm

2:31:40 Speaker 1 ... that you guys got some flak for it, and I, I was saying then, "What do you mean? This is how-"

2:31:46 Speaker 8 We got flak because some people felt that it's not-

2:31:48 Speaker 1 That it's not appropriate-

2:31:49 Speaker 8 Appropriate for bachurim

2:31:50 Speaker 1 ... for bachurim to read.

2:31:50 Speaker 8 Right.

2:31:51 Speaker 1 And I said then, and you said, "I wrote that response then". Forty years before the Rebbe spoke about this, by far bringing in public, in front of bachurim and children, the Rebbe had no problem. So you wanna tell me that forty years later, the world , they're not kelim for this?

2:32:08 Speaker 8 Right.

2:32:09 Speaker 1 Um, LMA, they should only know what the street has to say about it. If they're not gonna learn about this, when they're not gonna read this in the Dehel, when they are bachurim, just like any topic in Yiddishkeit, in life, that a Hasid needs to know what's Dr. Rebbe weg in them, wh-when are you going to find out? When you're fifty?

2:32:30 Speaker 8 Right.

2:32:30 Speaker 1 You're not gonna find that. The, uh, yeah, this, learning never ends, and nobody should think that whatever they read i-in their bachur she years into Dehel, that's it, so now they know everything about the Rebbe. Of course, there's always more and more inside Yam She'ain Lo Sof. The Rebbe's teaching is like ממש Aruch HaMeir et Smiida, and it's, it's a pele godel. His stuff is coming out, new hagozh and new maines, and new these, uh... We're talking about already more than three decades after Gimel Tammuz, and there's constantly new inyonim nisgalle. The, the Rebbe, the Rebbe spoke in Taf Shin Yud. The The Rebbe schickt, the Rebbe schickt, Baruch Hashem. But a, a Hasid needs to know the Rebbe's views on topics now, now of Shleimus HaAretz, yeah. You hear Hasidim sometimes say things about Shleimus HaAretz. Pashut, it breaks the heart. The Rebbe the heart years and years. Pashut, literally, not a guzma. For hundreds of hours, the Rebbe by far bringing and the Rebbe's view of Shleimus HaAretz is one of the topics. There is so much from the Rebbe on it that a Hasid should say things that, pashut, are totally against the Rebbe's outlook. Um, he doesn't mean anything. He, pashut, is clueless.

2:33:54 Speaker 8 For example?

2:33:54 Speaker 1 There's no excuse for that. Uh, that's examples. But, uh, we can have another podcast on Shleimus HaAretz. But everybody knows, you know, people will repeat views that are written on websites or all kinds of other sources, and they'll, "Oh, that sounds... That makes sense," and they'll repeat it without even realizing, oh, uh, Lamashal, uh, talking now about, uh, uh, the latest news that America is paving the way for, for maybe in the future a Palestinian state. Okay, he says, "Meint garnicht. The Palestinians are not gonna behave anyway, so it's not, never gonna happen." That's not how the Rebbe view this. Even, uh, autonomy, the Rebbe said that just talking about that is a sakonna for Yidden. You know, how can a Lubavitcher say things that are ממש against the Rebbe's view? A-a-and by the way, the whole topic of Shleimus HaAretz, this is not a topic of emunah. You don't need... It's not like, "Oh, the Rebbe's view. Okay, so I, yeah, I'm, I'm moidin, uh, Chachamim Rab Meir. You know, I bow my head. The Rebbe said different. Okay." The Rebbe's shita, that's the only shita that makes sense. That's the only shita that-

2:35:20 Speaker 8 Especially-

2:35:21 Speaker 1 Especially-

2:35:22 Speaker 8 May-maybe then-

2:35:23 Speaker 1 Has been proven in the lab-

2:35:24 Speaker 8 Yeah. Right

2:35:25 Speaker 1 ... hundreds times over.

2:35:26 Speaker 8 Right. Maybe then-

2:35:26 Speaker 1 At this point, if anybody doesn't, you know, uh, uh, you still didn't get it, right? Unfortunately, there are many Yidden who didn't get it, but that Lubavitch Hasidim shouldn't get it? The Rebbe sat on hundreds of hours, and you don't bother to find out the Rebbe's views. And Baruch Hashem, there's many kelim today. There's, uh, there's, there's the, the sefar that put all the sichas together, the, the Kolasi V'ein Einer. There's, uh, this book from, uh, what's his name? Uh, Pearl made the book.

2:35:54 Speaker 8 Um, yeah, Make Peace.

2:35:55 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:35:55 Speaker 8 It says in English.

2:35:56 Speaker 1 And, and there's, there's plenty of resources. All you have to do is find out Make it your business to learn what is the Rebbe's Shit and Shlemus Aritz. And the Rebbe, why did the Rebbe speak about this? Why did the Rebbe speak in by Fabregen? You know, people have these weird, uh, Machshavis, weird questions like, what did the Rebbe think? He's gonna be spoiled by talking to Hasidim? You know, we don't need a Pesach Maise that somebody said, that Rebbe said, Make sure not to Of course, that's emes too. There's actually a that, that, that is the theme of the, of the personal, uh, you know, the, the you have to stand strong on, on your land. But, uh, but no, there's also teaching Everybody has to know that. What's, what's kind of question why the Rebbe spoke about this? And why the Rebbe s-screamed when he spoke about it? And why the Rebbe said himself, So, so a Hasid should like contemplate, is the Rebbe right? And like he-- Y-y-you don't begin to understand the Pashet you don't know. So there's no excuse for that.

2:37:15 Speaker 8 Right.

2:37:15 Speaker 1 That's why the Rebbe wanted also Igress to be printed. Why did the Rebbe want Igress to be printed? Eh, it's a mugge, the Mavei Cheleg Yubeis, and the Rebbe says, "Klavar." I mean, it was written by the, by Levin, but the Rebbe allowed this to be printed like that, like the Alter Rebbe wrote it, Tanya. Yeah. It's, um, so a Yungerman, you know, as a bachar, you get a lot of information, but you're still a bachar, a teenager, uh, in the mind to the bar mitzvah, say, sh-sh-makechen the galus, yeah, yeah, yeah, geshelem samakechen by bar mitzvah. Aber beneinu gered, maybe it's, uh, t-today's day and age, I don't know what, it takes a few more years for the minds to fully ripen. And, uh, the Maise in the teenage years, even a smart bachar, he learns a lot in this, but to really get it, I mean, aphil haboim shinin, koineshadai drava, aphil noch haboim shinin. We're not fully getting it. It is always, we always realize more inkin. So we have to continue learning, and there's always more that you don't know yet. But to Pashet know what the Rebbe's views on all kinds of topics, everyone has to have a kviut learning the Rebbe's Igress. Ev- you have to know. You have to know. And if you encounter a topic and you don't know what the Rebbe... So this mafteches, look it up, find out, ask somebody who knows. Don't start talking things that, that you heard on some radio show or

2:38:41 Speaker 1 some, uh, podcast-

2:38:42 Speaker 8 Right

2:38:43 Speaker 1 ... from, from, from the-

2:38:44 Speaker 8 And it's- And it's also not only-

2:38:46 Speaker 1 That's the Pashet of Sakonova. You can't stuff your head-

2:38:48 Speaker 8 If you're talking about-

2:38:49 Speaker 1 ... with Shitas Kaisves.

2:38:50 Speaker 8 You're talking about global stuff, whatever, n-national, nat-

2:38:55 Speaker 1 But even of individual stuff.

2:38:56 Speaker 8 No, but even individual stuff.

2:38:57 Speaker 1 Like, just like, like, like, uh, family planning. You know, some people, "Yeah, no, I, I wanna have children, of course. But what's wrong? I'm gonna have to spread out." You know, like all kinds of views like that. What do you mean? You don't know the Rebbe's view? It-

2:39:09 Speaker 8 Ma-many, many times the answer is no.

2:39:10 Speaker 1 That-

2:39:11 Speaker 8 They heard, they heard once about it, but they don't really know. It's not fresh. It's not something that they-

2:39:15 Speaker 1 Right. Gotta reprint it. Make another run in the-

2:39:18 Speaker 8 First of all, anyone can read it at index.behead.org. But

2:39:23 Speaker 1 Yeah, and also you sent it to me as a PDF. I share it, uh, with chasanim that I teach.

2:39:28 Speaker 8 You're still doing it?

2:39:29 Speaker 1 Still doing it.

2:39:29 Speaker 8 Very good.

2:39:30 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:39:31 Speaker 8 Okay. So I think this- Someone gave me an idea over the kinnis that, uh, maybe we should make like a, like take three people at any time there's like a major something happening in the news that pe-un-fortunately or unfortunately people know about, we should be able to right away present what the Rebbe says about it. So, I mean, I don't know.

2:39:52 Speaker 1 A think tank.

2:39:53 Speaker 8 A think tank, yeah. Uh, the other news, but the, the, the idea is-

2:39:56 Speaker 1 Not everything needs to be-

2:39:57 Speaker 8 The concept is good

2:39:58 Speaker 1 ... not everything needs to be official. Uh-

2:40:01 Speaker 8 No, the, the idea-

2:40:02 Speaker 1 Because, uh, uh, well, I'm all in nuance. Everybody can make a, a mistake.

2:40:07 Speaker 8 Mistake, right.

2:40:07 Speaker 1 And so it, it doesn't have a... 'Cause it puts a certain pressure. If you are making it official, "Ah, so, so, so they're the know-it-all. So the, uh, they represent the Rebbe's Shitah."

2:40:16 Speaker 8 Right.

2:40:16 Speaker 1 Uh, I don't know if that's such a great idea. But, but on a personal level, yeah. Ask somebody. He knows a bit more than you, and maybe he's answer from the Rebbe on it.

2:40:31 Speaker 8 Someone gave me a good, someone gave me a good dugme that on October 7th, on Simchas Torah, then Bey Bayem, it was very clear to everyone what the response. Every shliach around the world, the Rebbe was very clear what the response is. That's Ner Tanzen-

2:40:47 Speaker 1 Ner Tanzen

2:40:47 Speaker 8 ... you have to continue, whatever. Someone was telling me like there was no-

2:40:50 Speaker 1 I mean, that was in our blood.

2:40:51 Speaker 8 Right. There was no memo that went out from-

2:40:53 Speaker 1 Right

2:40:53 Speaker 8 ... headquarters. That, that's in the blood. Everyone knew right away, just being in the Kunet.

2:40:57 Speaker 1 I, I actually, afterwards, everybody came with the sikha from the Rebbe, the Yom Kippur war. I, I, I knew about that. So, so I actually by Hakafes already-

2:41:07 Speaker 8 You said that

2:41:07 Speaker 1 ... I, I told the, the Olam that, you know, I didn't hear anything about it till the bachar from the Ol came on Talucha to me.

2:41:15 Speaker 8 Right.

2:41:15 Speaker 1 My son and others that came on Talucha, and we didn't hear a word. They told us about this, and right away it put like a damper on everybody, like everybody found out, the whole Olam, and this, and so.

2:41:30 Speaker 8 But that's a good example of, of way-

2:41:32 Speaker 1 Right

2:41:32 Speaker 8 ... the way we should be approaching everything.

2:41:34 Speaker 1 E-everything.

2:41:34 Speaker 8 Yeah.

2:41:34 Speaker 1 If, if you have it in our bones already-

2:41:37 Speaker 8 We know it

2:41:37 Speaker 1 ... then we, we, we will react by default in the Mlemens cook, in the Mlemens gang.

2:41:43 Speaker 8 Mm-hmm.

2:41:44 Speaker 1 Emes.

2:41:45 Speaker 8 Okay.

2:41:45 Speaker 1 Very good.

2:41:46 Speaker 8 Thank you very much. And, uh,

2:41:54 Speaker 1 Yeah.

2:41:54 Speaker 8 Very good.

2:41:57 Speaker 1 And you should be mamshach and have hatlacha raba miflaga in your avodah hakodesh. I can't begin, certainly not end, in the shevachim and the praise for this whole mifal that the Rebbe, what's it bring to line in Chassidishe Heizer, a Pashet Chassidishe Rebbe. Chassi- Y- How many Chassidim grow up with the Chassidishe Rebbe from the Chassidishe Rebbe?

2:42:21 Speaker 8 Okay.

2:42:25 Speaker 1 L'chaim.

2:42:29 Speaker 8 Amen.