Episode 19: What Do I Have to Do with Chassidus?! | With Anat Harari, shlucha and lecturer on Tanya and Chassidus

00:00 Speaker 1 In honor of 19 Kislev, the Rosh Hashanah of Chassidus, I sat down with Anat Harari to understand how and why her life changed after Chassidus entered it. And what is the connection between lofty, sublime Torah teachings and each person’s everyday life? Come on, let’s roll the intro and begin. How can we turn our lives into lives of shlichus, full of meaning? I’m Chani Moskowitz, a shlucha in Kharkiv, Ukraine. In this podcast, we’ll meet different women who will share their shlichus in a variety of fields, and through it help each of us find and refine our own shlichus in the world. Because living the lives we were created to live is as good as it gets. Shlichus as a way of life. Let’s begin. Hello, Anat Harari.

00:52 Speaker 2 Good morning.

00:53 Speaker 1 My dear, I’ve pulled you away from your Friday cooking. Anat, in honor of 19 Kislev, we want to record a special podcast with questions the women themselves sent in. This time they wrote to tell us what to talk about.

01:09 Speaker 2 Let’s go.

01:10 Speaker 1 Yes, but before we get to the questions, I want you to introduce yourself, because we didn’t come all this way to you for nothing. So tell us a bit about yourself. How did you come to Chassidus in the first place?

01:20 Speaker 2 Yes. Okay, I’m Anat Harari. Nice to meet you.

01:24 Speaker 1 Nice to meet you.

01:25 Speaker 2 I came from about as far away as you can get, I think. Completely from the other side. When I was younger, I was an activist on the left. I worked for Peace Now.

01:41 Speaker 1 Wow.

01:41 Speaker 2 I was very active in Meretz, a member of its committee.

01:44 Speaker 1 In Meretz—and with plenty of meretz, energy.

01:46 Speaker 2 Meretz, exactly. Lots and lots of energy. I was a member of the Modiin City Council, also on behalf of Meretz. I was a coordinator of activities for the Am Chofshi organization in its campaign against religious coercion. In other words—

02:01 Speaker 1 The complete opposite end of the spectrum.

02:03 Speaker 2 The complete opposite. Yes, yes. What people today call “religionization”—we were already working on that back then. Nothing changes, by the way.

02:12 Speaker 1 Right.

02:12 Speaker 2 Not in the way people campaign, and not...

02:15 Speaker 1 There’s nothing new under the sun.

02:16 Speaker 2 Exactly. And I think the point is that when I say I was at the opposite end, I don’t necessarily mean those particular movements. Because the feeling behind them is a very Jewish feeling. We all want to make the world better.

02:35 Speaker 1 Yes.

02:35 Speaker 2 Everyone tries in their own way. But when I say I came from the opposite end, I mean my fundamental belief. Okay? My fundamental belief was me. Me. I’m a separate being. I need to focus on myself, develop myself, get ahead. A career, and so on. And when I was on the city council, the whole political side of things was entirely about me.

03:06 Speaker 1 Wow.

03:07 Speaker 2 And that’s why it’s so different, because the world of Chassidus is the opposite. It tells you that you truly blossom, shine, realize your potential to the fullest and touch the infinite when you focus less on yourself.

03:26 Speaker 1 Absolutely.

03:26 Speaker 2 When you step outside yourself.

03:28 Speaker 1 Wow. So it really was from one extreme to the other, just not in the way we thought. And how did you get here, to this place? Not just physically, but in general—from one extreme to the other.

03:38 Speaker 2 It’s a very long story. My husband, Yechiel Harari, may he live and be well, also reached a point somewhere in the middle of life. We were both caught up in the race all the time: one step forward, then another. He finished his doctorate and worked as an aide to a minister, then as a chief of staff, and as a journalist. He did so many things. And somewhere along the way, Tanya suddenly appeared in his life. His doctorate also dealt with messianism. He had studied all sorts of things, and then, as he was about to begin postdoctoral work, through his acquaintance with Yair Kalev, they had some project they wanted to do together, and he began learning Tanya.

04:33 Speaker 3 He took a peek, and it struck a chord.

04:34 Speaker 2 He took a peek, and it struck a chord. It was immediate. One day the man came home to me—I was the atheist, the progressive one—

04:44 Speaker 3 I really have a hard time imagining you like that.

04:46 Speaker 2 With a kippah on his head.

04:48 Speaker 3 Wow.

04:48 Speaker 2 Just like that, out of the blue. And that’s where it all began. For eight years we managed to remain what you might call a mixed-observance couple, because I enjoyed the teachings but refused to jump all the way in.

05:04 Speaker 3 That’s quite a change.

05:05 Speaker 2 The biggest difficulty, really, was... By then I understood Tanya; we were already learning Tanya. But I had a very, very hard time with the concept of bittul, self-nullification. Again, I was coming from the extreme end, from radical feminism—

05:21 Speaker 3 Yes.

05:21 Speaker 2 And all those places, with the suspicion that this world was trying to entice me with beautiful words, when its whole aim was to erase me. Erase me.

05:31 Speaker 3 I wasn’t going to get caught in the net.

05:33 Speaker 2 Exactly.

05:34 Speaker 3 Wow. So it took years because it really was a gradual process, peeling away the layers.

05:39 Speaker 2 Gradually. Eight years.

05:41 Speaker 3 That’s amazing.

05:42 Speaker 2 Truly gradual. But the teachings came into our lives from the very beginning. Before Yechiel even knew what was what or how to wash his hands ritually, he was already writing. Reading and writing. First articles, then booklets, then books. Right away.

05:57 Speaker 3 Wow.

05:58 Speaker 2 So the teachings—I didn’t have a choice. They simply came into our home and changed our home.

06:04 Speaker 3 So when you made the—

06:05 Speaker 2 And changed me.

06:06 Speaker 3 No, when you made the practical change, officially, let’s call it, you were already deeply involved.

06:12 Speaker 2 Completely.

06:13 Speaker 3 It wasn’t as though...

06:14 Speaker 2 Completely.

06:15 Speaker 3 You just needed that...

06:16 Speaker 2 Little push.

06:17 Speaker 3 Yes.

06:17 Speaker 2 Yes, yes.

06:18 Speaker 3 Wow.

06:18 Speaker 2 And I only had to change the outward things.

06:20 Speaker 3 How moving. So now you live there on shlichus.

06:25 Speaker 2 Yes, in Eliav, in eastern Lachish.

06:27 Speaker 3 Were you living there before, too?

06:28 Speaker 2 We came here... Yes, we took a long route. I was in Modiin. After Modiin we moved south and went through a few places before we got here, to Eliav. We were actually among the founders of this community. It’s a new community.

06:43 Speaker 3 Oh, wow.

06:44 Speaker 2 Yes.

06:44 Speaker 3 And now you’re building it in another way, spiritually.

06:48 Speaker 2 With Hashem’s help.

06:49 Speaker 3 Well, let’s move on to the questions, because this is really interesting. The first question I brought is a good one to open with. Someone asks: “I’m not a Chabad woman, and I probably won’t become one, but something about Chassidus draws me in. Tell me what I can bring from Chassidus into my everyday life without taking on the label of being Chabad. I’m not there, but I want to bring Chassidus into my daily life. How do I do that?” Of course, we could talk about this for two days. Let’s try to make it concise.

07:21 Speaker 2 Amazing. You know, a similar question actually came up at my daughter’s Chabad high school.

07:28 Speaker 3 Oh, interesting.

07:28 Speaker 2 There was a panel, and we had to answer questions from students who had acted them out and filmed them. It was lovely. This was one of the questions: “Okay, my parents chose the Chabad way. The community is a Chabad community. I go to a Chabad school, and I like it. Who says I have to follow that path?”

07:48 Speaker 3 Yes.

07:48 Speaker 2 And my answer was unequivocal: You don’t have to.

07:51 Speaker 3 Right.

07:51 Speaker 2 You don’t have to. Not only do you not have to—you have to choose—

07:56 Speaker 3 Exactly.

07:56 Speaker 2 Your own path.

07:58 Speaker 3 To understand what it means for you, regardless of the community or its customs.

08:02 Speaker 2 Exactly.

08:03 Speaker 3 What does it mean?

08:03 Speaker 2 Exactly, exactly. And what you take from it is what you take from it. And if you don’t, you don’t. I began by telling her: You are wanted, loved and wonderful just as you are, whether you choose this or choose something else. There are no conditions attached.

08:18 Speaker 3 So really, this is a question we all ask.

08:20 Speaker 2 And I think the Alter Rebbe answers it most beautifully. In chapter 13, if I’m not mistaken, he talks about a concept called “truth in its truest sense.” Truth in its truest sense. And he says: Dear soul, what’s asked of you is your whole truth, right where you are. Now, he isn’t saying there’s no single truth and everyone has their own truth. No, there is truth. But there are a thousand paths to that lofty, genuine, great, infinite truth, and each person has their own path. There are infinitely many levels, and each person, according to where they were placed to begin with, where they are now, and the path that suits them where they are today—that is their truth in its truest sense. That’s where they need to be, and that’s all. And there’s no room here for... He continues with this in chapter 30, in the chapter—

09:20 Speaker 3 Yes.

09:20 Speaker 2 There’s no room for superiority, no room for judgment, no room for criticism. What do you mean? What are you really asking? If you want a taste of Tanya, do you have to put on a sheitel? Come on.

09:34 Speaker 3 Right.

09:34 Speaker 2 No, no, no. And we have truly wonderful students who could practically sing it back to you—wake them up in the middle of the night and they could. But they’re still not even at a place of Torah and mitzvos. And that’s completely fine. What’s asked of each person, wherever they are, is their own hundred percent. That’s their truest truth.

10:03 Speaker 3 Beautiful.

10:03 Speaker 2 So I think there isn’t really... yes.

10:05 Speaker 3 Completely. And maybe we could talk about a few very basic principles of Chassidus that every woman can take into her life, as you said, at whatever point she’s at, wherever she is, just from this podcast. Although after this podcast, you all have to study Tanya.

10:21 Speaker 2 You have to.

10:22 Speaker 3 You can’t put Tanya into two sentences. You’d miss so much. But—

10:25 Speaker 2 There’s so much there. Really, it’s like—

10:27 Speaker 3 Each one is a whole chapter.

10:29 Speaker 2 Studying Tanya is simply a pleasure. And studying Tanya isn’t something where I studied it and that’s it. I also teach Tanya on Zoom, and we’re finishing this week. We’re finishing.

10:39 Speaker 3 Wow.

10:40 Speaker 2 Yes, yes. Chapter 53, thank Hashem. And we’re starting again right away.

10:46 Speaker 3 Right.

10:46 Speaker 2 It never ends. And not only does it never end, there are always more layers, more depth, more understanding. And then there’s the place I’m at, which makes me absorb it completely differently.

10:58 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

10:59 Speaker 2 There’s no end to Tanya.

11:00 Speaker 3 Even when you’ve studied something, you studied it a year ago. You need to study it again. You need to remind yourself; you need to live it. That’s our nature. What can you do?

11:09 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

11:09 Speaker 3 We go back to the real world and...

11:11 Speaker 2 What do you mean, “go back”? The Alter Rebbe says that too.

11:14 Speaker 3 Yes.

11:14 Speaker 2 It’s as strong as it was from birth.

11:16 Speaker 3 At the end of the day, we’re an animal.

11:17 Speaker 2 Our animal is right there. And to really keep elevating ourselves, it’s easier when we’re constantly learning. Then we can deal with what’s happening now through reason and understanding. But she’s really asking what she can take away from this.

11:35 Speaker 3 Yes.

11:36 Speaker 2 I’d start with a picture of how we’re put together. Okay, how am I built? Two souls. I’m not defective. If my emotions keep trying to run me—emotions that pull me down, take me into anxiety, into gloom and depression, into stress; I can’t focus, I can’t build a normal relationship, I’m always getting angry at my children instead of... That’s okay. That’s okay.

12:04 Speaker 3 We were all created that way.

12:05 Speaker 2 It’s okay—that’s the animal. But alongside it, we’ve also been given a G-dly soul that can lift us above all that and let us see things differently. So understand that, okay? How are we built? Just understand the structure. Chochmah, Binah, Daas—Daas. You studied it? You understood it? Make it your own. Bring it down into your life. When you manage, in the moment, to recognize that you’re in a situation where you need to choose—and that’s all the time, right? The world sends us challenges every second. Now I can choose. I choose where I stand. Okay? I think that’s the power.

12:54 Speaker 3 It’s amazing, because when you really live with it, it changes your life. It’s relevant all the time. It’s just amazing.

13:01 Speaker 2 Of course. Where it took me from, and where it took me to—life-changing? Yes.

13:05 Speaker 3 Yes. That’s really the first chapters of Tanya. Everyone who studies them says, “Where have I been until now? How did I not know this?” These days, people go to psychologists. Why? To get to know themselves and understand how to manage themselves better. And here’s the foundation for every Jew to do just that. That’s why the Alter Rebbe wrote Tanya for us.

13:25 Speaker 2 Exactly.

13:26 Speaker 3 To get to know ourselves.

13:26 Speaker 2 My husband Yechezkel gives classes all the time. He has a daily YouTube channel and so on, and it turns out he has many, many students in the therapeutic professions—religious and nonreligious.

13:40 Speaker 3 Because it’s—wow—it connects so well...

13:42 Speaker 2 Completely, completely. We gave a lecture in Yavne two days ago, and a clinical psychologist came up to us—someone seriously involved in several methods—and said he was hooked.

13:55 Speaker 3 Right.

13:56 Speaker 2 Yes.

13:56 Speaker 3 Often, when you go deeply into a field—I remember reading a book about NLP, and you read it and think, “Wow, Chassidus taught this so much earlier.” It’s like...

14:03 Speaker 2 I studied CBT. I studied LI-CBT, and you know, it’s a year-and-a-half course, an internship, all the research... And then a chapter and a half of Tanya, around chapter 27 and on, and there it is.

14:19 Speaker 3 It all comes down to that.

14:20 Speaker 2 Exactly. Exactly.

14:22 Speaker 3 Really.

14:22 Speaker 2 It’s all there.

14:23 Speaker 3 Wow. Okay, let’s move on to the next question. Someone asks: What makes a person a chossid? In other words, explain to me the difference between someone who isn’t a chossid and someone who is. But I’ll add my own clarification: not what they wear, not how they’re defined from the outside, but what a chossid really is. When I say someone is a chossid—

14:47 Speaker 2 Mm-hmm.

14:47 Speaker 3 What’s different about them from anyone else? What has Chassidus added to them?

14:50 Speaker 2 Yes. There’s a saying attributed to the Rebbe: “My chossid is anyone who tries today to be a little better than yesterday.”

14:57 Speaker 3 Right. Which is...

14:59 Speaker 2 Yes, and that really captures the whole thing. Being aware, making choices, and studying Chassidus. And that brings us back to the question of... yes.

15:11 Speaker 3 Yes, it’s very connected.

15:12 Speaker 2 Of outward appearance, which I truly think is unimportant. Really. It has no significance.

15:20 Speaker 3 Right.

15:21 Speaker 2 It has no significance. And I think the Rebbeim said this repeatedly: “Who is my chossid? Someone who studies my teachings.”

15:26 Speaker 3 Right. The Rebbe Maharash spoke about who is a chossid, what befits a chossid and what doesn’t. Really, it’s all the inner things—ultimately living out the essence of Tanya too, including what it says about Ahavas Yisroel and all those things, inwardly.

15:43 Speaker 2 Right, right.

15:44 Speaker 3 Putting all of it into practice—

15:45 Speaker 2 Tanya is the foundation, and then all the Rebbeim keep expanding on it, more and more and more.

15:51 Speaker 3 Yes.

15:52 Speaker 2 Every Shabbos, we have a group of women studying here. Every Shabbos we study a sicha of the Rebbe.

15:58 Speaker 3 From the community.

15:58 Speaker 2 From the community. These women didn’t have a connection to the Rebbe, but now they won’t give it up. If I go away, I have to leave them the class...

16:07 Speaker 3 How amazing.

16:08 Speaker 2 Yes, yes, yes.

16:10 Speaker 3 So they’re studying a sicha of the Rebbe.

16:12 Speaker 2 Every week, and they insist on it. These are women who clearly don’t look like Chabad women in any way, shape or form.

16:21 Speaker 3 Wow. And there’s always a practical lesson there, so they have no choice but to be better than they were yesterday.

16:26 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

16:28 Speaker 3 It’s amazing. I think it really is a little addictive. The feeling is so special. You read something and say, “Wow, where have I been until now?” It’s like I’ve discovered...

16:39 Speaker 2 It’s something else. It’s something else. There’s pleasure in it.

16:42 Speaker 3 Yes.

16:43 Speaker 2 There’s pleasure in it. You come away with a certain sweetness.

16:46 Speaker 3 Absolutely.

16:48 Speaker 2 And that’s so important, because pleasure is what drives us. Pleasure. If I go back to how we’re built: Kesser. Pleasure activates desire, and desire turns all the powers of the soul in the direction it wants. When I choose my pleasures and choose higher pleasures, that saves me from all the problematic pleasures that take me to bad places.

17:19 Speaker 3 Absolutely. We take pleasure in the right thing.

17:21 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

17:21 Speaker 3 And it makes us—

17:22 Speaker 2 It’s real pleasure.

17:23 Speaker 3 Yes.

17:23 Speaker 2 Because it isn’t fleeting pleasure, or pleasure that fades. It isn’t like enjoying that incredible mousse cake and hating myself the next day.

17:34 Speaker 3 Yes.

17:34 Speaker 2 No.

17:36 Speaker 3 Okay. Following up on that question, the same woman asked: What is a chossid’s life’s aspiration? I have an answer in mind, but I’ll leave it to you.

17:48 Speaker 2 There are many answers.

17:49 Speaker 3 Yes.

17:49 Speaker 2 There are many answers, but let’s try to bring it down to our practical lives. A chossid’s life’s aspiration is to be in that place, the place where... Yes, he speaks about this too. He speaks about “love with delights,” and he calls it a “free gift.” Okay? It’s like—

18:12 Speaker 3 Right.

18:12 Speaker 2 But it isn’t really free. It comes when you work—

18:16 Speaker 3 I think “free” means that it’s close to you—that anyone can reach it.

18:21 Speaker 2 Anyone can reach it.

18:22 Speaker 3 But absolutely through effort and sweat.

18:24 Speaker 2 Exactly. With effort, with sweat, with awareness, with work. But that place where I really have a Geulah mindset, where I truly delight in my reality without any need to change or fix it—I can delight in my child without wanting to fix him, without wanting, “If only he would be this way or that way.” No. Just as he is, somehow. To delight in reality, in life, in my husband. Love with delight. That’s something you’re given for a moment. It’s an immense pleasure, and it really is bound up with a lifetime of work, a lifetime of work.

19:08 Speaker 3 Right, because reaching that—even though it sounds like one little moment—takes inner work. It actually appears in the later chapters of Tanya.

19:17 Speaker 2 Right.

19:18 Speaker 3 So it’s part of the very, very long road we have to travel.

19:21 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

19:22 Speaker 3 Yes, maybe we should briefly say here that, actually—

19:24 Speaker 2 But again, I mean, the name for it is a Geulah mindset.

19:27 Speaker 3 Yes.

19:27 Speaker 2 Reaching a Geulah mindset, because when we all have a Geulah mindset, we’re in the Geulah.

19:33 Speaker 3 Yes. So, naturally. All right, so that’s the aspiration of a chossid’s life. In one respect.

19:38 Speaker 2 In one respect.

19:39 Speaker 3 One of the respects.

19:40 Speaker 2 A small one. Oh, the aspiration of a chossid’s soul—come on.

19:43 Speaker 3 Yes. Listen, ultimately, our aspiration is to be beinonim. We’re on our way there all the time.

19:49 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

19:51 Speaker 3 All right.

19:51 Speaker 2 Absolutely. That’s a beinoni who’s already, yes, received—

19:54 Speaker 3 Yes.

19:54 Speaker 2 What you might call a medal from—

19:56 Speaker 3 From the highly accomplished ones. All right.

19:59 Speaker 2 Definitely.

20:00 Speaker 3 An interesting question.

20:01 Speaker 2 Mm-hmm.

20:02 Speaker 3 What’s the difference in Chassidus between women and men?

20:06 Speaker 2 Mm, nice. Good question.

20:08 Speaker 3 Yes.

20:09 Speaker 2 As I said, this was one of my very serious barriers. Why did it take me eight years to join—to really join? This issue, this fear. And not only—

20:25 Speaker 3 The fear, basically, that there’s chauvinism in religion.

20:27 Speaker 2 Exactly. Not only in Chassidus. I mean, the great suspicion about religion and women, the supposedly very limited place left for me, hiding me, excluding me, all of that.

20:45 Speaker 3 It’s a real fear.

20:46 Speaker 2 It’s a real fear. I really believed it. Yes, and now, if I joined, they’d probably just push me into the kitchen.

20:52 Speaker 3 Yes, to willingly put yourself in that position of—

20:54 Speaker 2 And that’s it, I’d be unimportant, and—like, I couldn’t make progress. Where would that leave me stuck? Where would it put me? What am I? Excuse me, is someone worth more than I am? Excuse me. That’s what they mean, isn’t it? They’re pulling one over on me. All of it together. And the truth is, even before this was completely settled in my mind, I did take the leap in, for another reason, for other reasons, beyond reason and understanding. I joined because I understood that this was what my son needed—that his mother would be there with him too.

21:30 Speaker 3 Okay.

21:32 Speaker 2 And I said, okay, I know this is the direction. I have questions, and I’m leaving them there. I don’t have answers to these questions. And then I came as a guest to the Kinus Hashluchos.

21:45 Speaker 3 The international one.

21:46 Speaker 2 The international one.

21:47 Speaker 3 Oh, it’s an incredible event. It’s a connection.

21:49 Speaker 2 It was incredible, incredible. And this was just when he had begun to reveal the Rebbe’s secret, and they told him, “There’s a Kinus Hashluchos. Come.” He said, “Why would I come?” So they said, “Then send your wife.” He said, “All right, my wife is like myself.” I went to the kinus. I was—

22:07 Speaker 3 When was this, roughly? How many years ago?

22:08 Speaker 2 2013, I think. Yes.

22:11 Speaker 3 Exactly ten years.

22:13 Speaker 2 And I’d been wearing a sheitel for maybe two months. I mean, it was—

22:17 Speaker 3 Wow.

22:19 Speaker 2 All new and fresh. I wasn’t fully there yet. I was at the “we will do and we will hear” stage. And I got there, still carrying that suspicion, and oh my goodness. I mean, I saw thousands of empowered, strong, amazing, interesting, fascinating, articulate women around me. Every conversation there. Okay, where was it? And I was just—

22:51 Speaker 3 As though you felt uncomfortable even about what you’d thought before.

22:54 Speaker 2 Embarrassed. I felt uncomfortable about my feminist speeches. What had I been going on about? This was the real thing. This was the real thing. I mean, as far as the Rebbe was concerned—and he insisted on it—there is a shliach and there is a shlucha. She isn’t “the wife of.”

23:12 Speaker 3 Yes.

23:12 Speaker 2 A shlucha. She has her own role and was given her own place, and he insisted that she have her own kinus too. There is a shlucha, with her own distinct standing, and he empowered women. I began listening to the Rebbe’s sichos about women. I said, I thought I’d read all that nonsense—genuine nonsense, really—because there’s no truth in it. There’s no truth in it. Because I came and saw sisterhood. Why? Because each woman steps beyond herself. There might be a little jealousy here and there, but each one steps beyond herself and knows that we’re all here as shluchos of the same—yes.

23:55 Speaker 3 For the same purpose.

23:56 Speaker 2 The same purpose and the same shlichus. So when she succeeds greatly, that’s my success too.

24:02 Speaker 3 That’s how you feel.

24:03 Speaker 2 It’s a sisterhood like no other. And I stood on stages and spoke about sisterhood. But when we came down from the stage, we tore each other apart. She took my credit. I didn’t get enough recognition, enough respect. Where was it? Where was it? There can’t be real sisterhood among women when the animal soul is in the middle, when ego is in control. There can’t be. It simply doesn’t work. There are wonderful sichos of the Rebbe about this. It simply doesn’t work. Sisterhood can come only from understanding that I’m here with a role, on a shlichus; that it isn’t about me, about the separate self within me; that the very feeling of a separate self within me is a kind of illusion. It isn’t real, it isn’t real. The truth is that everything is a simple unity. That’s the truth. It’s hard to live with that awareness all the time. But every moment I step beyond myself, I’m truly connected. And when I felt that connection and that embrace, it was a feeling I’d never felt before. And I also realized—when it finally clicked in my head—what I’d actually been afraid of. As though joining was what I wanted. That was it. What do you mean? It changes your life.

25:20 Speaker 3 You know, as a girl growing up—I grew up in a Chabad House and in Chabad schools. I didn’t know feminism; I grew up with those sichos of the Rebbe about women, about women. And I remember saying excitedly to a friend one day, “Why do they keep empowering us so much? Everything’s fine, you know?” I didn’t understand what it was a response to. I mean, yes, I’m a woman and I have strength. So why is the Rebbe making such a point of empowering us? Because the Rebbe talks about the feminist movement, but I hadn’t heard of it yet. So I was like, yes, I’m fine. Why do I need to be empowered? That’s why.

25:56 Speaker 2 Boruch Hashem.

25:57 Speaker 3 It’s amazing.

25:57 Speaker 2 What, that girls grow up with that awareness?

26:01 Speaker 3 Really.

26:02 Speaker 2 Without needing to fight for it. That fight takes a toll.

26:07 Speaker 3 Right. Feminism basically comes along and says, “We want to be like men,” and “What are we missing all the time? What aren’t they giving us? What don’t we have?” And that really brings you down, too. And the Rebbe says, no. You were created with a role, and come see what you can do. It’s amazing. Now, at the Kinus Hashluchim, you saw—

26:25 Speaker 2 Who wants to be—

26:26 Speaker 3 Yes, I mean, what does that have to do with anything? George Or[?] spoke and said, “I want to say, in two words, what the great force behind the entire shlichus enterprise is.” And then he said, “Di shluchos,” and all the men stood up and applauded. It really was a moving moment, because we understand it. We understand it.

26:45 Speaker 2 I want to tell you that I saw it even earlier. Chayil was already deeply involved, and every so often we’d go somewhere for Shabbos or be guests in someone’s home. I’d look on from the outside, and every family we visited would leave me amazed by how beautiful it was—the marriage and the mutual respect. And I’d say, okay, that’s just them.

27:11 Speaker 3 Right.

27:11 Speaker 2 Okay, that’s just them. Okay, that’s just them. And them. Then I realized: this is how they teach the boys, how they raise them.

27:23 Speaker 3 Right.

27:24 Speaker 2 To be that way. And it’s really beautiful. You know, in the secular feminism I come from, people often say, “Don’t warn the girls; educate the boys.” Okay, so here they do it without slogans. They just do it.

27:39 Speaker 3 Yes.

27:39 Speaker 2 They just do it.

27:40 Speaker 3 Because you grow up to be like what you see. So naturally.

27:43 Speaker 2 Like what you see, yes, and these are also messages that sink in, messages you absorb. I mean, what does a Tamim do all day? He learns sichos all day. He learns.

27:51 Speaker 3 Every so often, you get a sicha like that too.

27:53 Speaker 2 All the time.

27:54 Speaker 3 Really.

27:55 Speaker 2 Boruch Hashem.

27:56 Speaker 3 Wow. All right, let’s get to the reason we’ve gathered: 19 Kislev. By the way, this is also episode nineteen—19. There you go. Speaking of hashgacha pratis, what’s special about 19 Kislev? Let me spell it out, because several questions came in about 19 Kislev. First of all, what is it? Why do you get so excited about 19 Kislev? What, the Rosh Hashanah of Chassidus? Aren’t you getting a little carried away?

28:23 Speaker 2 Every time someone gets out of prison.

28:23 Speaker 3 Yes.

28:23 Speaker 2 Every time one of yours gets out of prison. Yes.

28:25 Speaker 3 Yes, and maybe also, like, your Rebbe was in prison, so what are you—

28:30 Speaker 2 Not that kind of honor.

28:30 Speaker 3 Right. Putting it on billboards and spreading it around. And calling a date in the year “Rosh Hashanah for Chassidus”—claiming it as our own. Explain to me what’s so special about this day that it justifies all the fuss you mentioned earlier.

28:52 Speaker 2 That’s pretty audacious.

28:54 Speaker 3 Yes.

28:54 Speaker 2 Of the Chabadniks.

28:55 Speaker 3 I’d add that it’s also Simchas Torah. It’s not just Rosh Hashanah, because we finish the Tanya and begin it again.

29:00 Speaker 2 Really.

29:01 Speaker 3 So it’s all the holidays together. It really is the festival of festivals. And the Alter Rebbe himself said, “Whoever rejoices in my joy, I will bring him from constriction to expansiveness.” So explain to me: what’s so special about this day? What’s the big deal? Though after talking about how Chassidus changes our lives, you can understand the big deal if this is the day that brought Chassidus into the world. But still, let’s start at the beginning.

29:30 Speaker 2 Yes, so—

29:31 Speaker 3 Many years back.

29:32 Speaker 2 A historical explanation.

29:34 Speaker 3 Yes.

29:34 Speaker 2 This was the position the Alter Rebbe was in. It really wasn’t a given that he was allowed to deal with this material. The whole Tanya—and he says this again and again—he didn’t invent anything new. He shines a spotlight on the Jewish bookshelf and brings out a great deal of Kabbalah. The Zohar is there, and he brings out and illuminates parts that had deliberately been kept hidden. There was a reason not everyone knew them. This was not long after Shabsai Tzvi. Anyone who remembers or knows—

30:18 Speaker 3 A crisis.

30:19 Speaker 2 A crisis that truly shook Judaism. And this looked as though it might develop into another one. There was a tremendous struggle. And as for the other side, let’s judge the opponents favorably here: they had reason to worry.

30:39 Speaker 3 Yes.

30:40 Speaker 2 They had grounds for their opposition.

30:41 Speaker 3 It looked suspicious.

30:43 Speaker 2 Absolutely. And when the Alter Rebbe was arrested, it was because opponents had informed on him. In a very, very—an interesting personal letter, which still exists, by the way—they explained their reasons for saying that Chassidus was not Judaism.

31:09 Speaker 3 Wow.

31:10 Speaker 2 Why wasn’t Chassidus Judaism? They gave quite a few reasons. It’s funny—just as an aside, the first was that Chassidus puts so much emphasis on joy. Excuse me, that’s not Judaism. Why should we be happy? We’re in exile.

31:23 Speaker 3 It’s amazing how obvious that seems today. But back then it must really have been revolutionary.

31:28 Speaker 2 It truly was revolutionary. Now, the issue was that in Russia, recognized religions were allowed to operate, but it was forbidden to establish a new religion. That’s what he was arrested for—supposedly establishing a new religion. And when he was arrested, he himself asked, as he said, “Princes have pursued me without cause, but my heart stands in awe of Your word.” He himself wondered: Wait, perhaps—who gave me permission? Maybe I really am going too far, taking the deepest secrets of the Torah and spreading them around. Who gave me permission? He asked himself that. When the Alter Rebbe was imprisoned, he had reason to be concerned. And he said, “Princes have pursued me without cause, but my heart stands in awe of Your word.” I’m not really worried about those people, but “my heart stands in awe of Your word.” Perhaps I really have done something I wasn’t allowed to do. Who gave me permission? Perhaps I shouldn’t be doing what I’m doing: taking the deepest secrets of the Torah and putting them into clear language. Maybe I wasn’t allowed to do that. His release was, in effect, a seal of approval from Heaven for spreading the teachings of Chassidus. And that’s when he truly began.

33:08 Speaker 4 Once there was approval—

33:09 Speaker 2 Once there was approval, approval from Heaven—

33:11 Speaker 4 A green light.

33:11 Speaker 2 Approval from Heaven, essentially. And there are various—

33:13 Speaker 4 Yes.

33:13 Speaker 2 Chassidic stories about the dream and so on. The parable people tell is about the king’s son. The great king’s crown was the symbol of his sovereignty and rule. No one was allowed to touch it; people would be put to death for touching his crown. Then the king’s son became terribly ill, and no remedy could be found. A wise man came and said, “He will die unless you crush the precious stone in the king’s crown and give him a little of it to drink.” There was no question. Yes, it was the symbol of sovereignty, but the king’s son was ill. So they took the stone from the crown, crushed it and gave it to him. And the parable goes further: perhaps he wouldn’t even be able to swallow it. But for the chance that he might, they did it. So our generation is ill, ill. We don’t have to look far to see that our generation is ill.

34:21 Speaker 4 Yes.

34:22 Speaker 2 Look at the statistics. Do you know how many medications are sold for stress, depression and anxiety?

34:30 Speaker 4 When we say “ill,” we even mean clinically ill. Absolutely.

34:33 Speaker 2 Truly. Because it’s so easy to go from letting my emotions run me just a little to clinical anxiety.

34:45 Speaker 4 Right.

34:46 Speaker 2 From being a little too dependent on what people think of me all the way to clinical depression. Absolutely. And here there’s a remedy that’s so accessible, and it truly addresses everything. At the beginning of the book, he says it contains all the answers to all the questions. We read the book from beginning to end and don’t see a single question or answer, but it simply lifts us to a place where the questions we had—

35:16 Speaker 4 Yes, because it isn’t written as questions and answers. But the answers really are there, to every question.

35:21 Speaker 2 Exactly. It lifts your spirits. You’re in a different place because you learn Chassidus, because you learn Tanya. Being engaged in it steadily brings you somewhere else, thank Hashem.

35:35 Speaker 4 Wow. So there’s something to celebrate.

35:38 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

35:40 Speaker 4 The Alter Rebbe came and changed our whole understanding of the soul, for the entire Jewish people.

35:47 Speaker 2 Our understanding of the soul.

35:48 Speaker 4 Yes.

35:48 Speaker 2 And our ability to refine ourselves. We came into the world to refine the nature of our character traits. So if he gives us the tools, wouldn’t we take them?

35:58 Speaker 4 An instruction manual.

35:59 Speaker 2 The clearest instruction manual there is. And when he says, “I will bring him to expansiveness”—right?

36:05 Speaker 4 From constriction—

36:06 Speaker 2 From constriction to expansiveness. Exactly. What is constriction? I am the constriction. My limited self, because I am limited. My limited self is the constriction. When I’m completely preoccupied with myself, when I’m completely shackled—what am I shackled by? By my emotional challenges. That’s constriction. And then to leave it for expansiveness. What does “I will bring him out” mean? I—

36:38 Speaker 4 Liberation.

36:38 Speaker 2 Yes. He teaches, step by step, how to get out of that place. And there I am in an expansive place. What does that mean? I can touch the Infinite, because He is right here beside me. Everything is within reach.

36:49 Speaker 4 “For it is very near to you.”

36:50 Speaker 2 Ultimately, it’s a choice.

36:51 Speaker 4 Right.

36:51 Speaker 2 “For it is very near to you.”

36:53 Speaker 4 Wow, it’s amazing. It’s also amazing to think about how the Tanya came about. The Alter Rebbe tells us in the introduction that at first people came to him for yechidus with difficult questions, and he began answering them. Then he started writing the answers down, and people began copying them. Even then, that was something new. People thought, “Wow, this is so compelling. We want to copy it for ourselves too.” And we’re talking about copying it with a—

37:13 Speaker 2 Yes, yes.

37:14 Speaker 4 I’m almost tempted to say a quill and inkwell. Eventually it became a book, and even then, for five years, copying it was forbidden so that errors wouldn’t creep in. And today it’s on YouTube, with endless copies, endless interpretations and—

37:32 Speaker 2 Endless classes.

37:33 Speaker 4 You’re one click away from the Tanya.

37:36 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

37:37 Speaker 4 It’s amazing. There’s really no good excuse for me not to learn Tanya. So let’s say, in closing, to everyone who has listened to us: Tanya is what will change your life.

37:52 Speaker 2 Absolutely. It won’t just change your life; it will change you.

37:55 Speaker 4 Yes.

37:56 Speaker 2 And the way you look at life, and consequently the life around you.

37:59 Speaker 4 Yes. And when you change yourself and the life around you, you’ll change the whole world.

38:03 Speaker 2 Absolutely.

38:04 Speaker 4 May we succeed in the test—the test of putting it into practice.

38:07 Speaker 2 “And He placed the world in their hearts.”

38:08 Speaker 4 Absolutely. Thank you so much, Anat.

38:10 Speaker 2 Thank you.

38:11 Speaker 4 And may we have a gut Yom Tov.

38:12 Speaker 2 Gut Yom Tov.

38:13 Speaker 4 Happy holiday. Goodbye.